Charity

MaggieD · Jun 5, 2014

My Aunt Marie became a nun when she was maybe 17 years old. Oh, I don't know the particulars of what she actually became at that age, a Novitiate? Is that what it's called? She was in a convent in Chicago for 10 years, I think, not having taken her final vows. At age 27, her father (my grandfather, who was a troubled man) tried to commit suicide and failed. He tried to shoot himself in the head . . . did that . . . but apparently the gun moved or something and he was seriously, but not fatally, wounded. He recovered. Something about that signaled to my aunt that her work in the church was done, and she left the convent. (I wish I knew more about that now.)

Fast-forward to my close relationship with her when I was in my late teens/early 20's. Her husband worked nights, and I spent a great deal of time with her playing cards, visiting, etc. One evening she talked about "charity". Her opinion was that lack of charity in spirit, deeds and pocketbook was the greatest sin one could commit. She believed that one's generosity came back to them in many different ways.

Fast-forward to yesterday. I had two errands to run. On my way there, I passed Woodfield Mall. There was a guy in fatigues holding up a homeless sign. Now I usually (but not always) will donate two or three dollars, MAYBE $5, but this time, for some reason, I pulled out a $20 and gave it to him. He was quite obviously moved.

Fast-forward to my errands:

#1 -- Go to the DMV and get my license renewed; always a hassle in/around Chicago. When I got there, it was a "light day." I was in and out in 15 minutes. My driver's license photo didn't look like a mugshot. I got a guy who quite obviously loved his job who made me laugh. AND I don't have to wear glasses to drive anymore. 15 minutes in the DMV? Unheard of.

#2 -- Go to see if Lexus has time to change the oil in my car. See if they can possibly do the recall fix in short order. And get an estimate to repair the control panel on the driver's side that will no longer let me roll down the back passenger-side window from the front seat. The service tech said that, if I needed a new control panel, it'd be about $560 for parts and labor. But he said he'd never seen that happen to one of their cars. (My car's 7 years old.) He went out there once to have a look, fiddled around, came back and said, "Well, I'll have the service guys look at it." Then he had to go to another area to pick up the printed copy of the work order, and I saw him jump into my car again. When he came back, he said, "Well!! I just saved you $560. It's fixed." Apparently, there's some kind of re-initialization one can do to the control panel. And that worked. He told me the oil change and recall fix would take about an hour-and-a-half. I agreed to wait. It took 45 minutes.

I didn't think about this until later in the evening. Makes me wonder if Aunt Marie was right. Good things come back at people who are "charitable". I've been "generous" many OTHER times in my life, but this cause/effect is hard to ignore.

I know it sounds weird, but I wonder what your beliefs are...

Edit: Just posted and saw how long this is . . . if I see tldr, I'll understand.

Paleocon · Jun 5, 2014

MaggieD said:
My Aunt Marie became a nun when she was maybe 17 years old. Oh, I don't know the particulars of what she actually became at that age, a Novitiate? Is that what it's called? She was in a convent in Chicago for 10 years, I think, not having taken her final vows. At age 27, her father (my grandfather, who was a troubled man) tried to commit suicide and failed. He tried to shoot himself in the head . . . did that . . . but apparently the gun moved or something and he was seriously, but not fatally, wounded. He recovered. Something about that signaled to my aunt that her work in the church was done, and she left the convent. (I wish I knew more about that now.)

Fast-forward to my close relationship with her when I was in my late teens/early 20's. Her husband worked nights, and I spent a great deal of time with her playing cards, visiting, etc. One evening she talked about "charity". Her opinion was that lack of charity in spirit, deeds and pocketbook was the greatest sin one could commit. She believed that one's generosity came back to them in many different ways.

Fast-forward to yesterday. I had two errands to run. On my way there, I passed Woodfield Mall. There was a guy in fatigues holding up a homeless sign. Now I usually (but not always) will donate two or three dollars, MAYBE $5, but this time, for some reason, I pulled out a $20 and gave it to him. He was quite obviously moved.

Fast-forward to my errands:

#1 -- Go to the DMV and get my license renewed; always a hassle in/around Chicago. When I got there, it was a "light day." I was in and out in 15 minutes. My driver's license photo didn't look like a mugshot. I got a guy who quite obviously loved his job who made me laugh. AND I don't have to wear glasses to drive anymore. 15 minutes in the DMV? Unheard of.

