• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!
  • Welcome to our archives. No new posts are allowed here.

Now here is a movement I can get behind

do wonder if we should let more citizens of this nation be eligible to run

We're not talking about US citizens. Clearly one of the eligibility requirements to run for US President is for one to be a NATURAL-BORN citizen of the USA.

You're saying we should eliminate eligibility requirements. Universities/Colleges are training for the real world, thus that is a sensible parallel.



but no should abolish religious requirements for public office and for school clubs though

Not when the club is supposed to be a religious club.

Everyone has the right to choose. Exercise your rights.
 
Last edited:
Not when the club is supposed to be a religious club. Everyone has the right to choose.

true and when religious discrimination is no longer a thing with that club then every one will have that right
 
yet the club lets any one in maybe you guys are just fasnaitng

what mischief have they caused in the religious clubs that don't discriminate?

???

I don't understand what you mean.
 
that's just fine but apparently if you want official standing with the Scholl you cant discarnate against other students who want to join if they want christen officers they need to vote for them

The Varsity has always been approved - until now. Need we wonder why?

That school should get its act together and re-write that senseless policy. Obviously, there are exemptions, such as the case mentioned. They should do as Ohio did.

Ohio State University rewrote its student organization registration guidelines to read, “A student organization formed to foster or affirm the sincerely held religious beliefs of its members may adopt eligibility criteria for its Student Officers that are consistent with those beliefs.”


Furthermore, here's where the problem lies: their policy is outdated!


He noted the school’s policy dates to 1972 and is mandated by state law.


1972! We've come a long way since then. There is more to consider now! Like this one....

His or Hers? Transgender child locked in school bathroom debate

Read more: http://www.ctvnews.ca/world/his-or-...chool-bathroom-debate-1.1175312#ixzz3F61lRBgN


Time for them to catch up to the 21st century, folks.
I think they should start using simple common sense. That's the simple solution to this.
Unless the Varsity had used false representation to attract would-be-candidates for leadership....then abide by its eligibility requirement.

After all I think it's safe to assume that all College Students understand what "CHRISTIAN" means. I hope they didn't think it referred to Slater - as in a fan club for Christian Slater. :lol:




I'm sure a homosexual-couple club will be up in arms if heterosexual couples demand to be let in, and have a heterosexual eligible for leadership!

Or a heterosexual woman demand to be eligible to participate in gay beauty pageants!

Or Christians be allowed to participate and speak in Atheist/Humanist Clubs....and be eligible to run for its leadership.
 
Last edited:
Denying accreditation to a private business is not religious persecution. It falls under public accommodation laws which apply to everyone equally. This was also NOT the US and not the big bad atheists.

You're not persecuted.



LOL. Let's click on the link and take a look at the first few stories:

- "U.N. Security Council to Consider Resolution to Remove Jews from Key Parts of the Holy Land?" => A Palestinian resolution against Israeli Jews.
- "IRS Cover-Up: IG Report Exposes IRS Lying to American Public" => The IRS scandal? Really? That's not christian persecution.
- "Unity in Prayer: The Church Gathers to Pray for Saeed and the Persecuted Church" => An Iranian pastor is imprisoned by Iran, a theocracy.

So you haven't given any examples as to how American christians are persecuted, especially by the big bad atheists. You have however given an example as to why we shouldn't be a theocracy.



Ok buddy, sorry, the bible will not be replacing our constitution and Jesus will not be our president. Keep your religion to yourself.


This ain't the Soviet Union. I'll exercise my first amendment rights as I see fit. Keep your atheism to yourself.
 
I thought lying was a sin.

This has nothing to do with atheists being leaders of the Christian group. The Christian group exists and can remain to exist with whatever rules and restrictions they care to apply to its members and/or leadership.

They wish to have formal recognition from a group of colleges though. That group of colleges can also apply rules and restrictions to its members. One of those involves signing a non-discriminatory agreement. The leaders of the Christian group refuse to sign that agreement because it includes not discriminating on grounds of sexual orientation.

The Christian group (and this one alone) is demanding an exemption from the rules of the group of colleges on this basis.


Those policies by Colleges is outdated! Refer to post #29.
 
Denying accreditation to a private business is not religious persecution. It falls under public accommodation laws which apply to everyone equally. This was also NOT the US and not the big bad atheists.

You're not persecuted.



The more so if it's a private business!

Suppressing religious freedom is a form of persecution. What more when the continuous attempt to suppress goes against a supreme court ruling.

It is clearly persecution.
 
???

I don't understand what you mean.

Other religiously oriented student groups have signed nondiscrimination policies where required, including Jewish, Catholic, mainline Protestant and Muslim groups. Hillel, the largest Jewish student organization, reports some local chapters have elected non-Jews to some posts.


so where is your examples of this

You have to question his state of mind.....or his motive is to cause mischief. Why should he be taken seriously?
 
We're not talking about US citizens. Clearly one of the eligibility requirements to run for US President is for one to be a NATURAL-BORN citizen of the USA.

