View Poll Results: Should we Eliminate Social Security

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  • Yes, no replacement

    18 30.00%
  • Yes, but with a replacement

    11 18.33%
  • No, we should wait until it goes bankrupt

    1 1.67%
  • No, its not going to go bankrupt

    26 43.33%
  • Other

    4 6.67%
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Thread: Should we Eliminate Social Security?

  1. #121
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    Re: Should we Eliminate Social Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by sazerac View Post
    Then I promise you there will be a huge disaster when these people who were supposed to be saving up on their own weren't saving up on their own because they couldn't save up on their own. And so our government decides it is going to bail out these people and you are going to have to pay for your retirement and the retirement of about three others, too.

    Is there anything about your system that prevents this from happening?
    Because that's exactly what happened up until the 1930s, right? Oh wait, it didn't!
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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  2. #122
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    Re: Should we Eliminate Social Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by sazerac View Post
    All of this requires the government. Aren't you just making adjustments to the program?
    Somewhat, yes. It is simply making adjustments to how the system works to make it as lightly tied ot the government as possible.

    In the old system individuals paid in money that goes into the generalized budget that congress can then spend however damn well they please while others are being paid out. The money you pay in is never really meant for you, but is rather more akin to a wager. You're paying now gambling on the notion that they're going to have the money to pay you later. Individuals can very easily end up taking out more money then they put in by the end of it as well.

    In this system you're putting money into an account that is essentially buying government trusts. What you put in is what you get back, with a bit of interest. The government can not use your money for anything else, and no one else gets your money (and you don't get anyone elses). Your retirement money is free of all taxes as it goes in before tax and comes out without tax. The only government involvement is the administering of the account.

    This is where the realistic side of me comes into play, and I fully admit that. I do not see us significantly and entirely getting rid of entitlement programs across the board in this country. Its just not going to happen. Which means that we're, as tax payers, going to end up having to take care of people who don't take care of themselves in some fashion. So if we're going off that, I think this is a far better way as, while yes the government is telling you what to do with your money, it is still staying as YOUR money that you WILL get and even more than that you'll get without the government actually taking any.

  3. #123
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    Re: Should we Eliminate Social Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    SS could easily be replaced with a simple to use investment portfolio spread.
    The options could be defaulted as easy for the individual to select and understand, those that want more complex options would have to opt to do so.

    A privatized SS system doesn't need a line in the government budget and is self sustaining.

    Edit: Hell the retirement age could be set to 55 or whenever you have accrued enough assets to retire on.
    It could be based on a formula, would be really awesome in my opinion.
    I retired at 57, my wife a few years later. We both timed our retirements with company incentives to leave early. I got 9 months pay, she got about a years worth of pay. It has always been doable, people just have to DO IT.
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  4. #124
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    Re: Should we Eliminate Social Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    Yes, absolutely, that's the whole purpose of having them in the first place. They are intended for use specifically by those who have put into the system, not as a part of the general fund.

    Personally, I don't want the government to have access to those funds in any way, shape or form.
    agree, and we should make sure that Wall Street doesn't abuse their stewardship of OUR money while it is in their hands....
    Oracle of Utah
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  5. #125
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    Re: Should we Eliminate Social Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mayor Snorkum View Post
    Just imagine how prosperous it could have been if the rich weren't being robbed.
    Robin Hood is the tax man?
    I have been poor, the SOB never gave any of it to me.
    I am well off now, 6 figure retirement income, about 3/4 mil in assets. My taxes aren't killing me....or maybe Robin Hood hasn't noticed me yet.
    Oracle of Utah
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  6. #126
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    Re: Should we Eliminate Social Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rick345 View Post
    While its always a going idea to pay off all debts before retiring and I would go as far as buy yourselves a nice present a nice trip, big screen TV, seasons tickets to whatever sport you enjoy... Don't attempt all three and don't do it at all if you can't afford it but, treat yourself one last time before retirement you deserve it.

    However, to phase out SS is a mistake and assuming one will make even moderate gains on investments is foolish. Any and every type of investment can go bust in a hurry. While stocks out do all other types of investments over time they offer no secuity. Nor is property, T-Bills, CD's or anything for that matter. While I think people should have private investments along side their 401K's and SS we still need a secure government backed system as a safety net if all else fails.

    What I tell people about investing is invest starting as early as you can and sock away as much as you can afford even if its only five bucks a paycheck because we all tend to spend everything we make and then some. But, even over 40 years if all you could sock away was 5K and the economy tanked so bad you were only left with 2500 bucks at retirement time its 2500 bucks more than you would have had if you didn't invest anything.

    What retirement investors are presently asking those nearing retirement is "Well it probably a good idea to consider what kind of part time job you'd like after you retire." While the economy will recover and your 401K will recover the economy tanks about every 15-20 years and if you retire just before a down turn or just after a down turn you're in a world of hurt.

    In the forty years I've been working I've seen my retirement funds collapse twice once in the early 90's and in the present and I've resigned myself to the fact that I'll have to work till I die.
    I agree with part of your post....but...
    Having luxuries that you can't afford is where people start to fail, especially if carrying credit card debt.
    Get the security first, then the fun....
    if your retirement funds collapsed twice, try more eggs in different baskets....
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  7. #127
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    Re: Should we Eliminate Social Security?

    I love to hear people say that some of us are too poor to save for our own future.
    Fact is, the number of truly poor in this country is miniscule. My wife and I have always had savings, and spending money, even when just an E5 in the Navy. Some of my siblings are jealous of our success, but at the same time won't do what we did.
    Earn it, save some of it....

    One sister was telling us she can barely pay her grocery bills for her kids while she was opening a fresh carton of cigarettes.

    I have been around a few decades and can repeat some funny and stupid excuses I have heard from people who simply have their priorities wrong.
    Your future is up to YOU, deal with it....
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  8. #128
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    Re: Should we Eliminate Social Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by repeter View Post
    I was reading an article on Yahoo News, and it stated that 20% of your tax dollars go to Social Security. Now, given the fact that SS is going to go bankrupt in the future, and the way its set up is inherently wasteful, should we cut it completely before it dies on its own?

    I'd say yes, but with the caveat that we should look into establishing a market in the private sector to replace it.
    Although I am a con I am for Social Security, but it need be reformed an to help poor go back in jobs.
    Rom 6:23:For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

  9. #129
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    Re: Should we Eliminate Social Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by iamitter View Post
    Give me one good incentive to work if all my income is being redistributed anyway.
    Personal freedom means that if I work harder than you, I will end up better off than you.
    Well saying your wealth is already somewhat redistributed and has been. I just believe in a extremely progressive tax system like we had back in the 50's. Now that still kept the rich working to get their money now didnt it?
    If that is your whole beef on socialism is the progressive tax system that often comes with a socialist economy then


  10. #130
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    Re: Should we Eliminate Social Security?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    ah. so you prefer to live in low tax, free market economic systems like what we had during the 1920's?
    I believe he is talking about the 50's................


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