#2 -- Go to see if Lexus has time to change the oil in my car. See if they can possibly do the recall fix in short order. And get an estimate to repair the control panel on the driver's side that will no longer let me roll down the back passenger-side window from the front seat. The service tech said that, if I needed a new control panel, it'd be about $560 for parts and labor. But he said he'd never seen that happen to one of their cars. (My car's 7 years old.) He went out there once to have a look, fiddled around, came back and said, "Well, I'll have the service guys look at it." Then he had to go to another area to pick up the printed copy of the work order, and I saw him jump into my car again. When he came back, he said, "Well!! I just saved you $560. It's fixed." Apparently, there's some kind of re-initialization one can do to the control panel. And that worked. He told me the oil change and recall fix would take about an hour-and-a-half. I agreed to wait. It took 45 minutes.

I didn't think about this until later in the evening. Makes me wonder if Aunt Marie was right. Good things come back at people who are "charitable". I've been "generous" many OTHER times in my life, but this cause/effect is hard to ignore.

I know it sounds weird, but I wonder what your beliefs are...

Edit: Just posted and saw how long this is . . . if I see tldr, I'll understand.

Just curious, did she simply leave the convent, or did she get the appropriate dispensation?

MaggieD · Jun 5, 2014

Paleocon said:
Just curious, did she simply leave the convent, or did she get the appropriate dispensation?

I don't know, Paleocon. I'm not sure. I know she loved everyone there, she was very sad when she left . . . if I had to guess, I'd say she did it appropriately.

Paleocon · Jun 5, 2014

MaggieD said:
I don't know, Paleocon. I'm not sure. I know she loved everyone there, she was very sad when she left . . . if I had to guess, I'd say she did it appropriately.

Do you know if she was married in the Church? If so that would mean she had the appropriate dispensation.

MaggieD · Jun 5, 2014

Paleocon said:
Do you know if she was married in the Church? If so that would mean she had the appropriate dispensation.

I was pretty young. She was married in "a" church, but not sure if it was "the" church. I've no way to find out anymore. But now that you've made me think about it, I'm not sure she ever went to church...

soot · Jun 5, 2014

MaggieD said:
I've been "generous" many OTHER times in my life, but this cause/effect is hard to ignore.

I don't see any evidence of "cause/effect".

I see you attributing perfectly ordinary events and/or circumstances to supernatural causes.

So you happened to get good service at the DMV and your mechanic actually did his job.

I hardly think those kinds of things require that the stars align for you.

Superfly · Jun 5, 2014

Nice post, Maggie. I try to do as much charitable work as I can, and I think it comes back to you. I think that it does come back and help you in other ways. God knows what you are doing, and how you are trying to help out others, and He gives it back to you in other ways, I think.

Something else that my husband started doing about 15 years ago - we used to have money problems. Never had enough to make the bills, etc, no matter how hard we worked. He woke up one morning and decided that he was going to "let go, and let God." He decided, that day, to no longer worry about money, and he has not worried since, and we've not had any money problems since then. At all.

MaggieD · Jun 5, 2014

soot said:
I don't see any evidence of "cause/effect".

I see you attributing perfectly ordinary events and/or circumstances to supernatural causes.

So you happened to get good service at the DMV and your mechanic actually did his job.

I hardly think those kinds of things require that the stars align for you.

Maybe. Maybe not. I won't argue your point of view, Soot.

longview · Jun 5, 2014

I think good things tend to happen to good people.
Helping others is good for your soul, that goodness is reflected
in how you interact with people, and on average improves the interaction.
Does it help tip the karmic scales in your favor?
I don't know, but like to think so.

MaggieD · Jun 5, 2014

longview said:
I think good things tend to happen to good people.
Helping others is good for your soul, that goodness is reflected
in how you interact with people, and on average improves the interaction.
Does it help tip the karmic scales in your favor?
I don't know, but like to think so.

So do I, Longview.

soot · Jun 5, 2014

MaggieD said:
Maybe. Maybe not. I won't argue your point of view, Soot.

Fair enough.

Just offering my beliefs, as you requested.

I believe that you should do good because you want to, or because it's the right thing to do, rather than out of some desire to reap karmic benefits.

As far as "karma", or whatever you choose to call it, goes you don't even know if you actually did the right thing, or did any good at all, by doing what you described in the OP.

You might have made a horrible, tragic mistake by giving that guy cash.

