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A little something on the Trinity for your reading pleasure.

ludin said:
yea i think you are wasting your time.

Jesus is not an angel or michael.
He is the Son of God.

He was the Son of Man while on earth which is why Satan attempted to tempt him in the desert.

JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES - DOCTRINAL COMPARISON CHART

and the two biggest ones that we are dealing with are:

The JW Bible actually is plagued with errors.
JW-Outstanding among Bibles is the New World Translation of the Christian Greek Scriptures...Accuracy, uniformity, clarity, and up-to-date language mark this excellent work. Bible study aids without equal make this an indispensable help to sincere searching students of God's Word"

Bible-Greek scholar Bruce Metzger said that "the Jehovah's Witnesses have incorporated in their translation of the New
Testament several quite erroneous renderings of the Greek." ("Jehovah's Witnesses and Jesus Christ," Theology Today, April, 1953).

The Trinity does not exist, and is an evil doctrine that teaches the existence of 3 gods.
"Never was there a more deceptive doctrine advanced than that of the trinity" (Reconciliation, 1928 )
"...sincere persons who want to know the true God and serve him find it a bit difficult to love and worship a complicated, freakish-looking, three-headed God"

Which makes no sense as God is a Spirit and has no physical form he can be whatever he wants to be.

Bible
Many religions have difficulty with an infinite God, and try to put Him in a box - to define Him in terms they can understand. While the word "trinity" does not appear in the Bible as a description of God, the scriptures definitely indicate one God with a triune nature - existing in three persons: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

Jesus Christ was Michael the Archangel before becoming a man.
JW
"...the Son of God was known as Michael before he came to earth"

Bible
There is no basis for this anywhere in the Bible.

After Jesus died, he was resurrected with His original identity as Michael the Archangel.
JW
Read carefully the following Bible account: 'War broke out in heaven: Michael [who is the resurrected Jesus Christ] and his angels battled with the dragon'"

Bible
Michael, on his own, could not rebuke Satan (Jude 1:9), yet in Mark 9:25 Jesus Himself rebukes Satan. Hebrews 2:5 says an angel can't rule the world, but Luke 1:32-33 and Revelation 19:16 show Jesus Christ to be the one who will reign. Therefore, Jesus and Michael can't be one and the same.

Jesus is "a god", and lesser than Jehovah God.
JW
In the JW version of the Bible, John 1:1 says, "In the beginning was the Word. The Word was with God, and the Word was a god." [emphasis added] "...that is the Word was a powerful godlike one. Clearly, Jesus is not Almighty God."

Bible
The JW Bible did not provide an accurate or legitimate translation of this verse.

for more sources on this read this link.
John 1:1, "The word was a god" | Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry

they changed the translation on purpose.
Click to expand...


John 1:1---In the beginning was the word( logos) and the word was with Ho Theos( how can God be with God if there is but 1 God?) and the word was Theos------ The word was not being called THE GOD--Ho Theos AT JOHN 1:1---The only greek word for either-God-god is Theos---- that is why Ho was in the second line--The God----plain Theos=small g--god---The word was not being called The God--a trinity lie. It is them who erred by putting a capitol G in the last line--fact.
 
it's just me said:
I know, everything is literal to you guys unless you need it to be figurative. And vice versa. And God's word is not garbage. What you say it means is garbage.
Click to expand...

Jesus, Paul and John all in agreement---Jesus has a God his Father( John 20:17, rev 3:12---2Cor 1:3,1Cor 8:6,1Cor 15:24-28,,,,, rev 1:6)--- truth--everything else= garbage.
 
kjw47 said:
Jesus, Paul and John all in agreement---Jesus has a God his Father( John 20:17, rev 3:12---2Cor 1:3,1Cor 8:6,1Cor 15:24-28,,,,, rev 1:6)--- truth--everything else= garbage.
Click to expand...

Your false prophet lied about what John said.
 
kjw47 said:
Our image states nothing about a godhead--adding or twisting it does.
Click to expand...

You don't think we are created in God's image - in the physical sense, do you?


God is not made of flesh and blood.

John 4
24 God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in the Spirit and in truth.”

When God said, “Let us make man in our image, in our likeness,”
it refers to the immaterial part of man. It sets mankind apart from the animals. He fits man for the dominion He intended man to have over the earth.