You're saying we should eliminate eligibility requirements. Universities/Colleges are training for the real world, thus that is a sensible parallel.





Not when the club is supposed to be a religious club.

Everyone has the right to choose. Exercise your rights.

and im not sure its right to exclude people that were not born citizens with out exception

we should eliminate some eligibility requirements this is 1 of them you cant always discmrinted against people because you want to in the real world so this is fine training
 
Those policies by Colleges is outdated! Refer to post #29.
That wasn't my point. You misrepresented the dispute to suggest it was about forcing the Christian group to have atheist leaders.

The validity of the colleges' policy is a different question, one that can't be addressed without a clear and honest understanding of what that policy actually was and what the dispute actually consisted of.

Of course, there is the wider question of how it is relevant to the wider topic of the thread anyway as there is no indication of any atheists being involved at all.
 
The Varsity has always been approved - until now. Need we wonder why?

That school should get its act together and re-write that senseless policy. Obviously, there are exemptions, such as the case mentioned. They should do as Ohio did.

Ohio State University rewrote its student organization registration guidelines to read, “A student organization formed to foster or affirm the sincerely held religious beliefs of its members may adopt eligibility criteria for its Student Officers that are consistent with those beliefs.”


Furthermore, here's where the problem lies: their policy is outdated!


He noted the school’s policy dates to 1972 and is mandated by state law.


1972! We've come a long way since then. There is more to consider now! Like this one....

His or Hers? Transgender child locked in school bathroom debate

Read more: His or Hers? Transgender child locked in school bathroom debate | CTV News


Time for them to catch up to the 21st century, folks.
I think they should start using simple common sense. That's the simple solution to this.
Unless the Varsity had used false representation to attract would-be-candidates for leadership....then abide by its eligibility requirement.

After all I think it's safe to assume that all College Students understand what "CHRISTIAN" means. I hope they didn't think it referred to Slater - as in a fan club for Christian Slater. :lol:




I'm sure a homosexual-couple club will be up in arms if heterosexual couples demand to be let in, and have a heterosexual eligible for leadership!

Or a heterosexual woman demand to be eligible to participate in gay beauty pageants!

Or Christians be allowed to participate and speak in Atheist/Humanist Clubs....and be eligible to run for its leadership.

no need to support gropes that discriminate against other students the Ohio university was wrong
 
Other religiously oriented student groups have signed nondiscrimination policies where required, including Jewish, Catholic, mainline Protestant and Muslim groups. Hillel, the largest Jewish student organization, reports some local chapters have elected non-Jews to some posts.

So what? If they decide to capitulate, that's their decision.

Furthermore, I don't know anything about these religious groups mentioned, or their doctrines. There are liberal Christians and Jews - those who'd accept abortion, gay marriage etc..,



so where is your examples of this

You have to question his state of mind....or his motive is to cause mischief. Why should he be taken seriously?

Why do you think an atheist would want to actively join and run for leadership in the Varsity? Unless he's on his way to conversion (which is the only thing I could think of).....

There are militants who exploit the madness for political correctness.
 
So what? If they decide to capitulate, that's their decision.

Furthermore, I don't know anything about these religious groups mentioned, or their doctrines. There are liberal Christians and Jews - those who'd accept abortion, gay marriage etc..,





Why do you think an atheist would want to actively join and run for leadership in the Varsity? Unless he's on his way to conversion (which is the only thing I could think of).....

There are militants who exploit the madness for political correctness.

so your theory that people are joining to try and undermine these organizations doesn't seem to hold up and your apparently just bad mouthing people in order to try and get support for what you have to say

don't leave out Catholics and Muslims
 
That wasn't my point. You misrepresented the dispute to suggest it was about forcing the Christian group to have atheist leaders.

The validity of the colleges' policy is a different question, one that can't be addressed without a clear and honest understanding of what that policy actually was and what the dispute actually consisted of.

Of course, there is the wider question of how it is relevant to the wider topic of the thread anyway as there is no indication of any atheists being involved at all.

Sorry for the confusion. I'd read an article sometime ago that did mention leadership.



A newly enforced nondiscrimination policy issued by the California State University system that requires InterVarsity Christian Fellowship to allow non-Christians to be chapter leaders has forced the nationwide organization to develop a new style of campus ministry, IVCF officials said Tuesday.

InterVarsity explained that it has always required chapter leaders to agree to its Doctrinal Basis, a summary of basic, historic Christian beliefs.

"While InterVarsity invites and welcomes all students as participants, we believe a Christian group should have the right to expect and even require their leaders to be Christian — just as any student group, club or Greek organization should be able to require their leaders to be like-minded," IVCF said.


InterVarsity Christian Fellowship Forced to 'Reinvent' College Campus Ministry Due to CSU Non-Discrimination Policy



Participation is open to all. The issue is about LEADERSHIP.
 