Just for argument's sake, say that the homeless guy in fatigues was a heroine addict, and he was just on the verge of seeking treatment for his disease but your $20 allowed him to continue his run just a little bit longer. You don't know if maybe he used your money to buy a bad bag of dope that killed him. You don't know if getting high one more time changed his mind about getting clean and he's in a position now where he's going to hurt someone to feed his addiction. You don't know that he is really homeless - maybe he's actually an unemployed alcoholic who panhandles for whiskey money, and by giving him $20 you allowed him to buy a bottle that led to him killing a child as a result of DUI.

How, in the great scheme of things, is your charity "good" if, in the longer run, it leads to feeding an addiction or costing a life?

Now understand, I'm not saying that any of these things that I'm supposing had to happen.

Maybe the guy used the money you gave him to feed a hungry child or get a shave and a haircut that led to him securing a job.

You never really know.

But the fact is, that $20 worth of charity could have been the worst thing in the world that could have happened to that guy at that particular point in time but because you'll never see the actual consequences of your action you're free to think anything you want about it.

Including being free to attribute perfectly ordinary events and/or circumstances to supernatural causes.

soot · Jun 5, 2014

longview said:
I think good things tend to happen to good people.
Helping others is good for your soul, that goodness is reflected
in how you interact with people, and on average improves the interaction.

I definitely agree with that.

If the absolute best thing to come out of Maggie's charity is that she personally feels a little bit better about herself as a result of it, I don't think there's anything wrong with that.

nota bene · Jun 5, 2014

soot said:
I don't see any evidence of "cause/effect".

I see you attributing perfectly ordinary events and/or circumstances to supernatural causes.

So you happened to get good service at the DMV and your mechanic actually did his job.

I hardly think those kinds of things require that the stars align for you.

Then again, some say that "coincidence" is when God chooses to remain anonymous.

the_recruit · Jun 5, 2014

Charity isn't about getting a reward. I don't think it matters whether there's any thing such as karma or heaven or any other kind of reward. Giving because you think you'll get something in return somewhere down the line isn't charity - that's investing.

gilbertc1908 · Jun 7, 2014

MaggieD said:
My Aunt Marie became a nun when she was maybe 17 years old. Oh, I don't know the particulars of what she actually became at that age, a Novitiate? Is that what it's called? She was in a convent in Chicago for 10 years, I think, not having taken her final vows. At age 27, her father (my grandfather, who was a troubled man) tried to commit suicide and failed. He tried to shoot himself in the head . . . did that . . . but apparently the gun moved or something and he was seriously, but not fatally, wounded. He recovered. Something about that signaled to my aunt that her work in the church was done, and she left the convent. (I wish I knew more about that now.)

Fast-forward to my close relationship with her when I was in my late teens/early 20's. Her husband worked nights, and I spent a great deal of time with her playing cards, visiting, etc. One evening she talked about "charity". Her opinion was that lack of charity in spirit, deeds and pocketbook was the greatest sin one could commit. She believed that one's generosity came back to them in many different ways.

Fast-forward to yesterday. I had two errands to run. On my way there, I passed Woodfield Mall. There was a guy in fatigues holding up a homeless sign. Now I usually (but not always) will donate two or three dollars, MAYBE $5, but this time, for some reason, I pulled out a $20 and gave it to him. He was quite obviously moved.

Fast-forward to my errands:

#1 -- Go to the DMV and get my license renewed; always a hassle in/around Chicago. When I got there, it was a "light day." I was in and out in 15 minutes. My driver's license photo didn't look like a mugshot. I got a guy who quite obviously loved his job who made me laugh. AND I don't have to wear glasses to drive anymore. 15 minutes in the DMV? Unheard of.

#2 -- Go to see if Lexus has time to change the oil in my car. See if they can possibly do the recall fix in short order. And get an estimate to repair the control panel on the driver's side that will no longer let me roll down the back passenger-side window from the front seat. The service tech said that, if I needed a new control panel, it'd be about $560 for parts and labor. But he said he'd never seen that happen to one of their cars. (My car's 7 years old.) He went out there once to have a look, fiddled around, came back and said, "Well, I'll have the service guys look at it." Then he had to go to another area to pick up the printed copy of the work order, and I saw him jump into my car again. When he came back, he said, "Well!! I just saved you $560. It's fixed." Apparently, there's some kind of re-initialization one can do to the control panel. And that worked. He told me the oil change and recall fix would take about an hour-and-a-half. I agreed to wait. It took 45 minutes.