Genesis 1
28 And God blessed them. And God said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply and fill the earth and subdue it, and have dominion over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the heavens and over every living thing that moves on the earth.”

It is a likeness - morally, mentally and socially.



Mentally, man was created as a rational, volitional agent. In other words, man can reason and man can choose. This is a reflection of God’s intellect and freedom.

Morally, man was created in righteousness and perfect innocence, a reflection of God’s holiness. God saw all He had made (mankind included) and called it “very good” (Genesis 1:31). Our conscience or “moral compass” is a vestige of that original state.

Socially, man was created for fellowship. This reflects God's triune nature and His love. In Eden, man’s primary relationship was with God (Genesis 3:8 implies fellowship with God), and God made the first woman because “it is not good for the man to be alone” (Genesis 2:18).

Read more: What does it mean that humanity is made in the image of God (imago dei)?
 
kjw47 said:
John 1:1---In the beginning was the word( logos) and the word was with Ho Theos( how can God be with God if there is but 1 God?) and the word was Theos------ The word was not being called THE GOD--Ho Theos AT JOHN 1:1---The only greek word for either-God-god is Theos---- that is why Ho was in the second line--The God----plain Theos=small g--god---The word was not being called The God--a trinity lie. It is them who erred by putting a capitol G in the last line--fact.
Click to expand...

i just posted you a link that says you are not correct and you ignored it. the question is why would you ignore it? instead of educating yourself on why you are mistaken.

JW mistranslated the bible verse on purpose to suit their ideology.

so will post the greek and english translations.

1."In beginning was the word . . . "
(en arche en ho logos)

2."and the word was with the God . . . "
(kai ho logos en pros ton theon)

3."and God was the word."--Properly translated as "and the Word was God."
(kai theos en ho logos)
A.This same Word was God.

Regarding statement 3 above, the correct English translation is " . . . and the Word was God" and not "and God was the word." This is because if there is only one definite article ("ho"="the") in a clause where two nouns are in the nominative ("subject") form ("theos" and "logos"), then the noun with the definite article ("ho"="the") is the subject. In this case "ho logos" means that "the word" is the subject of the clause. Therefore, " . . . the Word was God" is the correct translation and not "God was the Word."1 But this does not negate the idea that John is speaking of only one God, not two, even though the Jehovah's Witnesses maintain that Jesus is "a god" or the "mighty god" as was addressed above.

not fact JW mistranslation fact though.

to say that Christ was anything less than who He said he was which was the Son of God and the Son of Man that took away the sins of the world. that He is now Ruler over all and that He sits at the right hand of the Father is to not be a Christian.

That is the core of the Christian faith system.
 
kjw47 said:
Jesus, Paul and John all in agreement---Jesus has a God his Father( John 20:17, rev 3:12---2Cor 1:3,1Cor 8:6,1Cor 15:24-28,,,,, rev 1:6)--- truth--everything else= garbage.
Click to expand...

Here is what we know about Jehovah's Witness.

In 1870, Charles Taze Russell and others formed an independent group in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, to study the Bible.[26] During the course of his ministry, Russell disputed many beliefs of mainstream Christianity including immortality of the soul, hellfire, predestination, the fleshly return of Jesus Christ, the Trinity, and the burning up of the world.

In 1876, Russell met Nelson H. Barbour; later that year they jointly produced the book Three Worlds, which combined restitutionist views with end time prophecy. The book taught that God's dealings with humanity were divided dispensationally, each ending with a "harvest," that Christ had returned as an invisible spirit being in 1874
Click to expand...
Jehovah's Witnesses - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


What this founder did with his so-called Bible Study was to edit and revise the Bible the way he saw fit!
If there's anyone who did any dramatic editing and revising, twisting and manipulating - that would be the founder of your religion!


So he said Christ has returned as an invisible being in 1874. Really? :lol:


Individuals undergoing baptism must affirm publicly that dedication and baptism identify them "as one of Jehovah’s Witnesses in association with God's spirit-directed organization,"[120] though Witness publications say baptism symbolizes personal dedication to God and not "to a man, work or organization."
Click to expand...

Where in the Bible did it ever state that baptism requires you to identify as one of Jehovah's Witnesses in association with the so-called "God's spirit-directed organization?"

Your religion is not only blatantly and boldly adding to the Scriptures, but it's also taking away some of the glory that ought to be directed only to God!

