View Poll Results: Rate the level of interference Democracy has in Americans ability to solve problems:

Voters
41. You may not vote on this poll
  • one (no interference)

    12 29.27%
  • two

    2 4.88%
  • three

    2 4.88%
  • four

    2 4.88%
  • five

    2 4.88%
  • six

    2 4.88%
  • seven

    3 7.32%
  • eight

    1 2.44%
  • nine

    1 2.44%
  • ten (Total Interference)

    14 34.15%
Page 9 of 14 FirstFirst ... 7891011 ... LastLast
Results 81 to 90 of 137

Thread: Is Democracy Blocking America's Ability To Solve It's Problems?

  1. #81
    Disappointed Evolutionist
    Catawba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Last Seen
    05-28-13 @ 08:15 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    27,254

    Re: Is Democracy Blocking America's Ability To Solve It's Problems?

    Quote Originally Posted by hazlnut View Post
    #1 His on interests.

    #2 Please show me a single definition of Democracy (I realize there are many) that mentions the concept of participants 'look[ing] out for their own interests...' as a key factor.




    Despite what Gordon Gekko(Ivan Boesky) said, Greed is an excessive desire to possess wealth or goods with the intention to keep it for one's self. Greed - like lust and gluttony - is a sin of excess.



    Every time you pay your Credit Card interest, just smile and think of Dante. Usurers are placed on the inner ring of the seventh circle of hell...with the blasphemers and sodomites.

    Anyway, more to the point, GREED is absolutely not necessary and should be avoided in a moral society.
    I agee completely, greed is to desire wealth beyond your needs. Very destructive in a world with limited resources, as we have seen time and time again.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  2. #82
    User Nanten Janubi's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    20 miles, straight up
    Last Seen
    07-12-11 @ 06:02 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    120

    Re: Is Democracy Blocking America's Ability To Solve It's Problems?

    Are you familiar with the tragedy of the commons, Catawba?
    A history of knowledge will not make us clever for the next time, but wise forever.
    -Jacob Burckhardt.

  3. #83
    Global Moderator
    The Hammer of Chaos
    Goshin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Dixie
    Last Seen
    Today @ 12:13 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    44,184

    Re: Is Democracy Blocking America's Ability To Solve It's Problems?

    Quote Originally Posted by empireofreason View Post
    Imports increase the debt. Lowering the imports, decreases debt. Higher prices, lowers consumption, which lowers imports, which lowers the debt.
    Wrong. Lowering imports will do nothing about the fact that our government is spending 1/3 more than it takes in, in the form of trillions in debt.


    As far as jobs, downsizing lowers consumption, which lowers debts. It is cheaper to pay welfare than it is to keep them in a job that is unnecessary and pays a luxurious wage. They don't have to live on the street, they'll have a place, food and health benefits. This results in the national debt being lowered from the savings of the downsize and lowered consumption.
    WTF? Putting more people on the dole will lower the national debt?? You seem to have a thing about consumption... consumption isn't the problem, AT ALL. More productivity and more consumption would be better for the economy, because it means more economic activity is going on... the PROBLEM again is the government is putting us a trillion dollars MORE in debt every year, and it is getting worse.

    Fiddling While Rome Burns
    ISIS: Carthago Delenda Est
    "I used to roll the dice; see the fear in my enemies' eyes... listen as the crowd would sing, 'now the old king is dead, Long Live the King.'.."

  4. #84
    Global Moderator
    The Hammer of Chaos
    Goshin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Dixie
    Last Seen
    Today @ 12:13 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    44,184

    Re: Is Democracy Blocking America's Ability To Solve It's Problems?

    Quote Originally Posted by empireofreason View Post
    Agree with you attitude about gang members. I would take things a bit further and allow ideologically discriminating neighborhoods and housing complexes, not racist although. Artists, students, families, even republican, democrat, whatever group was significant enough to justify creating. Many people over-consume because they are only trying to stay away from riff-raff. Encouraging ideologically based neighborhoods would relieve them of this need to over-consume.
    You actually think that having a Republican neighborhood, a Democrat neighborhood, an artist's colony and a student's subdivision would discourage people from "over consuming"? I don't even know what to say to that... other than I don't think you understand human nature very well.



