View Poll Results: Should the Young be allowed to Escape Paying In when they will never Draw Out?

Voters
40. You may not vote on this poll
  • NO - I am over 40, and they should have to pay for me, even if they never draw out

    2 5.00%
  • YES - I am over 40, and they should be allowed to do so

    9 22.50%
  • SORTA - I'm over 40; they should be allowed to split their FICA between themselves and me

    3 7.50%
  • YES - I am under 40 and I would much rather not pay into an SS system I will never draw from

    21 52.50%
  • NO - I am under 40; I feel it's my obligation to pay the Boomers, though I will never see a dime

    5 12.50%
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Thread: Should the Young be Allowed to Opt Out?

  1. #81
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    Re: Should the Young be Allowed to Opt Out?

    Quote Originally Posted by lovetosing4678 View Post
    I am 21 and currently a full time student. Last year I was a full time student and working 30 hours a week at 9 dollars an hour. The MAJORITY of taxes taken out of my paycheck was SS. I will not see a penny of that money in my future. If I was given that money in my paycheck, I might have had money to save. But when you are already taking out a large percentage of my check and putting it somewhere I wont get it, you don't leave any room left for me to save on my own. My dad is currently supporting me, if it wasn't for him, I couldn't afford school, medicine, maybe even rent working full time. I look at how expensive things are and then look at my paycheck and wonder how people are supposed to make ends meet without the help of others. I think things need to DRASTICALLY change for those of us who are young will be able to live in the future. I do not need the government to help me retire, just give me my money so I can spend it as I need. If a person doesn't save let them live on the street. It is there fault.
    I really liked your post. It was dead on illustrative of the trouble you and most others are in. You need to be saving much more than SS taxes are taking from your check. Your daddy is financing you so your savings are essentially negative. When do you think you will start saving for retirement? Your daddy is essentially paying your SS taxes. Good thing too since you don’t know how to save yet and may never learn. Are you full time this year? How much do you expect to earn upon graduation? You can spend all of $50,000/year net w/o saving a bit for retirement. You wrote “I look at how expensive things are and then look at my paycheck and wonder how people are supposed to make ends meet without the help of others.” Hey, those others need to retire too. If we all had a Daddy we wouldn’t need SS; but there aren’t enough Daddies to go around. Are you spending your Daddy’s retirement? Is he just going to be left with a too small SS check at retirement?

  2. #82
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    Re: Should the Young be Allowed to Opt Out?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nonplussed View Post
    It's not your neighbor's obligation to care about your retirement.
    Oh please... I never said it was. I am not saying I expect anything from anybody, however, I come from a family and have the attitude that people should care for other people. I help people and I do volunteer work. It's not my obligation to donate money to Haiti but I did. It's not obligation to work in a support group and help survivors of rape and incest in my community, but I do.

    I do those things, because I care about people and I care about my community. I am not forced to do by the government, and I am not arguing that it should be forced by the government. I simply feel it's my obligation as a human being to stop injustices.

    I am complaining that this is an institutionalized attitude that needs to be changed... of course I know nobody is really obligated to help anybody else. All I am saying is that I find your attitude to be ****ty, and why an 80 year eating cat food would look to the government to help her before looking for good and willing Samaritans in her community to help her.

    You probably think liberals are the problem... when in fact, I think the liberals are trying to help because society is infected with people like you, not willing to help other people.

    That was your obligation. That is your family's obligation.
    Once you're 18, your family isn't obligated to do **** for you.

    If you're 80 years old and eating cat food, you're parents are dead... and your kids might not give a **** about your old ass or have the money to support you.

    People don't want to feel like a burden at any stage in their life... When you're old, you lose your independence...

    I don't care about your retirement. I care that my retirement is taken care of and that I can support my parents and other elderly family members with the help of my generation within the family.
    I know you don't care about your community or anybody else but your own... We have established your ****ty attitude is far from being a solution to these issues.

    When I have to care for you and your lack of planning and your family's apathy toward their own (editorial "you", not the personal "you"), it takes away from my ability to elevate the quality of life for those I actually do care about.

    It's not society's problem. It's a private matter between seniors and their family's.
    It is societies problem... Again, you are mistaken if you think ignoring the impoverished isn't going to affect you. You can beat your drum on and on about this all you want, but they have a right to vote and they might as well ignore your lecturing and scolding and vote for more social assistance if nothing else is done. Then all you'll be able to do is keep repeating this tried old rhetoric, and repeating it, and repeating it... because you have nothing to offer.
    Last edited by SheWolf; 04-22-11 at 02:59 PM.

  3. #83
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    Re: Should the Young be Allowed to Opt Out?

    Quote Originally Posted by OhIsee.Then View Post
    I really liked your post. It was dead on illustrative of the trouble you and most others are in. You need to be saving much more than SS taxes are taking from your check. Your daddy is financing you so your savings are essentially negative. When do you think you will start saving for retirement? Your daddy is essentially paying your SS taxes. Good thing too since you don’t know how to save yet and may never learn. Are you full time this year? How much do you expect to earn upon graduation? You can spend all of $50,000/year net w/o saving a bit for retirement. You wrote “I look at how expensive things are and then look at my paycheck and wonder how people are supposed to make ends meet without the help of others.” Hey, those others need to retire too. If we all had a Daddy we wouldn’t need SS; but there aren’t enough Daddies to go around. Are you spending your Daddy’s retirement? Is he just going to be left with a too small SS check at retirement?
    Dude, she's 21 in college making 9 bucks an hour. It's a time in her life when Daddy is supposed to be helping her financially. Jeeze.

