View Poll Results: Who do you think will win the Republican nomination?

Voters
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  • Mitt Romney

    41 15.30%
  • Tim Pawlenty

    9 3.36%
  • John Huntsman

    0 0%
  • Mitch Daniels

    15 5.60%
  • Sarah Palin

    4 1.49%
  • Newt Gingrich

    6 2.24%
  • Michele Bachmann

    2 0.75%
  • Donald Trump

    3 1.12%
  • Ron Paul

    172 64.18%
  • Other (specify)

    16 5.97%
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Thread: Who do you think will win the Republican nomination?

  1. #141
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    Re: Who do you think will win the Republican nomination?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Republican/tea party/rightist-libertarian types who have consumed massive quantities of the right wing ideological kool-aid ..... the believe what they believe because they want to believe it in much the same way that people accept religious doctrine


    Can you give some examples? I know I have asked you this before, but you have always come up short.

    Who is a true believer, and why do you call them this name?

    what do you think making broad generalizations about those who disagree with you, add to the debate?
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

  2. #142
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    Re: Who do you think will win the Republican nomination?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Who do you think will win the Republican nomination in 2012? (Not who you WANT to win.)
    Sarah Palin is my Choice!
    Rom 6:23:For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

  3. #143
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    Re: Who do you think will win the Republican nomination?

    For what it's worth, here are the current probabilities on each of the Republican contenders winning the nomination according to InTrade. I'm including all of them who have at least a 1% chance, as of today:

    Mitt Romney: 25.3% chance of winning the nomination
    Tim Pawlenty: 18.5%
    John Huntsman: 12.0%
    Mitch Daniels: 10.8%
    Herman Cain: 6.9%
    Sarah Palin: 6.0%
    Newt Gingrich: 5.0%
    Michele Bachmann: 5.0%
    Ron Paul: 3.1%
    Chris Christie: 3.0%
    Paul Ryan: 1.1%

    As I see it, the top four candidates (plus Chris Christie who says he isn't running) are the ones that could actually mount a serious challenge to Obama. Their chances of winning the nomination increase if Obama's poll numbers decline, because Republicans will be more likely to nominate a potential president instead of merely a conservative standard-bearer. The other six candidates on that list are, in my opinion, vanity candidates. They won't win the nomination unless Obama looks unbeatable, and Republicans decide to nominate an ideological purist as a sacrificial lamb.
    Last edited by Kandahar; 05-16-11 at 04:08 PM.
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  4. #144
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    Re: Who do you think will win the Republican nomination?

    Quote Originally Posted by ReverendHellh0und View Post
    Can you give some examples? I know I have asked you this before, but you have always come up short.

    Who is a true believer, and why do you call them this name?

    what do you think making broad generalizations about those who disagree with you, add to the debate?
    No - I have never come up short. Just the opposite. You and I have gone round and round on this time and time again. I make statements about the body politic and you attempt to make it about yourself by asking baiting questions because you suspect that you are the target of them. Apparently, you recognize something in the description that speaks to you about your own views. I have not "come up short". When you ask me - like you have done again in your post right here - I repeatedly have identified someone like yourself who fits that category and you repeatedly dispute it despite being a self acknowledged libertarian/tea party person who voted Republican.

    The name True Believer is not something I came up with. It goes back to Eric Hoffer. There have been threads written about it right here on this very site. It can refer to someone who believes in a political ideology out of faith much like a person believes in religion. They believe what they believe because they want to believe it. Evidence and facts have little to nothing to do with their belief system. They accept axioms as the Truth with a capital T and those Truths are beyond challenge. Two such examples that exist among the True Believers of today are easy to identify
    1- small government is the best government
    2- tax cuts are a good in and of themselves

    We are in a high point for the rise of the True Believer as evidenced by the rise of the teaparty/libertarian/republican individual and their impact on the 2010 elections. Generalizations are useful if they are correct and spot on. As these are.

    Now what comes next is your next move where you demand an apology or retraction or demand that I reproduce all of your posts which prove your place on the ideological continuum.

    Please remember that this was not about you. I spoke about the body politic. You asked for specific information and it was given to you........ as it always is.

    And we will go back and forth on this for many posts over several pages until a mod comes in and either tells both of us to knock it off or we get thread banned.