    Prostitution is a moral issue.
    Law begins with moral issues, such as a moral choice that murder is not acceptible. It is when law STOPS being about right and wrong, STOPS being about protecting the individual, and starts becoming a means of extending government's power and intrusiveness that it becomes a problem.


    In terms of the gas guzzling, the energy a suv uses can easily run four households in a day. Meanwhile, there is a guy that gets to an from work on the energy contained in a plate of stir-fried rice because he has positioned his home and work accordingly. Whether oil and gas run out in 50 or 500 hundred years, it doesn't matter. It will run out. We need to change the way we do things. Leaving the problem for our children is not a responsible way to handle it. We need to begin it now. When we choose to put people in our own country on the streets that are willing to work just so we can drive that 4000 pound vehicle, we are lowering our potential and creating social disease. Japanese infrastructure probably would be a good place to begin our study on more efficient infrastructure, although we nave no need to place the nuclear plants so close.

    So you want to tell people where they will live, and how they will travel to work.... I'm beginning to think you support an authoritarian Technocracy, rule by the intellectual elite with limited input from the ignorant masses.


    There is a general attitude in America that thinks the welfare office and the employment office are two different entities. This is one of our biggest mistakes in harming the economy. A person should always be kept above from going into squalor, but if they don't find work, our government should then ask them to perform work when it is available and their name comes up. This is what humans have always done in times of past. The father and mother will all wake up their sons and daughters for the hunt or to go the fields. Only the sick and elderly were allowed to be left behind. When times got bad, no one was turned out. They whether the storm together. We miss this attitude today, and it makes us a terrible, snobby, less-productive and stupid looking nation. The Machiavellian philosophy is bs and invokes a less productive attitude upon the masses in general. Instead, people in general are naturally cooperative. They don't need to be called lazy, they need to be called to work. They don't need insults, they need leadership. That's the real solution. Call 'em lazy enough and take all they have including their dignity and you'll make yourself a war inside your own country. How will that pay off a debt?
    Again, you don't seem very astute in matters of human nature. When times got hard, the Eskimos would put the old into a kayak and push them out into the ocean to die alone. The noble tribesman is largely myth.
    As for lazy people.... there are lots of people living off the government teat who could easily do better if they wanted. Many of them live by scams, pretending to be disabled or collecting under two or three different names. I'm not theorizing, I've known such people.
    "People in general are naturally cooperative" --- again, you don't seem to understand human nature very well. Study the Jamestown colony and how they began with an attempt at collectivism, which failed miserably due to a lack of cooperation. This was despite a relatively small and homogenous colony whose majority was strictly religious and had a strong work ethic. You'd do far better to count on people acting in their own intrest, than counting on their altrusim, civic virtue, or cooperation.

    Fiddling While Rome Burns
    ISIS: Carthago Delenda Est
    "I used to roll the dice; see the fear in my enemies' eyes... listen as the crowd would sing, 'now the old king is dead, Long Live the King.'.."

  5. #85
    Disappointed Evolutionist
    Catawba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Last Seen
    05-28-13 @ 08:15 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    27,254

    Re: Is Democracy Blocking America's Ability To Solve It's Problems?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nanten Janubi View Post
    Are you familiar with the tragedy of the commons, Catawba?
    Yes, its another description of greed, people acting in their own self interests without regard for the needs of the collective group.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  6. #86
    User Nanten Janubi's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    20 miles, straight up
    Last Seen
    07-12-11 @ 06:02 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    120

    Re: Is Democracy Blocking America's Ability To Solve It's Problems?

    Well, the problem is with people acting within the precepts of human nature in a way that hurts some. Two solutions are set forth and they describe two different approaches of government: one allows for greed, one does not. Regardless, the 'tragedy' itself doesn't really describe anything other than nature, anymore than a group of lions eating a zebra describes anything but the natural order. It feels strange to have to remind a self-described 'evolutionist' of that.
    A history of knowledge will not make us clever for the next time, but wise forever.
    -Jacob Burckhardt.