    That's the whole thing, too. If you saw more Dad's like hers supporting the next generation, that generation will be better equipped to support the Dad's in their old age.

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    Re: Should the Young be Allowed to Opt Out?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nonplussed View Post
    It happens now. But it was never the norm. Unless you can show evidence of this elderly holocaust prior to SS, it didn't happen.
    That's enough emotional, hyperbole and exaggeration of what I said. If you want to keep living in a fantasy world, that's your prerogative.

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    Re: Should the Young be Allowed to Opt Out?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nonplussed View Post
    Dude, she's 21 in college making 9 bucks an hour. It's a time in her life when Daddy is supposed to be helping her financially. Jeeze.

    That's the whole thing, too. If you saw more Dad's like hers supporting the next generation, that generation will be better equipped to support the Dad's in their old age.
    My dad is physically disabled... I support him, he doesn't support me.

  6. #86
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    Re: Should the Young be Allowed to Opt Out?

    Shewolf, the problem is that SS is a tax - you are not guaranteed to get anything. The government owes you nothing
    There isn't any money to pay out.
    Just think about it logically, too. The first generation who got SS did fantastically. They paid barely anything in and got so much money. Now, eventually someone's going to have to bite the bullet for that. It is either going to be one generation, or spread out over a few, but somebody is going to get ****ed by SS.
    There's a person on this forum who brags about getting 10x more than he put in and what a great investment it was. The problem is that it ISN'T an investment. SS gets 'invested' into government bonds. Yay, we see interest on that, right? No, not really. The interest paid on those government bonds gets paid for by, guess who? Us, via other taxes.
    So, the problem is that the SS 'fund' only generates 'interest' through other taxes. We end up paying for it anyway. Right now, there's a ton of liabilities, we're running a deficit (or soon will be, I forget which it is) on it and there's no end in sight. Reforming SS just means we're going to spread the burden across more generations until it ends up collapsing anyway and screwing over everyone who had yet to receive anything. Or, cut it now and screw over everyone who had yet to receive anything as of now.

    SS isn't going to end well. For everyone under 50 now, it's a game of hot potato, but the ****ed up part is we're all left with the potato in the end. Let's look to see who wrote themselves checks, payable by their kids and grandkids.
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  7. #87
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    Re: Should the Young be Allowed to Opt Out?

    Quote Originally Posted by lovetosing4678 View Post
    In case, you can't scroll up in the thread to read what I wrote...

    Shewolf, I plan on becoming more politically involved and try make a difference. I have accepted the fact that for the time being the government will take my money for SS and I believe I will not get that back. To think any different is dumb in my opinion. The government cannot afford to pay us back for it. Your statement seems to be they cant do that, thats not fair. O well... You seem to be more lay down and take it than me. Changes need to be made in the government. LOTS of them. That is done through voting in politicians that can make a difference. The government does a lot of things that they shouldn't be doing. Why do you think that because you ask the government... well hey, I gave you my money as a loan, can I have it back? they will give it to you? Unrealistic.
    I am not willing to take it from the government.... I will fight the government on this, and I will write politicians. You'll know my name if the government thinks they are going to rob me and my generation.

    Don't get me wrong... I think they might try, but it's still unconstitutional, and my generation will be in power eventually. If the government outright robs us, and the people don't complain about it, then we are all ****ed and this country, and the founders dream would be entirely lost.

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    Re: Should the Young be Allowed to Opt Out?

    Social security is a multi-level corporation. The top of the pyramid received the best benefits years ago. Now it is too big to fail.(sound familiar). I cannot speak for all, if one cannot at least benefit from the SS taxes withheld by the government, the people should have a shot at putting that money towards another option.
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    Re: Should the Young be Allowed to Opt Out?

    Quote Originally Posted by iamitter View Post
    Shewolf, the problem is that SS is a tax - you are not guaranteed to get anything. The government owes you nothing
    There isn't any money to pay out.
    Just think about it logically, too. The first generation who got SS did fantastically. They paid barely anything in and got so much money. Now, eventually someone's going to have to bite the bullet for that. It is either going to be one generation, or spread out over a few, but somebody is going to get ****ed by SS.
    There's a person on this forum who brags about getting 10x more than he put in and what a great investment it was. The problem is that it ISN'T an investment. SS gets 'invested' into government bonds. Yay, we see interest on that, right? No, not really. The interest paid on those government bonds gets paid for by, guess who? Us, via other taxes.
    So, the problem is that the SS 'fund' only generates 'interest' through other taxes. We end up paying for it anyway. Right now, there's a ton of liabilities, we're running a deficit (or soon will be, I forget which it is) on it and there's no end in sight. Reforming SS just means we're going to spread the burden across more generations until it ends up collapsing anyway and screwing over everyone who had yet to receive anything. Or, cut it now and screw over everyone who had yet to receive anything as of now.

    SS isn't going to end well. For everyone under 50 now, it's a game of hot potato, but the ****ed up part is we're all left with the potato in the end. Let's look to see who wrote themselves checks, payable by their kids and grandkids.
    It is a tax but all taxes have laws and regulations. Some people are exempt from paying into SS... some people are exempt from paying federal income taxes. Just because it's collected in the form of a tax doesn't mean it's ok or legal... If the federal government doesn't repay us the federal government is essentially violating their contract with the people. It would be like putting somebody who wouldn't ordinary owe federal taxes in the 10% income bracket without changing the laws and forcing them to pay, because the federal government wants some more money.

  10. #90
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    Re: Should the Young be Allowed to Opt Out?

    I think the young should be allowed to opt out but also forfeit SS benefits. If you pay into a system that will never ever return that back to you then that's legalized theft in my opinion.
    When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser. -Socrates
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