So, never mind saying "It's only to God, it's only to God - not Jesus...."

Your religion does a whole lot worse!



They consider the Bible to be the final authority for all their beliefs,[149] although sociologist Andrew Holden's ethnographic study of the religion concluded that pronouncements of the Governing Body, through Watch Tower Society publications, carry almost as much weight as the Bible.[150]

Regular personal Bible reading is frequently recommended; Witnesses are discouraged from formulating doctrines and "private ideas" reached through Bible research independent of Watch Tower Society publications, and are cautioned against reading other religious literature.[151][152][153]
Adherents are told to have "complete confidence" in the leadership, avoid skepticism about what is taught in the Watch Tower Society's literature, and "not advocate or insist on personal opinions or harbor private ideas when it comes to Bible understanding."[154][155][156][157]
.
Click to expand...
Jehovah's Witnesses - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


No wonder you ignore all the rational and factual evidences I'd given! You're instructed to ignore anything outside their teachings.

What you keep repeating in your attempt to rebut don't make any sense - because they don't address factual and rational evidences. That's like being a parrot that keeps repeating responses that don't make any sense since they don't address the issue(s).


You've been brainwashed! :lol:
 
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kjw47 said:
Jesus, Paul and John all in agreement---Jesus has a God his Father( John 20:17, rev 3:12---2Cor 1:3,1Cor 8:6,1Cor 15:24-28,,,,, rev 1:6)--- truth--everything else= garbage.
Click to expand...


Jesus, Paul and John all in agreement.....about false teachings.

JW is evidently, and blatantly is an example of false teachings. One thing I've personally experienced with JW is they tend to be deceptive about Jesus Christ. They don't come out and say what they really believe about Jesus - they seem to try to lure you in and would let you assume this is a traditional Christian religion, when in fact it is not.

You've got to pin them with direct questions, and really apply the pressure before they'll let on - with a lot of ahhhh and ummmm - that they don't believe in the deity of Jesus, they don't believe in the Resurrection, and salvation by grace.







Kjw47, please pray and ask God to guide you.
 
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If you are JW, please watch this.


 
ludin said:
i just posted you a link that says you are not correct and you ignored it. the question is why would you ignore it? instead of educating yourself on why you are mistaken.

JW mistranslated the bible verse on purpose to suit their ideology.

so will post the greek and english translations.

1."In beginning was the word . . . "
(en arche en ho logos)

2."and the word was with the God . . . "
(kai ho logos en pros ton theon)

3."and God was the word."--Properly translated as "and the Word was God."
(kai theos en ho logos)
A.This same Word was God.

Regarding statement 3 above, the correct English translation is " . . . and the Word was God" and not "and God was the word." This is because if there is only one definite article ("ho"="the") in a clause where two nouns are in the nominative ("subject") form ("theos" and "logos"), then the noun with the definite article ("ho"="the") is the subject. In this case "ho logos" means that "the word" is the subject of the clause. Therefore, " . . . the Word was God" is the correct translation and not "God was the Word."1 But this does not negate the idea that John is speaking of only one God, not two, even though the Jehovah's Witnesses maintain that Jesus is "a god" or the "mighty god" as was addressed above.

not fact JW mistranslation fact though.

to say that Christ was anything less than who He said he was which was the Son of God and the Son of Man that took away the sins of the world. that He is now Ruler over all and that He sits at the right hand of the Father is to not be a Christian.

That is the core of the Christian faith system.
Click to expand...


Every being that has wisdom knows Jesus is --the son of God---Not God.
 
tosca1 said:
Here is what we know about Jehovah's Witness.


Jehovah's Witnesses - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


What this founder did with his so-called Bible Study was to edit and revise the Bible the way he saw fit!
If there's anyone who did any dramatic editing and revising, twisting and manipulating - that would be the founder of your religion!


So he said Christ has returned as an invisible being in 1874. Really? :lol:




Where in the Bible did it ever state that baptism requires you to identify as one of Jehovah's Witnesses in association with the so-called "God's spirit-directed organization?"

Your religion is not only blatantly and boldly adding to the Scriptures, but it's also taking away some of the glory that ought to be directed only to God!

So, never mind saying "It's only to God, it's only to God - not Jesus...."

Your religion does a whole lot worse!




Jehovah's Witnesses - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


No wonder you ignore all the rational and factual evidences I'd given! You're instructed to ignore anything outside their teachings.

What you keep repeating in your attempt to rebut don't make any sense - because they don't address factual and rational evidences. That's like being a parrot that keeps repeating responses that don't make any sense since they don't address the issue(s).


You've been brainwashed! :lol:
Click to expand...


You are wrong--- Mr Russell had o to do with the translating of The NWT--this was done in the 1950,s--Mr Russell and Mr Rutherford were both dead then. Actually the NWT undid 1750 years of false teachings of Catholicism councils that they translated into Gods word.( errors) and set it straight.
Wikipedia was not there----- they use words of other men who were not there--they have 0 clue.

reality---The teaching of a trinity is calling Jesus a liar at John 17:1-6,26

Gods word teaches clearly--The Father( alone) sent Jesus---Jesus said the one who sent him( Father= The only true God--verse 6 and 26= Jehovah.---what don't you or your teachers understand about this truth from Jesus? Its 100% truth. That is why--Jesus, Paul and John all are in agreement--Jesus has a God his Father. undeniable fact.
 
tosca1 said:
Jesus, Paul and John all in agreement.....about false teachings.

JW is evidently, and blatantly is an example of false teachings. One thing I've personally experienced with JW is they tend to be deceptive about Jesus Christ. They don't come out and say what they really believe about Jesus - they seem to try to lure you in and would let you assume this is a traditional Christian religion, when in fact it is not.

You've got to pin them with direct questions, and really apply the pressure before they'll let on - with a lot of ahhhh and ummmm - that they don't believe in the deity of Jesus, they don't believe in the Resurrection, and salvation by grace.







Kjw47, please pray and ask God to guide you.
Click to expand...





What are you kidding--the JW,s would never want to be like a traditional supposed Christian religion. Their bloodguilt has amassed to the heavens. Every single one of them has failed their flocks not to warn them about parataking off the table of demons.
 
tosca1 said:
Here is what we know about Jehovah's Witness.


Jehovah's Witnesses - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


What this founder did with his so-called Bible Study was to edit and revise the Bible the way he saw fit!
If there's anyone who did any dramatic editing and revising, twisting and manipulating - that would be the founder of your religion!


So he said Christ has returned as an invisible being in 1874. Really? :lol:




Where in the Bible did it ever state that baptism requires you to identify as one of Jehovah's Witnesses in association with the so-called "God's spirit-directed organization?"

Your religion is not only blatantly and boldly adding to the Scriptures, but it's also taking away some of the glory that ought to be directed only to God!

So, never mind saying "It's only to God, it's only to God - not Jesus...."

Your religion does a whole lot worse!




Jehovah's Witnesses - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


No wonder you ignore all the rational and factual evidences I'd given! You're instructed to ignore anything outside their teachings.

What you keep repeating in your attempt to rebut don't make any sense - because they don't address factual and rational evidences. That's like being a parrot that keeps repeating responses that don't make any sense since they don't address the issue(s).


You've been brainwashed! :lol:
Click to expand...



Again you don't know what you are talking about--you listen to words of apostates---Every JW I know including me--exercise our free will to listen to the JW teachers no brainwashing whatsoever--I searched many trinity religions and Mormons and JW,s--100% fact--The JW teachers are the only teachers on earth who teach Jesus' truths.
Trinities by using HS( SUPPOSEDLY) only used the bible( but that is a lie--many writings besides the bible has been used by all) condemnation of others using other forms is pure hipocrosy)--well then the HS must be very confused then because there are about 33,000 different trinity religions( all claim to be taught by HS)--they must have missed this-1Cor 1:10)because when all of creation looks at the trinity religions they see a disunified mass of confusion--and all of creation is correct on that matter.
 
kjw47 said:
John is clear--Rev 1:6
Click to expand...

Don't bother posting proof texts, I don't look them up, they are usually meaningless coming from JW's.

John was really clear when he said the Word was with God and the Word was God. JW liars had to write their own bible to get around that.
 
kjw47 said:
Again you don't know what you are talking about--you listen to words of apostates---Every JW I know including me--exercise our free will to listen to the JW teachers no brainwashing whatsoever--I searched many trinity religions and Mormons and JW,s--100% fact--The JW teachers are the only teachers on earth who teach Jesus' truths.
Trinities by using HS( SUPPOSEDLY) only used the bible( but that is a lie--many writings besides the bible has been used by all) condemnation of others using other forms is pure hipocrosy)--well then the HS must be very confused then because there are about 33,000 different trinity religions( all claim to be taught by HS)--they must have missed this-1Cor 1:10)because when all of creation looks at the trinity religions they see a disunified mass of confusion--and all of creation is correct on that matter.
Click to expand...

You add blasphemy against the Holy Spirit to your crimes by calling Christ's Church "apostate"? All this in addition to your bad spelling and grammar?
 
it's just me said:
You add blasphemy against the Holy Spirit to your crimes by calling Christ's Church "apostate"? All this in addition to your bad spelling and grammar?
Click to expand...


please enlighten us--which one of the churches isn't apostate out of the 33,000? Jesus started one single religion--he taught unity and love and peace--which one? Where are the corrections they have been making here in these last days to fulfill this-Daniel 12:4?
 
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it's just me said:
Don't bother posting proof texts, I don't look them up, they are usually meaningless coming from JW's.

John was really clear when he said the Word was with God and the Word was God. JW liars had to write their own bible to get around that.
Click to expand...


Rev 1:6-- and he( Jesus) made us( anointed) to be a kingdom, priests,to his God and Father.)--reality---Jesus has a God--God does not have a God.
 
kjw47 said:
please enlighten us--which one of the churches isn't apostate out of the 33,000? Jesus started one single religion--he taught unity and love and peace--which one? Where are the corrections they have been making here in these last days to fulfill this-Daniel 12:4?
Click to expand...

Your question betrays your lack of knowledge. There is only one Church, the Church Christ created, and if you are so all for unity, why haven't you joined it? Instead, you resist it, you resist HIM. The church Christ created dates back to ancient times, it is not the invention of a false prophet from the 1800's. It's right under your nose and you refuse to see.

Tell me, what Church dates back to Christ and the Apostles? It obviously isn't yours.
 
kjw47 said:
Again you don't know what you are talking about--you listen to words of apostates---Every JW I know including me--exercise our free will to listen to the JW teachers
Click to expand...

Of course. You're quite free to listen to the JW teachers.
 
kjw47 said:
--I searched many trinity religions and Mormons and JW,s--100% fact--The JW teachers are the only teachers on earth who teach Jesus' truths.
Click to expand...

No, you're not searching for the truth.

How can you? You're not even allowed to read any other materials aside from the Watch Tower, let alone think about other doctrines outside of JW. You're not allowed to think for yourself.

And it shows here on this forum. You're not addressing factual evidences being given to you. You're ignoring them.



Either you aren't reading them at all....

.....or you don't know how to respond to them because you can't find anything from the Watchtower to refute them!
 
kjw47 said:
Again you don't know what you are talking about--you listen to words of apostates---Every JW I know including me--exercise our free will to listen to the JW teachers no brainwashing whatsoever--I searched many trinity religions and Mormons and JW,s--100% fact--The JW teachers are the only teachers on earth who teach Jesus' truths.
Trinities by using HS( SUPPOSEDLY) only used the bible( but that is a lie--many writings besides the bible has been used by all) condemnation of others using other forms is pure hipocrosy)--well then the HS must be very confused then because there are about 33,000 different trinity religions( all claim to be taught by HS)--they must have missed this-1Cor 1:10)because when all of creation looks at the trinity religions they see a disunified mass of confusion--and all of creation is correct on that matter.
Click to expand...

If they are teaching that Christ was an Angel
If they are not teaching the Tri-unity of God
If they are making Christ less than the Lord and Savior of all which could only be accomplished by him being who he Said he was.

then they are not preaching truth.
 
tosca1 said:
No, you're not searching for the truth.

How can you? You're not even allowed to read any other materials aside from the Watch Tower, let alone think about other doctrines outside of JW. You're not allowed to think for yourself.

And it shows here on this forum. You're not addressing factual evidences being given to you. You're ignoring them.



Either you aren't reading them at all....

.....or you don't know how to respond to them because you can't find anything from the Watchtower to refute them!
Click to expand...

It is both i posted 2 links that proved him wrong and he didn't even read them. he just repeated the same thing that he always repeats. which has proven to be incorrect translation of the scriptures.
 
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