View Poll Results: Rate the level of interference Democracy has in Americans ability to solve problems:

Voters
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  • one (no interference)

    12 29.27%
  • two

    2 4.88%
  • three

    2 4.88%
  • four

    2 4.88%
  • five

    2 4.88%
  • six

    2 4.88%
  • seven

    3 7.32%
  • eight

    1 2.44%
  • nine

    1 2.44%
  • ten (Total Interference)

    14 34.15%
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Thread: Is Democracy Blocking America's Ability To Solve It's Problems?

  1. #21
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    Re: Is Democracy Blocking America's Ability To Solve It's Problems?

    Quote Originally Posted by empireofreason View Post
    American is in a lot of trouble economically right now and Democracy may actually be the barrier to getting things back on track.

    Based upon how you see America's situation, on scale from 1 to 10, how would you rate Democracy being an interference with America's ability to get back on track, where 1 means Democracy has absolutely no interference with solving the problems, 10 means it interferes absolutely with problem solving.


    I've actually thought about this from time to time.

    Sometimes, it seems that most people know what has to be done. Currently 1/3 of our budget is debt, and our total debt is exceeding our GDP. We are experiencing serious problems with our overseas creditors over this, as well as our trade balance and so forth. The situation could become critical if something isn't done soon.

    There's little debate that these are facts. Everyone knows there's two things you can do in this situation; cut spending or raise taxes, or both.

    The economy is already so weak and damaged that raising taxes probably wouldn't be good. Drastic spending cuts are what is needed now. This is no secret; probably almost every politician in DC knows it.

    The problem is that DOING it isn't "politically feasible". Cut someone's pet project, some town's military base, some person's government check, and they probably won't vote for you next election or send you money to campaign on. Politicians mostly want to get re-elected, so they dither, stall, pass the buck, and hide their heads in the sand... at best.

    I learned a long time ago that coming up with a solution to a problem that would work is not so hard... anyone with a good brain can do it for many issues. Implementing that solution within the political structure that exists is what is often impossible.

    Democracy usually means that most bills (theoretically, solutions to problems) will be compromises. That is, where someone took a workable plan and watered it down and sprinkled it with pork and confusion.

    It is frustrating sometimes... but I'm not ready to throw the baby out with the bath water just yet.

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  2. #22
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    Re: Is Democracy Blocking America's Ability To Solve It's Problems?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    Democracy usually means that most bills (theoretically, solutions to problems) will be compromises. That is, where someone took a workable plan and watered it down and sprinkled it with pork and confusion.

    It is frustrating sometimes... but I'm not ready to throw the baby out with the bath water just yet.
    The problem with compromise on spending cuts is that the two parties so far have wanted to compromise on 0.1% cut vs 0.2% cut. No one is willing to talk about real cuts.
    "Donald Trump is a phony, a fraud... [he's] playing the American public for suckers." Mitt Romney

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    Re: Is Democracy Blocking America's Ability To Solve It's Problems?

    Quote Originally Posted by TOJ View Post
    The USA citizens just don't seem to be very good at picking leaders.
    Which country's citizens would you prefer to pick our leaders?
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: Is Democracy Blocking America's Ability To Solve It's Problems?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    The problem with compromise on spending cuts is that the two parties so far have wanted to compromise on 0.1% cut vs 0.2% cut. No one is willing to talk about real cuts.

    True. It is very disheartening, when we ought to be talking 10-20% across the board, closing "duplicate" bureaus and "no results for 20 years" programs, etc.

    Fiddling While Rome Burns
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  5. #25
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    Re: Is Democracy Blocking America's Ability To Solve It's Problems?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Which country's citizens would you prefer to pick our leaders?
    I would recommend the citizens of Stlzoo

    Pretty sure they could do a better job.

    .

  6. #26
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    Re: Is Democracy Blocking America's Ability To Solve It's Problems?

    99% of the interference comes from people we put in off who have no clue what the hell they are. They work for special interests and for anyone who will help them remain in power.

    Congress & Senate are cushy jobs with real grading system to keep these people on the straight and narrow, or Obama would never have had a chance, because he did nothing in the Senate and has carried that on every day since,
    Last edited by Councilman; 05-24-11 at 12:11 AM.

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    Re: Is Democracy Blocking America's Ability To Solve It's Problems?