  7. #87
    Sage
    Dittohead not!'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    The Golden State
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 10:39 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    41,561

    Re: Is Democracy Blocking America's Ability To Solve It's Problems?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nanten Janubi View Post
    Are you familiar with the tragedy of the commons, Catawba?
    I was not, so I looked it up, here:

    Hardin's work has been criticised on the grounds of historical inaccuracy, and for failing to distinguish between common property and open access resources. Subsequent work by Elinor Ostrom and others suggest that using Hardin's work to argue for privatization of resources is an "overstatement" of the case.[3][4] Nonetheless, Ostrom recognizes that there are real problems, and even limited situations where the tragedy of the commons applies to real-world resource management.[5]

    As Hardin acknowledged [6] there was a fundamental mistake in the use of the term “commons." This was already noted in 1975 by Ciriacy-Wantrup & Bishop (1975: 714) [7] who wrote that we "are not free to use the concept 'common property resources' or 'commons' under conditions where no institutional arrangements exist. Common property is not 'everybody's property' (...). To describe unowned resource (res nullius) as common property (res communes), as many economists have done for years (...) is a selfcontradiction." Neglecting the difference between common property and open access resources is a major reason of confusion in the debate that followed the 1968 Hardin's article.
    So, if I understand that correctly, common resources are like the water under the ground that everyone can tap by digging a well. It is still a limited resource, so taking it out of the ground depletes that resource for everyone. Common property would mean that everyone (and therefore no one) would own a piece of ground, a business, or whatever. Common property would rightly be called socialism, which has been proven over and over not to work, while common resources are a fact of life, and must be managed through government.
    "Donald Trump is a phony, a fraud... [he's] playing the American public for suckers." Mitt Romney

  8. #88
    Disappointed Evolutionist
    Catawba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Last Seen
    05-28-13 @ 08:15 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    27,254

    Re: Is Democracy Blocking America's Ability To Solve It's Problems?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nanten Janubi View Post
    Well, the problem is with people acting within the precepts of human nature in a way that hurts some. Two solutions are set forth and they describe two different approaches of government: one allows for greed, one does not. Regardless, the 'tragedy' itself doesn't really describe anything other than nature, anymore than a group of lions eating a zebra describes anything but the natural order. It feels strange to have to remind a self-described 'evolutionist' of that.
    Evolutionists belive that people evolve, not only phyisically but socially as well. To attack others for what we want may be what's natural in the animal kingdom but fortunately most human societies have evolved to the point where we have rules about that. A disappointed evolutionist results from, among other things, not seeing the same rules placed on greed.
    Last edited by Catawba; 05-25-11 at 10:27 PM.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  9. #89
    User Nanten Janubi's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    20 miles, straight up
    Last Seen
    07-12-11 @ 06:02 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    120

    Re: Is Democracy Blocking America's Ability To Solve It's Problems?

    I'm sorry, but history and a simple flip through network news would indicate that humans haven't evolved past that point. I doubt they''ll ever evolve past it. No life has, as far as we can see.
    A history of knowledge will not make us clever for the next time, but wise forever.
    -Jacob Burckhardt.

  10. #90
    Defender of the Faith
    ludahai's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Taichung, Taiwan - 2017 East Asian Games Candidate City
    Last Seen
    07-03-13 @ 02:22 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    10,320

    Re: Is Democracy Blocking America's Ability To Solve It's Problems?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lakryte View Post
    I disagree. There are many spanish speakers in the US who understand the issues. If there are large language groups in the US, we should write the ballot in multiple languages. If you can't read either of them, I would agree.
    Why? English is the working language of the United States and it should be the official language as well. What other countries print ballots in languages not regarded as official. Do you think I can go to the ballot box here and demand a ballot in English? I would be laughed out of the polling station.
    Semper Paratus
    Boston = City of Champions: Bruins 2011; Celtics 2008; Red Sox 2004, 2007; Patriots 2002, 2004, 2005
    Jon Huntsman for President

Page 9 of 14 FirstFirst ... 7891011 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •