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  • It helps the economy.

    12 34.29%
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Thread: Government stimulus

  1. #1
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    Government stimulus

    Does government spending stimulate the economy or hurt it?

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    Re: Government stimulus

    It hurts... and it doesn't even help the economy in the long run either. The money is so much for efficiently spent by the people, instead of feeding it to an endless money dump a.k.a. the federal government.

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    Re: Government stimulus

    Quote Originally Posted by garb View Post
    Does government spending stimulate the economy or hurt it?
    I think the choices are not an "either or" situation.
    Government spending can stimulate the economy and hurt it at the same time.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
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    Re: Government stimulus

    Quote Originally Posted by garb View Post
    Does government spending stimulate the economy or hurt it?
    Well I was sure hoping it would help everybody keep their jobs but that didn't happen. I don't get that our politicians at all understand how important not losing a job is. It is devastating to a family. To the American dream. All that money and you all couldn't keep people working? Cleaning beaches and parks. Painting government buildings? Helping to teach kids? Coaching sports? Directing traffic? Working at a hospital. Preparing government property for sale. Patching pot holes and sidewalks, I don't know. There's a million things need to be done that don't take years of study and planning. Make some effort to help people till things get better!

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    Re: Government stimulus

    The PEOPLE don't spend money they've borrowed from China, AND their debts aren't passed down to their grand children.

    Clearly government spending, which today means borrowing, is far more harmful.

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    Re: Government stimulus

    Quote Originally Posted by garb View Post
    Does government spending stimulate the economy or hurt it?
    let's see. we're going to take money from a small business owner through taxes, or from an investor through the sale of bonds


    .....and spend it studying robot bees.


    yeah, i can't see the economic inefficiency there. the business owners and investors probably would have spent that money on something foolish, like hiring new employees.

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    Re: Government stimulus

    Quote Originally Posted by celticwar17 View Post
    It hurts... and it doesn't even help the economy in the long run either. The money is so much for efficiently spent by the people, instead of feeding it to an endless money dump a.k.a. the federal government.
    okay celtic, new rule. since you always say what i wish i had thought of saying before i get to say it, you're not allowed to post in an interesting thread until i have.

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    Re: Government stimulus

    Quote Originally Posted by garb View Post
    Does government spending stimulate the economy or hurt it?
    When there is a recession, or depression, and there is no money being spent in the private market, government spending can shorten the recession by getting the markets moving again. This is the course proscribed by most economists and from our own experience in how government spending for the war during the Great Depression helped bring us out of it, just as our stimulus spending prevented us from continuing on our path in 2007 to another Great depression. Instead, things have improved so much the Republicans are proposing giving the rich more tax cuts.
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    Re: Government stimulus

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    When there is a recession, or depression, and there is no money being spent in the private market, government spending can shorten the recession by getting the markets moving again.
    except that, of course, the government has to raise that money by taxation or borrowing.

    which means (roughly) that it is responsible for the market not spending private money - because the private money is being diverted into politicians favorite projects.

    from our own experience in how government spending for the war during the Great Depression helped bring us out of it
    on the contrary, the US did not recover from the Great Depression until the 1950's; we went through a growth boom when government dramatically cut spending following the succesful conclusion of WWII.

    just as our stimulus spending prevented us from continuing on our path in 2007 to another Great depression
    : HOW???



    let's see, what is the most successful handling of such a recession in the last century of American history?

    oh, i remember, it was the Harding Administration

    ...America’s greatest depression fighter was Warren Gamaliel Harding. An Ohio senator when he was elected president in 1920, he followed Woodrow Wilson who got America into World War I, contributed to the deaths of 116,708 Americans, built up huge federal bureaucracies, imprisoned dissenters and incurred $25 billion of debt, for which he has been much praised by historians.

    Harding inherited the mess, in particular the post-World War I depression – almost as severe, from peak to trough, as the Great Contraction from 1929 to 1933, that FDR inherited and prolonged. Richard K. Vedder and Lowell E. Gallaway, in their book Out of Work (1993), noted that the magnitude of the 1920 depression "exceeded that for the Great Depression of the following decade for several quarters." The estimated gross national product plunged 24% from $91.5 billion in 1920 to $69.6 billion in 1921. The number of unemployed people jumped from 2.1 million in 1920 to 4.9 million in 1921...