    Quote Originally Posted by TOJ View Post
    I would recommend the citizens of Stlzoo

    Pretty sure they could do a better job.

    .



    So you have no serious alternative to our representative government...............who would have guessed?
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  8. #28
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    Re: Is Democracy Blocking America's Ability To Solve It's Problems?

    Quote Originally Posted by empireofreason View Post
    American is in a lot of trouble economically right now and Democracy may actually be the barrier to getting things back on track.

    Based upon how you see America's situation, on scale from 1 to 10, how would you rate Democracy being an interference with America's ability to get back on track, where 1 means Democracy has absolutely no interference with solving the problems, 10 means it interferes absolutely with problem solving.
    Simon hits the nail on the head.
    Rational irrationality and rational ignorance are the two leading factors in why democracy isn't that successful in problem solving.

    Rational irrationality-Getting people to invest time in something that does not yield that may contradict their short term wants is very difficult.

    Rational ignorance- Getting people to invest time in educating themselves on a subject (specifically political subjects) has very little value, because the effects of that education has a incredibly tiny (less than 1/1000 of 1 percent) chance of changing the system, for the better.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

  9. #29
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    Re: Is Democracy Blocking America's Ability To Solve It's Problems?

    Quote Originally Posted by empireofreason View Post
    Is the 'bit of truth' that the natural progression of a Democracy end days arrive with 'lousy fiscal policy', and a dictatorship is imminent. If so, would you say the dictatorship is neccessary for survival or is it just a horrible result where success is just a roll of the dice from that point?
    Dictatorship may not always be the end result.
    Places like Argentina who have had failed state problems, still have a democratic form of government.

    It's just incredibly crony (aka, corrupt) in nature.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

  10. #30
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    Re: Is Democracy Blocking America's Ability To Solve It's Problems?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    There's little debate that these are facts. Everyone knows there's two things you can do in this situation; cut spending or raise taxes, or both.
    If we cut spending, 'pet projects', how will those people survive if they don't have a job? What if the pet project is like you said, a 'government check' that would stop them from landing in the streets. It makes no sense to drive our people into squalor, which will result into crime, drug addiction, mental illness and likely if not turned around quick enough could metastasize into a troublesome and even radical sub-culture haunting our children years far into the future. I find that unpractical and lazy and unbefitting of a real leader who should be leading us away from such ideas while maintaining sustainability.

    Skimming incomes with taxes I think is better than selling out to ideas that will create third world neighborhoods. If cuts are to help, I think they must be accompanied with a guarantee of basic housing, food and medical support. We will have lowered that person's consumption and at the same time maintained their dignity. This lowered consumption can be applied to the debt.

    I can understand downsizing government to improve it's efficiency. Those downsized will still have the option of challenging others for the existing jobs that pay better, but still have a guaranteed safety net that doesn't have an expiration date. Those in such a situation should have the willingness to work if asked when they have not found work on their own. We should all jump at the opportunity to pay our fair share, if we have had no luck in finding work on our own. Some of us just need a good leader to get us going. That's all.

    I think we should tax some big business too and only give them a break after the tax for downsizing in a similar manner to encourage an increase in productivity. Tax the general public across the board too. Why? No one will stop spending, so we're going to have to slow over-consumption down one way or another, but every American should make it through this with dignity while the debt is paid off.

    End debtors prison, instead criminalize the existing Shylock methods.

    Marijuana most likely costs American's more being illegal vs. being regulated and taxed. It may be now the time to stop using private agendas and think about the lesser of two evils in situation such as this. Our survival is a stake.

    Increasing our exports couldn't hurt, where we can.

    We should drive less, it's probably the biggest energy sucker we have, if we look at it in Joules, not in relativistic market value. With those autos we weight four thousand pounds heavier than any of our ancestors. Lot of excess ass we are dragging around now. These mechanical beasts consume a lot of energy too, eats up the farm, eats us out of house and home. We should position ourselves better to ride mass transit, walk or ride bikes. We would be more fit, it will help personal budgets, help the planet, our national debt and economy in general. That can be encouraged with a gas tax that increases with consumption and decreases with lessened consumption. A bigger tax break for proving a significant reduction in consumption could be offered, but some of that savings should go directly toward the debt, not just back to the tax payer.
    Last edited by empireofreason; 05-24-11 at 03:38 AM.

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