    We both have seen this show before and we both know the lines by this time.
    Last edited by haymarket; 05-16-11 at 04:37 PM.
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  5. #145
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    Re: Who do you think will win the Republican nomination?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    1- small government is the best government
    2- tax cuts are a good in and of themselves.


    so simply put, anyone who believes Items 1 and 2 are true believers. And those who disagree with you, are most likely "true believers"... noted.


    Can you address the second part of my question? What do you think hurling insults at folks you disagree with adds to the debate?


    Thank you.
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

  6. #146
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    Re: Who do you think will win the Republican nomination?

    Quote Originally Posted by ReverendHellh0und View Post
    so simply put, anyone who believes Items 1 and 2 are true believers. And those who disagree with you, are most likely "true believers"... noted.


    Can you address the second part of my question? What do you think hurling insults at folks you disagree with adds to the debate?


    Thank you.
    No insults were hurled. Simple statements of observation about the current body politic were made.

    If I say that someone measures less than five feet in height and they claim I insulted them having said they were a shrimp, no insult was made, the slight being in the mind of the individual taking exception to the facts.

    Go back and read my answer to you again. I did NOT say that those two statements constituted the definition of the True Believer.

    The name True Believer is not something I came up with. It goes back to Eric Hoffer. There have been threads written about it right here on this very site. It can refer to someone who believes in a political ideology out of faith much like a person believes in religion. They believe what they believe because they want to believe it. Evidence and facts have little to nothing to do with their belief system. They accept axioms as the Truth with a capital T and those Truths are beyond challenge. Two such examples that exist among the True Believers of today are easy to identify
    1- small government is the best government
    2- tax cuts are a good in and of themselves

    We are in a high point for the rise of the True Believer as evidenced by the rise of the teaparty/libertarian/republican individual and their impact on the 2010 elections.
    Now go back and read the complete context of my use of the term in the post which caught your attention

    The only one who has a fighting chance to beat Obama is Romney and he is unacceptable to the True Believers of the right who tend to have disproportionate voting power in GOP primaries.
    It is both clear and easy to understand.
    Last edited by haymarket; 05-16-11 at 04:45 PM.
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  7. #147
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    Re: Who do you think will win the Republican nomination?

    I am still trying to figure out just who these mythical "true believers" you keep talking about are. They are kinda like some sort of bogeyman or something? It's creepy, this sorta alex jonesesque view of this mythical enemy of yours.
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

  8. #148
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    Re: Who do you think will win the Republican nomination?

    I would urge you to read Hoffer.

    Short of doing that, read this

    The True Believer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    here is an important part of the summary

    Summary

    Hoffer argues that all mass movements such as fascism, communism, and religion spread by promising a glorious future. To be successful, these mass movements need the adherents to be willing to sacrifice themselves and others for the future goals. To do so, mass movements need to glorify the past and devalue the present. Mass movements appeal to frustrated people who are dissatisfied with their current state, but are capable of a strong belief in the future. As well, mass movements appeal to people who want to escape a flawed self by creating an imaginary self and joining a collective whole. Some categories of people who may be attracted to mass movements include poor people, misfits, and people who feel thwarted in their endeavors.
    Most of that fits the teaparty/rightist-libertarian/ republican perfectly.

    this quote from the original Hoffer book fits the teaparty perfectly

    When hopes and dreams are loose in the streets, is well for the timid to lock doors, shutter windows, and lie low until the wrath has passed. For there is often a monstrous incongruity between the hopes, however noble and tender, and the action which follows them. It is as if ivied maidens and garlanded youths were to herald the four horsemen of the apocalypse. — P.20
    This is particularly fitting

    It is the true believer’s ability to “shut his eyes and stop his ears” to facts that do not deserve to be either seen or heard which is the source of his unequaled fortitude and constancy. He cannot be frightened by danger nor disheartened by obstacle not baffled by contradictions because he denies their existence. — P.76
    Last edited by haymarket; 05-16-11 at 05:04 PM.
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  9. #149
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    Re: Who do you think will win the Republican nomination?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    I would urge you to read Hoffer.

    Short of doing that, read this

    The True Believer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    here is an important part of the summary



    Most of that fits the teaparty/rightist-libertarian/ republican perfectly.


    this quote from the original Hoffer book fits the teaparty perfectly



    This is particularly fitting



    How so? You have in all your posting been FAIL at answering this one simple question.
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

  10. #150
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    Re: Who do you think will win the Republican nomination?

    There are plenty of examples were smaller governments thrive longer than larger ones. I don't think that should be on your list mate.

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