    Harding’s Budget and Accounting Act of 1921 provided a unified federal budget for the first time in American history. The act established (1) the Bureau of the Budget with a budget director responsible to the president, and (2) the General Accounting Office to help cut wasteful spending.

    In the fall of 1921, Harding’s Secretary of Commerce Herbert Hoover prompted him to call a Conference on Unemployment. Hoover wanted government intervention in the economy, which as president he was to pursue when he faced the Great Depression a decade later, but Harding would have none of it. Good thing, since Hoover’s policies were to prolong the Great Depression...

    Federal spending was cut from $6.3 billion in 1920 to $5 billion in 1921 and $3.2 billion in 1922. Federal taxes were cut from $6.6 billion in 1920 to $5.5 billion in 1921 and $4 billion in 1922. Harding’s policies started a trend. The low point for federal taxes was reached in 1924. For federal spending, in 1925. The federal government paid off debt, which had been $24.2 billion in 1920, and it continued to decline until 1930...

    With Harding’s tax cuts, spending cuts and relatively non-interventionist economic policy, the gross national product rebounded to $74.1 billion in 1922. The number of unemployed fell to 2.8 million – a reported 6.7% of the labor force – in 1922. So, just a year and a half after Harding became president, the Roaring 20s were underway! The unemployment rate continued to decline, reaching a low of 1.8% in 1926 – an extraordinary feat. Since then, the unemployment rate has been lower only once in wartime (1944), and never in peacetime.


    "The seven years from the autumn of 1922 to the autumn of 1929," wrote Vedder and Gallaway, "were arguably the brightest period in the economic history of the United States. Virtually all the measures of economic well-being suggested that the economy had reached new heights in terms of prosperity and the achievement of improvements in human welfare. Real gross national product increased every year, consumer prices were stable (as measured by the consumer price index), real wages rose as a consequence of productivity advance, stock prices tripled. Automobile production in 1929 was almost precisely double the level of 1922. It was in the twenties that Americans bought their first car, their first radio, made their first long-distance telephone call, took their first out-of-state vacation. This was the decade when America entered ‘the age of mass consumption.’"...
    Last edited by cpwill; 04-24-11 at 06:48 AM.

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    Re: Government stimulus

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    except that, of course, the government has to raise that money by taxation or borrowing.
    It was raised by borrowing as the decsion was made to provide tax cuts instead of paying for it. Once the economy has fully recovered we should cut spending and raise taxes for the rich to pay down the debt, just as we did after we recovered after the Great Depression. This approach resulted in the strongest half century for the midddle class in our history!


    on the contrary, the US did not recover from the Great Depression until the 1950's; we went through a growth boom when government dramatically cut spending following the succesful conclusion of WWII.

    "the years of the Great Depression (1929–1939)"

    Great Depression in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    I would agree with you that as soon as we conclude our wars we should drasicatically cut spending. Our military spending could easily be cut by 4/5 and still be the most powerful military force on the planet. And of course the tax cuts for the rich will have to end if we are to ever get serious about paying down our national debt.

    : HOW???

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    let's see, what is the most successful handling of such a recession in the last century of American history?

    oh, i remember, it was the Harding Administration
    "The verdict of history has been severe on Harding. Despite Harding's landside victory, he is considered by many historians to have been the worst Ameican president. A recent biographer thinks that Harding should be related higher. He thinks the affair with Nan Britton, which he disputes, was responsible to a great extent for Harding's reputation. [Dean] HPC might put Bucannan and Hoover ahead of him. Despite the financial scandals, there is no evidence that Harding was personally involved. While Harding was undeniably a poor president, he did little actual damage -- unlike Bucannan and Hoover. Precisely where Hardingb ranks in the Pantheon of American presidents is debateable. That he ranks near the bottom most historians would agree. One historian writes, "The presidency of Warren G. Harding began in mediocrity and ended in corruption." [Fass]
    Warren Harding
    Last edited by Catawba; 04-24-11 at 07:40 AM.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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