View Poll Results: Would you support Progressive Grading?

Voters
31. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes

    5 16.13%
  • No

    26 83.87%
  • Other

    0 0%
Page 22 of 29 FirstFirst ... 122021222324 ... LastLast
Results 211 to 220 of 289

Thread: Progressive Grading in School

  1. #211
    Doesn't go below juicy
    tacomancer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Cleveland
    Last Seen
    05-20-16 @ 02:42 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    31,781

    Re: Progressive Grading in School

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    And I agree, I'm just bringing out this in, what I thought, was an entertaining way.

    I'm interested in setting up a system of productivity where the rules are clear and that we don't subsidize sloth.
    My problem is that many people assume our system is safety net, when it could be very clearly seen, that it's a way of reshuffling the deck for political gain.
    Well, what happens is that the system helps some and not others, because frankly, some people do not have enough moral fiber to be helped for whatever reason. Thats not really a failure of either ideology, but a fact of human nature and as long as there are allowances for that (which I will admit is lacking on the liberal side, but I have made proposals to fix that in the loft), then the system we constructed will be fine (with some financial adjustment due to the current recession and reduction in government revenues)

  2. #212
    Sage
    Harry Guerrilla's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Not affiliated with other libertarians.
    Last Seen
    09-01-17 @ 02:38 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    28,955

    Re: Progressive Grading in School

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    Well, what happens is that the system helps some and not others, because frankly, some people do not have enough moral fiber to be helped for whatever reason. Thats not really a failure of either ideology, but a fact of human nature and as long as there are allowances for that (which I will admit is lacking on the liberal side, but I have made proposals to fix that in the loft), then the system we constructed will be fine (with some financial adjustment due to the current recession and reduction in government revenues)
    I don't blame liberals for their beliefs like that though.
    I think modern liberalism is very intuitive and that's what draws many people to it.
    Although I do not believe everything that is intuitive is right.

    When I speak of reverberations I'm thinking very broadly, from things not considered social welfare to things considered as such.
    I think the fatal flaw in education is that people believe they pay the whole cost and that when you pay for something to be done, you are not expect to do anything else to help it.
    Education is somewhat funded through progressive taxation and that the true cost is not born by the majority of individuals who use it and thus they treat it cheaply.

    This is just an example, but I hope it makes sense.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

  3. #213
    Count Smackula
    rathi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    California
    Last Seen
    10-31-15 @ 10:29 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    7,890

    Re: Progressive Grading in School

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    Depends on what you consider "perfectly functioning."

    It's not vague at all, I think it's pretty well comparable.
    It's about discussing the solutions to problems and how they are not necessarily long term solutions.

    Your stupid proposal completely ignores the reality that the real life effects of implementing both system are completely different. Your worthless analogy is irrelevant compared to what actually happens meatspace. Do you honestly think that implementing progressive education is going to have the same economic impact on consumer spending and investment as a progressive income tax?
    Last edited by rathi; 04-30-11 at 07:31 PM.

  4. #214
    Sage
    Harry Guerrilla's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Not affiliated with other libertarians.
    Last Seen
    09-01-17 @ 02:38 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    28,955

    Re: Progressive Grading in School

    Quote Originally Posted by rathi View Post
    Your stupid proposal completely ignores the reality that the real life effects of implementing both system are completely different. Your wothless analogy is irrelvent compared to what actually happens meatspace. Do you honestly think that implementing progressive education is going to have the same economic impact on consumer spending and investment as a progressive income tax?
    No I believe they have the same effect of cheapening the results of achievement through "work."

    It is not a stupid analogy, I have clearly explained that we are focused on the remediation of inequality and that both forms do not fix the problems of those inequalities by simply giving people "things."
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

  5. #215
    Teacher of All Things


    Josie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    28,361

    Re: Progressive Grading in School

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    Because very few children are in acute danger of losing their homes, food, humanity, whatever else due to bad grades (at least in this country). While the same is not true for adults who may lose their job or be unable to find a job for whatever reason.
    Agreed. Let's move past the grade thing now and go to food. You make a good argument for progressive food prices. Many children of people who pay no income taxes are STILL going hungry or not getting adequate nutrition because the parents cannot afford groceries. Would you support a progressive system where the rich pay more for their food than the poorer do?


