View Poll Results: What Should the Government Focus On, Raising Revenue or Tax Rates?

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  • Revenues

    25 89.29%
  • Tax Rate

    3 10.71%
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Thread: Is Raising Revenue More Important Than Raising Tax Rates?

  1. #141
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    Re: Is Raising Revenue More Important Than Raising Tax Rates?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    IN your haste to try to score a point I don't see any evidence of income redistribution in those short lived 3% tax designed to pay for the war (RA 0f 1861) or the 2% income taxes designed to offset the lost of tariff revenues.
    Not about points, buddy, it was just showing everyone you didn't know what your were talking about...

    why do the parasite advocates constantly talk about the super wealthy when all the dems schemes are most vexatious to those who are merely upper middle class or at the bottom of the top taxpaying group?
    Why do you avoid to addressing any of the points I made and default to your usual talking points?

    you rant and rave about hedge fund managers yet how many hedge fund managers make up the top 2 percent that your socialist president wants to screw over?
    Saying the President is trying to 'screw over' someone is beyond stupid--an ignorant thought process that is dragging our country back to the brink.

    And, again you seem incapable of understanding the issues -- hedge funds pay earn returns. Capital gains.

    W. gave the managers a loophole tax break, alas, no more...

  2. #142
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    Re: Is Raising Revenue More Important Than Raising Tax Rates?

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Did you really say that? The difference between the 20s and late 1940s and today is there was a huge amount of wealth built up with massive deferred demand. There is no such pent up wealth and demand this time around.

    Cpwill, that may have been the stupidest thing I've seen you say ever.

    hilarious. you really can't draw a connection between the Government taking less money from the private sector, and the private sector having more money, can you?

  3. #143
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    Re: Is Raising Revenue More Important Than Raising Tax Rates?

    Neither is exclusive from the other. If you raise taxes you're bound to increase revenues. There really aren't too many other ways to do it short of raising the interest rates on short-term investments, like mortgage and lending rates from the Treasury, but doing such would likely put our economy at greater risk. Raising interest rates would in all likelihood deter investments and we really don't want to do that in such a fragile economy.

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    Re: Is Raising Revenue More Important Than Raising Tax Rates?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mayor Snorkum View Post
    Yes, of course, that's why JFK cut tax rates....clearly he wanted government revenues to go down.
    He did so by cutting corporate and income taxes and increasing payroll taxes using Keynesian economic reforms. It also helped that his Administration came into being at the height of the space race which helped the economy tremendously. This forging of a public-private partnership w/government brought about full employment (unemployment at or below 3% of GDP). As such, JFK could afford to put his tax policy in place and not have to worry about deferring additional revenue to social programs or increased government spending because the money was their via full employment by the nation's citizery.
    Last edited by Objective Voice; 05-09-11 at 02:51 PM.

  5. #145
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    Re: Is Raising Revenue More Important Than Raising Tax Rates?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mayor Snorkum View Post
    Yeah. Right.

    But not in the real world. Lowering the tax rates allows people to keep their money. When people have more money, they typically spend more. People (not governments) spending more money is what normal people call "economic growth". Economic growth expands the economy and results in....check this out...greater tax revenues.

    (GASP!....)

    Raising taxes, on the other hand. may or may not create a temporary spike in revenues.

    Then revenues decline.

    That's all there is to that.
    Your argument is for supply-side economics which don't work in a deep recession or depression nor when there is too much deregulation of industries because business as a whole has proven time and again that they can't police themselves. Supply-side economics only work IF a country has full-employment. When unemployment is high such as it is currently, you CANNOT generate revenue simply by "sliding the taxing responsibily to consumers". The reason for that is simple: Fewer workers equals less revenue generated. Even if you reduce the marginal tax rate on the middle-class that do still have jobs, you still don't have enough people earning a living wage to make up the difference of revenue lost. The only means to counter the lose is:

    a) tax that section of wage earners that have "disposable income" and can afford the lose (the wealthy); or,

    b) open new sources of employment, i.e., green jobs; or,

    c) find new revenue streams, i.e., carbon tax (just an example based on what's been thrown out there to date; not saying I support such one way or another).

    I think eventually, Congress including those stauch Conservatives, will come to realize they have no choice but to allow the Bush tax cuts on the rich to expire and free the middle-class for their economic burdens. The American people can't take much more of the economic burden. Most are stretched thin enough as it is as this report clearly illustrates.

  6. #146
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    Re: Is Raising Revenue More Important Than Raising Tax Rates?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mayor Snorkum View Post
    When people have more money, they typically spend more. People (not governments) spending more money is what normal people call "economic growth". Economic growth expands the economy and results in....check this out...greater tax revenues.
    That may be true in normal times, but when unemployment is high, banks aren't lending, and no new jobs in sight, Government backed jobs is the only way to get things moving again, make people feel good about themselves, raise their expectations. No. not permanently, just until private Companies start hiring again.

    ricksfolly

    ricksfolly

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    Re: Is Raising Revenue More Important Than Raising Tax Rates?

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Did you really say that? The difference between the 20s and late 1940s and today is there was a huge amount of wealth built up with massive deferred demand. There is no such pent up wealth and demand this time around.
    you know, it suddenly occurs to me. when we cut spending in the 40's after WWII, Keyensians screamed up and down that we were going to see massive losses to the economy; just like you are doing now.

    Odd, isn't it, how the models are always wrong, yet they never get questioned? It's like a weird faith in the Omniscience of Government.

  8. #148
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    Re: Is Raising Revenue More Important Than Raising Tax Rates?

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    Neither is exclusive from the other. If you raise taxes you're bound to increase revenues.
    since we have had much higher taxes in the past, and collected no more revenue, I'm going to have to ahead and say that no, we aren't.

    you want to raise revenue? you gotta grow GDP.

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    Re: Is Raising Revenue More Important Than Raising Tax Rates?

    Apparently, the Tea Party is willing to bend on the debt ceiling...

    Tea Party Leader: We'll Take The Debt Ceiling Hike If You Put Gay Troops Back In The Closet

    Ah, the real face of the Tea People, old time religion and homophobia...

  10. #150
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    Re: Is Raising Revenue More Important Than Raising Tax Rates?

    given that the tea party has no leader, it doesn't surprise me they could find one saying something like this.

    you may want to wander on over to the party platform forum, where Senate and House Republicans are both laying out what they are going to be actually demanding for the debt-ceiling.

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