I didn't think about this until later in the evening. Makes me wonder if Aunt Marie was right. Good things come back at people who are "charitable". I've been "generous" many OTHER times in my life, but this cause/effect is hard to ignore.

I know it sounds weird, but I wonder what your beliefs are...

Edit: Just posted and saw how long this is . . . if I see tldr, I'll understand.

The first thing your aunt would tell you if she spent that much time in a convent is that "charity" within its Catholic/Christian context has nothing to do with act of giving money to anyone or anything. Charity is the act (more precisely the power) of loving God which of course means the act of loving (and then by extension) serving His creations.

Here you have applied the secular or popular definition of charity which is the donating of money to a cause or person. That act in an of itself may be good or bad.

The Charity of Catholicism is the central point of existing as a Christian, to love God above all things.

Instead of the word Charity when attempting to assert the Catholic meaning of the word, use the word Love. You have likely heard this at a Catholic or Christian wedding where the wonderful description by Paul of charity (1 Corinthians ) is read but asserts the word Love where Charity is within the text.

1 I may speak with every tongue that men and angels use; yet, if I lack charity, I am no better than echoing bronze, or the clash of cymbals.
2 I may have powers of prophecy, no secret hidden from me, no knowledge too deep for me; I may have utter faith, so that I can move mountains; yet if I lack charity, I count for nothing.[1]
3 I may give away all that I have, to feed the poor; I may give myself up to be burnt at the stake; if I lack charity, it goes for nothing.[2]
4 Charity is patient, is kind; charity feels no envy; charity is never perverse or proud,
5 never insolent;[3] does not claim its rights, cannot be provoked, does not brood over an injury;
6 takes no pleasure in wrong-doing, but rejoices at the victory of truth;
7 sustains, believes, hopes, endures, to the last.

MaggieD · Jun 7, 2014

gilbertc1908 said:
The first thing your aunt would tell you if she spent that much time in a convent is that "charity" within its Catholic/Christian context has nothing to do with act of giving money to anyone or anything. Charity is the act (more precisely the power) of loving God which of course means the act of loving (and then by extension) serving His creations.

Here you have applied the secular or popular definition of charity which is the donating of money to a cause or person. That act in an of itself may be good or bad.

The Charity of Catholicism is the central point of existing as a Christian, to love God above all things.

Instead of the word Charity when attempting to assert the Catholic meaning of the word, use the word Love. You have likely heard this at a Catholic or Christian wedding where the wonderful description by Paul of charity (1 Corinthians ) is read but asserts the word Love where Charity is within the text.

How interesting! Thank you for this. I've Googled around and found Catholic "charity" to mean something more. I also see where some say 'substitute love for charity' and you have it. I think it's something more than love, though. Think of Catholic Charities. It's mission according to its website:

Catholic Charities fulfills the Church’s role in the mission of charity to anyone in need by providing compassionate, competent and professional services that strengthen and support individuals, families and communities based on the value and dignity of human life. In order to remain faithful to our mission, Catholic Charities is guided by these core values: Respect, Compassion, Competence and Stewardship.

Our mission and values are based on the firm foundation of Catholic Social Teaching, a collection of themes developed in papal and other writings over the course of the Church’s history. These themes include the belief that human life is sacred; that all humans have inherent dignity, rights and responsibilities; that social structures like marriage and the family must be supported; that the needs of the poor and vulnerable must be met; and that we must be responsible stewards of God’s creation.

Far from limiting our focus, our Catholic identity and values enable us to truly be “universal,” which is what “catholic” really means. The tenets of Catholic Social Teaching call us to serve everyone, regardless of their belief or background, and to employ anyone, not just Catholics, who commits to our mission. Christ reached out to people of all faiths, and Catholic Charities does the same, with the goal of transforming lives for the better.

1 Corinthians is beautiful. That may be where my aunt got HER interpretation of "charity." What if one doesn't substitute the word "love"?

Very thought-provoking. Thank you for this.

gilbertc1908 · Jun 7, 2014

MaggieD said:
How interesting! Thank you for this. I've Googled around and found Catholic "charity" to mean something more. I also see where some say 'substitute love for charity' and you have it. I think it's something more than love, though. Think of Catholic Charities.

There is Catholic Charities the definition of which you find on the web and then there is Catholic charity the definition of which you find in the CoCC;

Charity

1822 Charity is the theological virtue by which we love God above all things for his own sake, and our neighbor as ourselves for the love of God.