  6. #216
    Global Moderator
    Rage More!
    Your Star's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Georgia
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Liberal
    Posts
    26,362

    Re: Progressive Grading in School

    Quote Originally Posted by Mellie View Post
    Agreed. Let's move past the grade thing now and go to food. You make a good argument for progressive food prices. Many children of people who pay no income taxes are STILL going hungry or not getting adequate nutrition because the parents cannot afford groceries. Would you support a progressive system where the rich pay more for their food than the poorer do?
    I would just support food stamps.
    Eat me, drink me, love me;
    Laura make much of me

  7. #217
    Teacher of All Things


    Josie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    28,361

    Re: Progressive Grading in School

    Quote Originally Posted by Your Star View Post
    I would just support food stamps.
    But we wouldn't even need food stamps under this plan. The uber rich would have to pay 2x to 3x more than the average middle class person. Anyone on poverty level would get their food for free. Everyone would have an ID card that identified them as to which "level" they were on. That card would be scanned at the grocery counter and either you pay less than average, average, more or none.

    The store could use the extra money from the uber rich people to pay their workers more. The rich have the money - they can afford it. Why shouldn't they be obligated to pay more?


  8. #218
    Count Smackula
    rathi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    California
    Last Seen
    10-31-15 @ 10:29 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    7,890

    Re: Progressive Grading in School

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    No I believe they have the same effect of cheapening the results of achievement through "work."

    It is not a stupid analogy, I have clearly explained that we are focused on the remediation of inequality and that both forms do not fix the problems of those inequalities by simply giving people "things."
    If you want to argue that the progressive income tax doesn't help with equality, that is fine. I'd probably agree with you on some points. Howver, you invetning a braindead proposal like progressive education and trying to pretend its the same as progressive taxation is a false argument. The systems have vastly differing real world impacts and thus cannot be treated the same.

    Since you seem to like analogies, I'll try one on you. Your argument is like making a straw man of mike tyson, punching that straw man in the face, and claiming you can knock out the actual Mike. In truth, you might be able to knock out mike tyson, but the only way you can prove that if you get into the ring with the real man himself.

  9. #219
    Sage
    pbrauer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Oregon
    Last Seen
    11-27-15 @ 03:31 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    25,394

    Re: Progressive Grading in School

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    It's not a comparison between grades and taxes.
    It's a comparison between grades and income, where both are considered final results and are progressively taxed to help those at the bottom of both scales.
    It's an apple and oranges comparison. The more you earn, you progressively use more of the commons taxes pay for.


  10. #220
    Sage
    Harry Guerrilla's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Not affiliated with other libertarians.
    Last Seen
    09-01-17 @ 02:38 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    28,955

    Re: Progressive Grading in School

    Quote Originally Posted by rathi View Post
    If you want to argue that the progressive income tax doesn't help with equality, that is fine. I'd probably agree with you on some points. Howver, you invetning a braindead proposal like progressive education and trying to pretend its the same as progressive taxation is a false argument. The systems have vastly differing real world impacts and thus cannot be treated the same.

    Since you seem to like analogies, I'll try one on you. Your argument is like making a straw man of mike tyson, punching that straw man in the face, and claiming you can knock out the actual Mike. In truth, you might be able to knock out mike tyson, but the only way you can prove that if you get into the ring with the real man himself.
    The results of progressively taxing grades, widely agreed by everyone here, results in the person receiving those grades, not getting a education, But merely getting grades.

    I'm trying to get people to think that shuffling grades is analogous to shuffling income, both resulting in no long term solution to learning, whether it be math or learning to provide for oneself.

    Do you now see the analogy I'm trying to make?
    That it is somewhat comparable?
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

Page 22 of 29 FirstFirst ... 122021222324 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •