View Poll Results: Public K-12 Education: Conservative or Liberal?

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  • Conservative

    4 19.05%
  • Liberal

    10 47.62%
  • Other, please explain

    7 33.33%
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Thread: Public K-12 Education: Conservative or Liberal?

  1. #41
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    Re: Public K-12 Education: Conservative or Liberal?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    I took both. my Econ was pretty basic; supply demand curve, what goes into GDP, etc. In my Poli Sci class I learned about federalism and the social contract. I also learned that Republicans wanted to control our personal lives, that our Republican Governor was anti-education, that George Bush was too stupid to be president, and that moving into a "living Constitution" society marked by a large and generous federal government was the logical conclusion of the Founders intent.



    allow me to introduce you to an unfortunately common book assigned in history courses:

    Lies My Teacher Told Me: Everything Your American History Textbook Got Wrong.

    also popular with the educrat crowd is Howard Zinns' "A People's History of the United States; though that is more common in the collegiate world.



    i couldn't care if they rip on FDR or not; i just want them to accurately teach the history of that era as opposed to claiming that capitalism created the Great Depression and FDR "saved" us. that's like claiming that responsible lending practices created the mortgage crises and George Bush pulled us out.
    You can't just put a link to some book down and say, "Welp, it's clearly a liberal biased education!". And again, drop the whole FDR thing. He was a good president, he implemented great social programs, and I think most historians agree that overall he was beneficial during one of the dark hours of the United States' history. If you have a problem with that, I guess that's just your problem.

    Every time I heard the word liberal and education put together I know the stupid FDR argument is coming out.
    Ted Cruz is the dumbest person alive.

  2. #42
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    Re: Public K-12 Education: Conservative or Liberal?

    Quote Originally Posted by whysoserious View Post
    You can't just put a link to some book down and say, "Welp, it's clearly a liberal biased education!"
    well, firstly, you are moving the goal posts. my point here was that these are subjects where there is room for bias by the overwhelmingly left-leaning educators to whom we give our children. if you want to have a debate about whether or not the instruction in our public school system is liberally-biased or not, then that's fine, we can discuss that; but i think it deserves it's own thread.

    And again, drop the whole FDR thing. He was a good president, he implemented great social programs
    FDR used the political turmoil that was the product of his own destructive economic policies to turn the Constitution on it's head. He was no Wilson (he wasn't quite as absolutist and certainly wasn't as racist), but a "good President" was something he was not.

    I think most historians agree that overall he was beneficial during one of the dark hours of the United States' history.
    except that when they poll "historians" inevitably what they poll is "history teachers"; which would tend to reinforce my point. You're polling people like Haymarket (who taught history - and government, for that matter); the ranks of our professors are nearly uniformly tilted leftward, and they will naturally laud FDR despite the fact that he was an economic illiterate who lengthened the Depression.

    If you have a problem with that, I guess that's just your problem.
    given that he still stands as a model of reference for how to deal with a downturn, it's everyones' problem. how do you like that consistently high unemployment rate, eh?

    Every time I heard the word liberal and education put together I know the stupid FDR argument is coming out.
    actually you are the one that called this out. I was happily discussing the structure of how we go about organizing the educational system.
    Last edited by cpwill; 04-30-11 at 04:30 PM.

  3. #43
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    Re: Public K-12 Education: Conservative or Liberal?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    Why are all your posts so... so...

    Wrong?

    I mean there's nothing in this post that makes even remotely any sense.

    Ah **** it.

    All liberals are evil.

    Al Gore.

    Socialism.

    Islam.

    All evil.

    You win.

    You've convinced me.

    Who's been ****ing with my medicine!
    A liberal finally gets it right

  4. #44
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    Re: Public K-12 Education: Conservative or Liberal?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alfons View Post
    What would you prefer for your children, conservative or liberal K-12 Education in public schools?Do not forget that after liberal "education" in public schools many children are illiterate and know nothing. BTW most of wealthy people ( democrats and liberals too ) send their children only to conservative schools. Please explain your choice and do not forget that too liberal "education" in public schools has downgraded America to one of the lowest places among other western countries.
    Depends. What exactly makes a school 'conservative' or 'liberal'?
    If you notice something good in yourself, give credit to God, not to yourself, but be certain the evil you commit is always your own and yours to acknowledge.

    St. Benedict

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    Re: Public K-12 Education: Conservative or Liberal?