1823 Jesus makes charity the new commandment.96 By loving his own "to the end,"97 he makes manifest the Father's love which he receives. By loving one another, the disciples imitate the love of Jesus which they themselves receive. Whence Jesus says: "As the Father has loved me, so have I loved you; abide in my love." and again: "This is my commandment, that you love one another as I have loved you."98

1824 Fruit of the Spirit and fullness of the Law, charity keeps the commandments of God and his Christ: "Abide in my love. If you keep my commandments, you will abide in my love."99

1825 Christ died out of love for us, while we were still "enemies."100 The Lord asks us to love as he does, even our enemies, to make ourselves the neighbor of those farthest away, and to love children and the poor as Christ himself.101

The Apostle Paul has given an incomparable depiction of charity: "charity is patient and kind, charity is not jealous or boastful; it is not arrogant or rude. Charity does not insist on its own way; it is not irritable or resentful; it does not rejoice at wrong, but rejoices in the right. Charity bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things."102

1826 "If I . . . have not charity," says the Apostle, "I am nothing." Whatever my privilege, service, or even virtue, "if I . . . have not charity, I gain nothing."103 Charity is superior to all the virtues. It is the first of the theological virtues: "So faith, hope, charity abide, these three. But the greatest of these is charity."104

1827 The practice of all the virtues is animated and inspired by charity, which "binds everything together in perfect harmony";105 it is the form of the virtues; it articulates and orders them among themselves; it is the source and the goal of their Christian practice. Charity upholds and purifies our human ability to love, and raises it to the supernatural perfection of divine love.

1828 The practice of the moral life animated by charity gives to the Christian the spiritual freedom of the children of God. He no longer stands before God as a slave, in servile fear, or as a mercenary looking for wages, but as a son responding to the love of him who "first loved us":106

If we turn away from evil out of fear of punishment, we are in the position of slaves. If we pursue the enticement of wages, . . . we resemble mercenaries. Finally if we obey for the sake of the good itself and out of love for him who commands . . . we are in the position of children.107

1829 The fruits of charity are joy, peace, and mercy; charity demands beneficence and fraternal correction; it is benevolence; it fosters reciprocity and remains disinterested and generous; it is friendship and communion:
Love is itself the fulfillment of all our works. There is the goal; that is why we run: we run toward it, and once we reach it, in it we shall find rest.108

kimtame · Sep 16, 2014

Well, I agree with you! Its a good example of volunteer work. I have seen MaggieD' s charity is helping for that kind of needy or who don't have any hope from their life.

CrabCake · Sep 16, 2014

I believe in the boomerang effect (or karma, or sowing what you reap, or "what goes around comes around", or whatever you want to call it). But even if it weren't the case, I think it just makes the world a better place. Wouldn't it be nice to live in a world where people are loving and charitable and try to help those in need? Like Soot mentioned, it's not always helpful; in fact, there's a whole book on the topic called "When Helping Hurts". But even then, isn't a world filled with people who look out for each other a better world to live in?

RGacky3 · Sep 16, 2014

MaggieD said:
My Aunt Marie became a nun when she was maybe 17 years old. Oh, I don't know the particulars of what she actually became at that age, a Novitiate? Is that what it's called? She was in a convent in Chicago for 10 years, I think, not having taken her final vows. At age 27, her father (my grandfather, who was a troubled man) tried to commit suicide and failed. He tried to shoot himself in the head . . . did that . . . but apparently the gun moved or something and he was seriously, but not fatally, wounded. He recovered. Something about that signaled to my aunt that her work in the church was done, and she left the convent. (I wish I knew more about that now.)

Fast-forward to my close relationship with her when I was in my late teens/early 20's. Her husband worked nights, and I spent a great deal of time with her playing cards, visiting, etc. One evening she talked about "charity". Her opinion was that lack of charity in spirit, deeds and pocketbook was the greatest sin one could commit. She believed that one's generosity came back to them in many different ways.

Fast-forward to yesterday. I had two errands to run. On my way there, I passed Woodfield Mall. There was a guy in fatigues holding up a homeless sign. Now I usually (but not always) will donate two or three dollars, MAYBE $5, but this time, for some reason, I pulled out a $20 and gave it to him. He was quite obviously moved.

Fast-forward to my errands:

#1 -- Go to the DMV and get my license renewed; always a hassle in/around Chicago. When I got there, it was a "light day." I was in and out in 15 minutes. My driver's license photo didn't look like a mugshot. I got a guy who quite obviously loved his job who made me laugh. AND I don't have to wear glasses to drive anymore. 15 minutes in the DMV? Unheard of.

