View Poll Results: Do you have to be proud of your country to be a good citizen?

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  • yes

    14 22.95%
  • no

    42 68.85%
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    4 6.56%
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Thread: Do you have to be proud of your country to be a good citizen?

  1. #121
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    Re: Do you have to be proud of your country to be a good citizen?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    I'm not proud of my country. In fact, I find the whole idea of patriotism to be outdated...and really not all that different from odious concepts like "white pride." Why would you be proud of something you have no control over? I mean, it was only an accident of birth that you were born where you were, instead of in the backwaters of Uganda. If you're an immigrant to your country, I can understand being proud of that accomplishment, but I still don't understand "pride in one's country."

    What is there to be proud of? Some imperfect men (who aren't me) who happened to exist within the arbitrarily-defined borders of my "country" did some stuff a long time ago that led to the foundation of this country, over which I am nominally a part? I guess I could understand that THEY would have pride in their own accomplishments...but why would *I* be proud of it? I wasn't the one who did it.

    I think that patriotism - like white nationalism - tends to be used to justify all sorts of harmful behavior against anyone who isn't part of the "in-group." Sometimes it's pretty blatant xenophobia ("I don't want to press 1 for English") and sometimes it's more subtle ("they hate us for our freedom"), but the end result is typically the same: Stupid actions that harm others for no discernible reason.
    Sorry no disrepect intended but your post is tripe, how can you compare being patriotic and loving ones country to being a neo nazi or a white supremist only a liberal could make that absurd connection
    Last edited by lpast; 04-21-11 at 08:58 AM.

  2. #122
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    Re: Do you have to be proud of your country to be a good citizen?

    Quote Originally Posted by lpast View Post
    Sorry no disrepect intended but your post is tripe, how can you compare being patriotic and loving ones country to being a neo nazi or a white supremist only a liberal could make that absurd connection
    What's the point of being "proud" over an accident of birth, regardless of whether it's your nationality or your race? Why is it socially acceptable to say that we're proud of the accomplishments of our fellow Americans, whereas people would (rightly) be criticized for saying that they're proud of the accomplishments of their fellow whites?
    Last edited by Kandahar; 04-21-11 at 09:05 AM.
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  3. #123
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    Re: Do you have to be proud of your country to be a good citizen?

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    Bringing subjectivity and ambiguity into the discussion was intentional. I want to know how people feel about the subject and unless I explicitly define it for them, it has to be there to make room for people's views to be expressed.
    Yes, I understand. And here we are...

    all ambiguous... and stuff.

  4. #124
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    Re: Do you have to be proud of your country to be a good citizen?

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive View Post
    Except for the fact that most liberals pay their taxes and many join the military including my father, all of my uncles, one of my cousins and both of my grandfathers. Try harder.
    That's not hard. Most liberals don't pay their taxes. What percentage of the folks who pay no income tax, 47% of the people, are liberals? Most.

    And I agree. There was a time before the socialist took over that liberals did join the military. Like your father, your uncles, one of your cousins, and your grandfathers. I'm proud of them. And you?

    Why do you think the liberals work so hard to disenfranchize the military?

  5. #125
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    Re: Do you have to be proud of your country to be a good citizen?

    This really goes back to socialization. Something that happens before we're even born and continues to develop and evolve us into who we are until the moment we die. It is our entire life and how the things around us effect us.

    To answer the question: Yes I am proud of my country, but no, you do not have to be proud of it to be a good citizen. Look at it like this.

    Within a family, we are born into it and grow up. While growing up, many of us are taught the importance of protecting our family name and wearing it with pride. It is a part of who defines us. The clean image that it carries will open doors that might otherwise be closed had it been tarnished by prior generations.

    That pride is instilled in us when we are small and we are expected to carry it forward in our lives. However, as time presses forward things beyond our control can and do happen. A cousin who wears that same last name might be arrested for an embarrassing crime. Let's say he urinated in the Mayor's beer and deficated in the councilman's soup.

    Okay, that would be pretty embarrassing if the paper ran the headline as:

    "Jones Takes Dump in Councilman Soup While Refilling Mayor's Coffee!" I don't know, you come up with one.

    At any rate, the surname of Jones has now been tarnished by someone and that tarnishing was completely and totally ut of your control. Obviously your not proud of your drunken cousin's behavior and this might lower the pride you have for your name, but it does not make you a bad member of the family. You will still defend your family and do all the things that are expected of you, regardless of what your cousin did.

    Now, you might not be proud of everything your country has done, but does that mean you won't defend your country in it's time of need? I think we'd be hard pressed to find anyone who will not stand up to defend their country when the immediate situation confronts them. Only a true coward would allow others to harm their family as they stood by and the same holds true for our country, in my opin.

  6. #126
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    Re: Do you have to be proud of your country to be a good citizen?

    Quote Originally Posted by Patrickt View Post
    That's not hard. Most liberals don't pay their taxes. What percentage of the folks who pay no income tax, 47% of the people, are liberals? Most.
    Do you have a link for this?

    And I agree. There was a time before the socialist took over that liberals did join the military. Like your father, your uncles, one of your cousins, and your grandfathers. I'm proud of them. And you?

    Why do you think the liberals work so hard to disenfranchize the military?
    Liberals still join the military including some members of this website. And don't assume you have the right to question how I feel about my family members who served in the military. Of course I'm proud, if only because they would rip into for the bull**** your spewing all over this board.
    Last edited by ThePlayDrive; 04-28-11 at 12:27 PM.

  7. #127
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    Re: Do you have to be proud of your country to be a good citizen?

    Quote Originally Posted by TheBook View Post
    I'd argue that the best thing a citizen can do is to criticize. It means they haven't settled and believe in making their country better.

    Perfect is inherently unattainable. Striving to push your country closer to that unattainable ideal is truly admirable.
    Not when the push is toward a bigger government and socialism. That's when patriots need to push back and push back hard.
    Catawa is my favorite bleeding heart liberal.
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  8. #128
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    Re: Do you have to be proud of your country to be a good citizen?

    Quote Originally Posted by TacticalEvilDan View Post
    Speaking of painfully obvious, pointing out that one California Senator wants to socialize one specific industry doesn't come anywhere near refuting the comment, "The majority of democrats are not in favor of [socialism]." Not even when you point out that she represents other people.

    Unless, of course, you're positing that the majority of Democrats in this country live in California, and that they all voted for her.
    There's a boatload of socialists in the democratic congress. Their black Caucus and their Progressive caucus are full of them.
    Catawa is my favorite bleeding heart liberal.
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    Re: Do you have to be proud of your country to be a good citizen?

    Sometimes a truly good citizen has a moral and civic obligation to call his/her nation out when it's f'ing things up.

  10. #130
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    Re: Do you have to be proud of your country to be a good citizen?

    Quote Originally Posted by Barbbtx View Post
    There's a boatload of socialists in the democratic congress. Their black Caucus and their Progressive caucus are full of them.
    I'm pretty sure there's a socialist party for socialists...

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