    Quote Originally Posted by Morality Games View Post
    Depends. What exactly makes a school 'conservative' or 'liberal'?
    Alfon's opinion.

  6. #46
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    Re: Public K-12 Education: Conservative or Liberal?

    I would prefer to teach my own kids. I would teach truth, not politics.


  7. #47
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    Re: Public K-12 Education: Conservative or Liberal?

    For serious talkers, and not necessarily the OP, both. I come in from the history area, so I don't really just buy the idea that you know, there's just "truth" and then there's "political ideology." It's a great deal more complicated than that. It is too easy to get sucked into group think and perceive reality that way. For instance, in universities, colleges of education can get too sucked into one mode of thinking and just completely ignore the other half of the spectrum, because it is "just wrong" without any consideration that maybe many issues are far more complicated than that.
    Last edited by Fiddytree; 04-30-11 at 05:44 PM.
    Michael J Petrilli-"Is School Choice Enough?"-A response to the recent timidity of American conservatives toward education reform. https://nationalaffairs.com/publicat...-choice-enough

  8. #48
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    Re: Public K-12 Education: Conservative or Liberal?

    except that when they poll "historians" inevitably what they poll is "history teachers"; which would tend to reinforce my point. You're polling people like Haymarket (who taught history - and government, for that matter); the ranks of our professors are nearly uniformly tilted leftward, and they will naturally laud FDR despite the fact that he was an economic illiterate who lengthened the Depression.
    Yes, you're right. Also, however, I would assume that it has not been nearly concluded that his actions lengthened the Depression, and is still a matter of intense debate that may never be "nearly" concluded (because universal opinion to begin with is impossible to achieve, and near conclusion would imply that there is just far less debate). I am also assuming it can possibly divide between historical generations and/or political ideology with regard to analyzing the correct course with the Great Depression.
    Michael J Petrilli-"Is School Choice Enough?"-A response to the recent timidity of American conservatives toward education reform. https://nationalaffairs.com/publicat...-choice-enough

  9. #49
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    Re: Public K-12 Education: Conservative or Liberal?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Yes, you're right.
    see, now, why did you have to keep writing after you had already figured out the most important point?

    Also, however, I would assume that it has not been nearly concluded that his actions lengthened the Depression, and is still a matter of intense debate that may never be "nearly" concluded (because universal opinion to begin with is impossible to achieve, and near conclusion would imply that there is just far less debate). I am also assuming it can possibly divide between historical generations and/or political ideology with regard to analyzing the correct course with the Great Depression.
    The work that highlights the Presidents' role in lengthening the Great Depression is fairly recent, that is true; it's a backlash, I think, against a kind of uniformity of assumption within much of the historical field. And perhaps a rebellion by some against a similarly uniform professoriate. Poking holes in the thesis of your forebears, of course, is the traditional way to make a name for onesself .

    but note the debate; which we will for ease call the anti-FDR and pro-FDR factions; the anti-FDR faction focuses on the effects of transfer payments, of the agricultural adjustment act, of the NIRA legislation's effect on wages... etc. they are uniquely focused on the economics of the debate. the pro-FDR side seems to focus on the expresed opinion of like-minded history teachers. they are uniquely focused on past polling of the debate. I would posit that the first has the long-term advantage over the latter.

  10. #50
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    Re: Public K-12 Education: Conservative or Liberal?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    see, now, why did you have to keep writing after you had already figured out the most important point?



    The work that highlights the Presidents' role in lengthening the Great Depression is fairly recent, that is true; it's a backlash, I think, against a kind of uniformity of assumption within much of the historical field. And perhaps a rebellion by some against a similarly uniform professoriate. Poking holes in the thesis of your forebears, of course, is the traditional way to make a name for onesself .

    but note the debate; which we will for ease call the anti-FDR and pro-FDR factions; the anti-FDR faction focuses on the effects of transfer payments, of the agricultural adjustment act, of the NIRA legislation's effect on wages... etc. they are uniquely focused on the economics of the debate. the pro-FDR side seems to focus on the expresed opinion of like-minded history teachers. they are uniquely focused on past polling of the debate. I would posit that the first has the long-term advantage over the latter.
    This subject requires a different thread and a more elaborate argument.
    If you notice something good in yourself, give credit to God, not to yourself, but be certain the evil you commit is always your own and yours to acknowledge.

    St. Benedict

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