#2 -- Go to see if Lexus has time to change the oil in my car. See if they can possibly do the recall fix in short order. And get an estimate to repair the control panel on the driver's side that will no longer let me roll down the back passenger-side window from the front seat. The service tech said that, if I needed a new control panel, it'd be about $560 for parts and labor. But he said he'd never seen that happen to one of their cars. (My car's 7 years old.) He went out there once to have a look, fiddled around, came back and said, "Well, I'll have the service guys look at it." Then he had to go to another area to pick up the printed copy of the work order, and I saw him jump into my car again. When he came back, he said, "Well!! I just saved you $560. It's fixed." Apparently, there's some kind of re-initialization one can do to the control panel. And that worked. He told me the oil change and recall fix would take about an hour-and-a-half. I agreed to wait. It took 45 minutes.

I didn't think about this until later in the evening. Makes me wonder if Aunt Marie was right. Good things come back at people who are "charitable". I've been "generous" many OTHER times in my life, but this cause/effect is hard to ignore.

I know it sounds weird, but I wonder what your beliefs are...

Edit: Just posted and saw how long this is . . . if I see tldr, I'll understand.

For me I never liked the English Word "charity," it has this modern notion of almost a Client/Patron relationship, where one is the benefactor who bestows what he desires on a lowlier person, kind of like "look at me, I am so philanthropic, you depend on me and I graciously give to you."

I prefer to use the origional biblical Word of "agape" meaning simply principle based love, so I will share and give and help those less fortunate, not because I see myself as a benefactor of those lowlier to me, but because all that is belongs to God, nothing is really mine, and my duty as a christian is to show this "love." Philanthropy isn't christian, sharing through love is.

Anyway, please don't take that as a criticism, it's just a general point, but you are loved by love to share $20 With a man in need, for me the reward for that is in the act itself, by doing so you are partaking in Gods love, and as such as NT Wright would put it "Doing the Kingdom."

For me that is the reward, anything else that happens that is good I wouldnt see as related, thats Karma, not Christianity, and Karma is the idea that good is Worth doing because you'll receive something good in Return, this is basically a non-Christian, Market/Capitalist concept and a Buddhist concept (For all of it's pretending Buddhism, far from being anti-consumerist, actually ends up being one of the most compatible With post-modern capitalism theologies out there), The reward for Christian virtue, is the value of virtue in and of itself.

I think, you'd have been just as happy, and fulfilled knowing you did the right thing and acted in a Christlike manner, whether or not something good happened for you later.

MaggieD · Sep 16, 2014

RGacky3 said:
For me I never liked the English Word "charity," it has this modern notion of almost a Client/Patron relationship, where one is the benefactor who bestows what he desires on a lowlier person, kind of like "look at me, I am so philanthropic, you depend on me and I graciously give to you."

I prefer to use the origional biblical Word of "agape" meaning simply principle based love, so I will share and give and help those less fortunate, not because I see myself as a benefactor of those lowlier to me, but because all that is belongs to God, nothing is really mine, and my duty as a christian is to show this "love." Philanthropy isn't christian, sharing through love is.

Anyway, please don't take that as a criticism, it's just a general point, but you are loved by love to share $20 With a man in need, for me the reward for that is in the act itself, by doing so you are partaking in Gods love, and as such as NT Wright would put it "Doing the Kingdom."

For me that is the reward, anything else that happens that is good I wouldnt see as related, thats Karma, not Christianity, and Karma is the idea that good is Worth doing because you'll receive something good in Return, this is basically a non-Christian, Market/Capitalist concept and a Buddhist concept (For all of it's pretending Buddhism, far from being anti-consumerist, actually ends up being one of the most compatible With post-modern capitalism theologies out there), The reward for Christian virtue, is the value of virtue in and of itself.

I think, you'd have been just as happy, and fulfilled knowing you did the right thing and acted in a Christlike manner, whether or not something good happened for you later.

Nice post. I especially like, "Doing the Kingdom." Yeah, that says it, doesn't it?

Charity

MaggieD

Paleocon

MaggieD

Paleocon

MaggieD

soot

Superfly

Salty, defiant, and completely non-compliant.

MaggieD

longview

MaggieD

soot

soot

nota bene

the_recruit

gilbertc1908

Member

MaggieD

gilbertc1908

Member

kimtame

CrabCake

RGacky3

MaggieD