View Poll Results: Should we Eliminate Social Security

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  • Yes, no replacement

    18 30.00%
  • Yes, but with a replacement

    11 18.33%
  • No, we should wait until it goes bankrupt

    1 1.67%
  • No, its not going to go bankrupt

    26 43.33%
  • Other

    4 6.67%
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Thread: Should we Eliminate Social Security?

  1. #251
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    Re: Should we Eliminate Social Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by repeter View Post
    I never said that. I said the people's power to disrupt the government after they've established it by voting is limited. That means we can't do whatever we want. The Constitution already establishes the extent of the government's power, but that is a somewhat seperate subject.
    Sorry, I was confused by your previous post. You were Talking about the constitution and said the powers reserved to the people are very limited, when in reality our powers should encompass everything besides what the govt is specifically authorized to do.
    Give a man a fish, or he will destroy the only existing vial of antidote.

  2. #252
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    Re: Should we Eliminate Social Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by repeter View Post
    Not exactly sure you could attribute that to SS. You could attribute that to stupid, inefficient government as a whole.
    Precisely why these pie in the sky programs shouldn't be done in the first place.
    They never live up to their budgetary expectations.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
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  3. #253
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    Re: Should we Eliminate Social Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    i am confused (admittedly, a frequent state). do you stand by the above post or this one?
    One is a matter of practicality and the other a philosophical one, the way our government was meant to be. If we suddenly got a tyrannical gOvernment, we probably couldnt do much. We don't have the tanks...
    Sorry for any misspellings or random caps. My iPhones autocorrect is acting up.
    Give a man a fish, or he will destroy the only existing vial of antidote.

  4. #254
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    Re: Should we Eliminate Social Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by repeter View Post
    Its not jsut the fact that it hasn't been overturned, it hasn't even been challenged in a serious way before, at least not that I've ever heard. Given its 70 year history, I would think that somewhere along the line it becomes evident it is constitutional for any number of reasons.
    70 years isn't that long and the fact that a lot of judges rely on stare decisis is problematic.


    Quote Originally Posted by repeter View Post
    And those powers are very, very limited. It does not include the power to determine the constitutionality of legislative/executive actions.
    Sure it does, a lot of the FF's thought we should use nullification in the event of unconstitutional actions by the feds.

    Quote Originally Posted by repeter View Post
    Its more than what they were, it was what we needed at the time. Back then, we needed a level of facist control over the country, and we needed someone to take charge.

    We didn't need that now, though we needed it to a small extent following 9/11 IMO, and we got it.
    That's nonsense.
    FDR was a great sales man, he tricked a lot of people into believing that what he did was even successful, as far as economic policy goes, but it wasn't.

    Reading the letters and journals of his appointments reveals, they didn't know what they were doing.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
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  5. #255
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    Re: Should we Eliminate Social Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    It succeeded, the supreme court let him get away with his nonsense.
    Get away as in not impeach him, or act against him?
    Veni. Vidi. Vici.
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  6. #256
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    Re: Should we Eliminate Social Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by iamitter View Post
    Sorry, I was confused by your previous post. You were Talking about the constitution and said the powers reserved to the people are very limited, when in reality our powers should encompass everything besides what the govt is specifically authorized to do.
    Oh, I gotcha, sorry for miscommunicating as well.
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  7. #257
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    Re: Should we Eliminate Social Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by repeter View Post
    Get away as in not impeach him, or act against him?
    They didn't vote against his contested policies, after the threat of court packing.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

  8. #258
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    Re: Should we Eliminate Social Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    70 years isn't that long and the fact that a lot of judges rely on stare decisis is problematic.
    Its long enough for a challenge to be made against SS. Without respecting precedent, we'd put a lot of decision-making ability on thousands of judges across the country, and that would make everything a lot more complicated, and more likely to get messed up.

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    Sure it does, a lot of the FF's thought we should use nullification in the event of unconstitutional actions by the feds.
    That argument ended along with the Civil War.

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    That's nonsense.
    FDR was a great sales man, he tricked a lot of people into believing that what he did was even successful, as far as economic policy goes, but it wasn't.

    Reading the letters and journals of his appointments reveals, they didn't know what they were doing.
    Even pretending to know what you're doing is taking charge. We needed a strong executive and thats what FDR was.
    Veni. Vidi. Vici.
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    The Only Thing to Fear is Fear Itself.
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  9. #259
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    Re: Should we Eliminate Social Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    They didn't vote against his contested policies, after the threat of court packing.
    I don't think that would have had any effect on their decisions. It was obvious the scheme was unconstitutional on its face, and was not going to get anywhere with Congress.
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  10. #260
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    Re: Should we Eliminate Social Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by repeter View Post
    Its long enough for a challenge to be made against SS. Without respecting precedent, we'd put a lot of decision-making ability on thousands of judges across the country, and that would make everything a lot more complicated, and more likely to get messed up.
    Not really, these things can languish for long periods of time.
    A lot of the intent behind it not being overturned is that no judge wants to be the guy that ended SS.
    He'd be villified.

    Quote Originally Posted by repeter View Post
    That argument ended along with the Civil War.
    Why?
    What's wrong with it?

    Quote Originally Posted by repeter View Post
    Even pretending to know what you're doing is taking charge. We needed a strong executive and thats what FDR was.
    No, we just suffer from historical revisionism that came after FDR.
    The guy was clever but not good.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

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