View Poll Results: Will you go see the Atlas Shrugged movie?

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  • Hell, yes

    16 32.65%
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    24 48.98%
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Thread: Atlas Shrugged movie

  1. #71
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    Harry Guerrilla's Avatar
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    Re: Atlas Shrugged movie

    Quote Originally Posted by samsmart View Post
    You mean her.

    Here's a place where you can get a pretty good overview of her.

    Ayn Rand - Television Tropes & Idioms
    I think it's better to hear her, in her words.
    She did Donahue in the 70's or 80's and explains the Objectivist system in greater detail.

    Most of what is understood of Objectivism is a misunderstanding.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
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  2. #72
    Educator TheBook's Avatar
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    Re: Atlas Shrugged movie

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    Rand purposefully wrote her characters to be romanticized.
    That's kind of the point.
    This smacks of arguments I hear in defense of Stephanie Meyer.

    Just because an author does something that is low-quality intentionally, that doesn't increase its quality.

    Honestly I have nothing positive to say about Ayn Rand, Atlas Shrugged, or Objectivism. Rand was a hypocrite (as she used both Social Security and Medicare payments and tried to hide said use while claiming only the weak and unworthy had to rely on them), Atlas Shrugged was poorly written and Objectivism is easy to debunk as an Ethical system (as it involves arbitrary discrimination, it is unethical for the same reasons racism is).
    “The more you know, the harder it is to take decisive action. Once you become informed, you start seeing complexities and shades of gray. You realize that nothing is as clear and simple as it first appears. Ultimately, knowledge is paralyzing.” - Bill Watterson
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  3. #73
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    Re: Atlas Shrugged movie

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    Most of what is understood of Objectivism is a misunderstanding.
    To be fair, though, the reason why that is probably has to do more because she was trying to illustrate it via fictional novels rather than through more practical essays.

    Which is why I probably won't see the movie and won't read the book. It's far, far too utopian for me. Such, Rand's philosophy can work when you have the ideal people. But we don't have ideal people, just like we don't live on an ideal world, or in an ideal universe. So I'm very much a critic of idealist philosophies. Give me realpolitik any day.
    Also, we need to legalize recreational drugs and prostitution.

  4. #74
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    Re: Atlas Shrugged movie

    Quote Originally Posted by TheBook View Post
    This smacks of arguments I hear in defense of Stephanie Meyer.

    Just because an author does something that is low-quality intentionally, that doesn't increase its quality.
    That's your take on it, I've never read it but I understand what the purpose of the story and characters were about.

    They were supposed to be "super men/women."
    Doing things that are unbelievable to tell a tail with an idea behind it.
    Not much different than Vonnegut and his "Harrison Bergeron" short story.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheBook View Post
    Honestly I have nothing positive to say about Ayn Rand, Atlas Shrugged, or Objectivism. Rand was a hypocrite (as she used both Social Security and Medicare payments and tried to hide said use while claiming only the weak and unworthy had to rely on them), Atlas Shrugged was poorly written and Objectivism is easy to debunk as an Ethical system (as it involves arbitrary discrimination, it is unethical for the same reasons racism is).
    Having an ideal philosophy and living in an non ideal world does not make someone a hypocrite.

    "Hypocrisy is an unconscious self-contradiction: a state of incongruence between one's professed beliefs and feelings and one's actual beliefs and feelings, or an application of a criticism to others that one does not apply to oneself."

    "Hypocrisy is not simply a lie, saying something which one knows to be false. Neither is it simply failing to practice those virtues that one preaches."

    Hypocrisy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    You're applying your form of ethics to Objectivism and then saying that debunks it?
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
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  5. #75
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    Re: Atlas Shrugged movie

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    Watched a few things about her and she said that she enjoyed romanticized art, saying that it inspires people to do great things.
    Something a long those lines.

    Romanticized man = ideal
    I guess I am a more practical person than she is. I prefer to deal with real things whenever possible.

  6. #76
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    Re: Atlas Shrugged movie

    I thought the book was good.


    The movie though, would probably be boring...
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

  7. #77
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    Re: Atlas Shrugged movie

    Quote Originally Posted by samsmart View Post
    To be fair, though, the reason why that is probably has to do more because she was trying to illustrate it via fictional novels rather than through more practical essays.

    Which is why I probably won't see the movie and won't read the book. It's far, far too utopian for me. Such, Rand's philosophy can work when you have the ideal people. But we don't have ideal people, just like we don't live on an ideal world, or in an ideal universe. So I'm very much a critic of idealist philosophies. Give me realpolitik any day.
    Actually, its quite the contrary as most people act as self interested individuals, in almost all manners of life.
    It's getting them to realize it, that is more of the point.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

  8. #78
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    Re: Atlas Shrugged movie

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    I guess I am a more practical person than she is. I prefer to deal with real things whenever possible.
    It's a story dude.

    Books are meant as an escape or to express ideas through narratives.
    I don't prefer fiction books, just not my thing but some works of fiction are worth reading.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

  9. #79
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    Re: Atlas Shrugged movie

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    It's a story dude.

    Books are meant as an escape or to express ideas through narratives.
    I don't prefer fiction books, just not my thing but some works of fiction are worth reading.
    True, it is a story. However writing style has very much to do with whether a particular audience will enjoy it. Theres a reason every writing class in the world says "consider your target audience"

  10. #80
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    Re: Atlas Shrugged movie

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    I don't think you have a firm grasp on the fact that supply-and-demand are theoretical forces which do not and cannot operate untrammeled and in a free environment. There are far too many forces at work that distort the operation of s-and-d for it ever to be applicable to a living economic environment.
    Utter tripe, people respond to incentives. And there are practical uses for understanding the types of actions that effect supply and demand. We know what happens to a market when we increase costs, and smart businessmen use this understanding to their advantage in pricing etc... The same applies to the cost of employment and the value a job brings to a company.

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    Not for the workers. A decent wage = success for the workers and that is often in conflict with delivering maximum optimal profit. In which case your libertarian society merely becomes one engulfed in class warfare, pretty much like the current state of affairs.
    If you don't find a job worth its wage, find another because someone else would be glad to have it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    A society just waiting for the inequalities of income to become so huge that society explodes into civil war again. Nice prospect.
    I find paying extortion money via taxes/social services/income redistribution to those who would otherwise seize wealth through force a far worse prospect. Let them come for me, I'll be prepared.

    More importantly, what makes you so certain that civil war would be inevitable should the productive leave everyone else behind (in income and standard of living)? Do you truly think standards of living for the relatively poor would go down under pure capitalism? I believe they would go up for everyone, but MUCH faster for some, so much so that by comparison, though the relatively poor would be better off, they would look 3rd world compared to what the unbridled rich would be capable of.
    Last edited by Spartacus FPV; 04-05-11 at 03:34 PM.
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    no. You cannot lose rights you do not have in the first place. There is no such thing as the right to have any weapon of your choice regardless of any other consideration. It simply does not exist.

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