Last edited:
so your theory that people are joining to try and undermine these organizations doesn't seem to hold up and your apparently just bad mouthing people in order to try and get support for what you have to say

don't leave out Catholics and Muslims


You're missing the point. Go back and re-read all my posts.
 
But it does forces non-religion. There are even blatant attempts to side-step the law.



As an example:


B.C. lawyers vote to deny accreditation to conservative Trinity Western University law school over anti-gay sex stance

“TWU is seeking our stamp of approval for a notional discriminatory banner to be hung on a new law school,” said Mr. Mulligan in an address to the assembled lawyers. “Let’s refuse to approve what we know is wrong in our time.”

Based in Langley, B.C., last year TWU announced plans to open Canada’s first Christian law school, a move that drew sharp condemnation from corners of Canadian legaldom due to the school’s “community covenant,” which forbids homosexual relationships and sex outside marriage.

Nevertheless, in April, after reviewing legal opinions, case law and more than 300 written opinion, Law Society benchers voted that TWU’s law school was entitled to status as an approved faculty of law.

“Most of the Benchers say they made the decision to respect the Rule of Law,” read a Law Society handout.

In particular, the benchers leaned on a 2001 Supreme Court decision finding that the university had the right to require their staff, faculty and students refrain from homosexual relationships based on the principles of “freedom of conscience and religion."


B.C. lawyers vote to deny accreditation to conservative Trinity Western University law school over anti-gay sex stance | National Post



Mr. Mulligan ignores the fact that it is not about what HE THINKS "he knows to be wrong at the time" .....

......it is about the law!



You're in my hood now.

That's a fight by a handful of redneck lawyers who have created a campaign to disallow the accreditation using the gay aspect to get headlines. The issue is not about gays, but Trinity Western becoming a law school, where some do not want it expanded past the current three schools, UBC, Simon Fraser, and U-Vic.

They have seized on a paragraph that asks all student to refrain from extra-marital sex during their tenure at TW. That is non specific so the first argument that it banned gays has been lost. There is now a third try, but it doesn't seem to be getting anywhere so far
 
So what? If they decide to capitulate, that's their decision.

Furthermore, I don't know anything about these religious groups mentioned, or their doctrines. There are liberal Christians and Jews - those who'd accept abortion, gay marriage etc..,






Why do you think an atheist would want to actively join and run for leadership in the Varsity? Unless he's on his way to conversion (which is the only thing I could think of).....

There are militants who exploit the madness for political correctness.

so where are these militants at these schools how is equality with recognized student organizations madness?

its correct and its political but it not politically correct
 
You're missing the point. Go back and re-read all my posts.

your making things up to suite yourself that's 1 point
 
Sorry for the confusion. I'd read an article sometime ago that did mention leadership.



A newly enforced nondiscrimination policy issued by the California State University system that requires InterVarsity Christian Fellowship to allow non-Christians to be chapter leaders has forced the nationwide organization to develop a new style of campus ministry, IVCF officials said Tuesday.

InterVarsity explained that it has always required chapter leaders to agree to its Doctrinal Basis, a summary of basic, historic Christian beliefs.

"While InterVarsity invites and welcomes all students as participants, we believe a Christian group should have the right to expect and even require their leaders to be Christian — just as any student group, club or Greek organization should be able to require their leaders to be like-minded," IVCF said.


InterVarsity Christian Fellowship Forced to 'Reinvent' College Campus Ministry Due to CSU Non-Discrimination Policy



Participation is open to all. The issue is about LEADERSHIP.

what's the leadership do that requires a believer and justifies discrimination in this case?
 
You're in my hood now.

That's a fight by a handful of redneck lawyers who have created a campaign to disallow the accreditation using the gay aspect to get headlines. The issue is not about gays, but Trinity Western becoming a law school, where some do not want it expanded past the current three schools, UBC, Simon Fraser, and U-Vic.

They have seized on a paragraph that asks all student to refrain from extra-marital sex during their tenure at TW. That is non specific so the first argument that it banned gays has been lost. There is now a third try, but it doesn't seem to be getting anywhere so far


N.S. law society rejects accreditation as long as Trinity Western maintains same-sex covenant
The Globe and Mail
Apr. 24 2014

Nova Scotia’s law society has voted to approve accreditation of Trinity Western University law school, but only if it drops the controversial policy prohibiting same-sex intimacy that some say is discriminatory.

Ten members of the council of Nova Scotia Barrister's Society voted to conditionally accredit, while nine voted against allowing graduates from the faith-based Trinity Western University to practise in the province.

The rebuke by Ontario was a major setback to Trinity Western University’s ambitions, coming from the largest and oldest law society in Canada, which counts some 46,000 lawyers as members and has never denied such a request. And it is sure to bolster determined opposition to the law school, including a court challenge, from lawyers and gay rights advocates who say it would unfairly exclude homosexuals.



N.S. law society rejects accreditation as long as Trinity Western maintains same-sex covenant - The Globe and Mail
 
Back
Top Bottom