View Poll Results: If the government shuts down due to defunding who is at fault?

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Thread: If the government shuts down due to defunding who is at fault?

  1. #61
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    Re: If the government shuts down due to defunding who is at fault?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    House Republicans have passed a budget. Senate Republicans stand ready to vote on it. there is only one party refusing to allow a Budget to go forward, and right now that is the democrats.
    Make This Perfectly Clear:

    The House Republicans passed the budget the Democrats, who had majority control of the House and Senate, and the White House, refused to do last year. Before anyone starts complaining about the Republican budget, they have to first explain their vote for the Democrats who simply were too incompetent to do their job.

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    Re: If the government shuts down due to defunding who is at fault?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    Personally, I don't think a government shutdown will cause much issue, except perhaps temporarily for some government employees.
    EVERY subcontractor for "non-essential" government services, will cease to operate the minute the money from the goverment stops flowing. All those employees will be "furloughed" or flat out laid-off. Those people will stop engaging in commerce, which will cause other companies to suffer if the Democrats continue to refuse to sign onto the budget presented to them.

    Oh, did the Mayor put the blame squarely on the Democrats who didn't have the 'nads to pass a budget last year, like they were supposed to? You better believe it. Their first offer was to trim a WHOPPING four billion dollars and claim that's all they could reasonably provide. Really? The goal is the end of deficits, and the Democrats are looking in the other direction.

    It's their fault. All of it.

    And, regarding budget, I think many of the methods used to arrive at a budget need drastically changed.
    Right.

    Very first thing on every budget line item must be a statement that this spending is consistent a specific delegated power in Article I, Section 8 of the Constitution, and naturally, all honest people are fully aware that the phrase "general welfare" is not a specified power.

    Heck, honest people even know that the phrase "general welfare" does not mean the socialist scams perpetrated on America in the 20th and 21st Centuries.

    So, First Step: Query - Is It Constitutional, or "What Would James Madison Say?"

    Note Well, Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, Education, Welfare, NPR, the NEA, etc are only the begining of a list of items that don't meet Constitutional muster.

    Second Step: - The Federal Budget Should not have more pages than Barney Frank.

    People should be able to read the thing.

    Third Step: GAAP. Generally Accepted Accounting Principles. Use them. It's how the rest of America works and what the IRS expects when it audits a business.

    Fourth Step: The President requires a line-item veto to eliminate wasteful and plain wrong spending. If NPR is so wonderful its fans can get it voted back in by overriding the veto. This should be Amendment 29. Amendment 28 will limit the terms of Congressmen and Senators so they can stop wasting taxpayer funds widening the Capitol doors to fit their bloated heads through.

    First off, the main goal of a budget should be to aim for a spending point that is less than the expected revenue.
    Since we’re talking government here, we should shoot for, I would say, 97.5% of the expected revenue at most, since there WILL be cost overruns…And any extra can go to paying off the national debt, or into a "rainy day" fund in case we run across a war we NEED to fight...unlike some of the more recent ones...
    Any "surplus" should go towards the next years budget and taxes reduced accordingly to return the overcharge to the people. Under no circumstances should the Congress be led to believe that they can create a surplus to stuff into a slush fund for later use. Nothing slushier than a rainy winter's day. If we need to fight a war, ie, the US is attacked, then the rules can be written to sell bonds ...after the proper declaration of war is passed by Congress. There should be enough reserve in the military to handle short term crises.

    Secondary goal should be adequate funding of military and intelligence forces (which may need streamlining in some cases) to ensure the security of our country.
    Edit: I should add that if a threat of proportions great enough to demand more than 97.5% of our revenue arises, we're probably screwed anyway, which is why national defense/security is secondary.
    DO THE MATH.

    If...no, WHEN the Cascadia fault ruptures, it will damage the Washington/Oregon/maybe California coast to the tune of $300 billion. That's 93% right there. One would expect an emergency fund to be a minimum of 15% of the annual budget. One would also expect that it would take a 2/3 vote of the House and the Senate to unlock it.

  3. #63
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    Re: If the government shuts down due to defunding who is at fault?

    Given that the latest stop gap has some rather onerous policy measure in it. I now blame the republicans for using the issue to grandstand.

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    Re: If the government shuts down due to defunding who is at fault?

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    Given that the latest stop gap has some rather onerous policy measure in it. I now blame the republicans for using the issue to grandstand.
    BS. we are in this position because Democrats spent all of last year refusing to pass a budget because they didn't want to admit what they were spending before the midterms.

    the "onerous policy measures"? no publicly funded abortion in DC? both Obama and Reid voted for that in 2009! and Reid did so in 2008, 2007, 2006.... the only real change is the EPA no-passing-cap-and-trade measure. which isn't grandstanding, that's stopping the EPA from an unconstitutional siezure of power.


    Republicans in the House have not only led with multiple continuing resolutions, (including the last one, which would have paid the troops in case of a government shut down, which Obama called 'a distraction" and threatened to veto) and a budget. they have done - in the middle of all this - what the Democrats failed to find time to do all last year.


    what a load.
    Last edited by cpwill; 04-08-11 at 08:06 AM.

  5. #65
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    Re: If the government shuts down due to defunding who is at fault?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    BS. we are in this position because Democrats spent all of last year refusing to pass a budget because they didn't want to admit what they were spending before the midterms.

    the "onerous policy measures"? no publicly funded abortion in DC? both Obama and Reid voted for that in 2009! and Reid did so in 2008, 2007, 2006.... the only real change is the EPA no-passing-cap-and-trade measure. which isn't grandstanding, that's stopping the EPA from an unconstitutional siezure of power.


    Republicans in the House have not only led with multiple continuing resolutions, (including the last one, which would have paid the troops in case of a government shut down, which Obama called 'a distraction" and threatened to veto) and a budget. they have done - in the middle of all this - what the Democrats failed to find time to do all last year.


    what a load.
    Thank you Democrats for making me use my savings because you can't do your job.

  6. #66
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    Re: If the government shuts down due to defunding who is at fault?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpgrad08 View Post
    Thank you Democrats for making me use my savings because you can't do your job.
    let's both be grateful that A) we have savings and B) we don't have to worry about our kids because of this. some guys will.

  7. #67
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    Re: If the government shuts down due to defunding who is at fault?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    let's both be grateful that A) we have savings and B) we don't have to worry about our kids because of this. some guys will.
    C. Glad am single and don't have the worries of a family man right.
    D. Fox news was some breaking news that there might be a deal.

  8. #68
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    Re: If the government shuts down due to defunding who is at fault?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mayor Snorkum View Post
    EVERY subcontractor for "non-essential" government services, will cease to operate the minute the money from the government stops flowing. All those employees will be "furloughed" or flat out laid-off. Those people will stop engaging in commerce, which will cause other companies to suffer if the Democrats continue to refuse to sign onto the budget presented to them.

    Oh, did the Mayor put the blame squarely on the Democrats who didn't have the 'nads to pass a budget last year, like they were supposed to? You better believe it. Their first offer was to trim a WHOPPING four billion dollars and claim that's all they could reasonably provide. Really? The goal is the end of deficits, and the Democrats are looking in the other direction.

    It's their fault. All of it.
    I wouldn't say ALL of it...

    But I would say the majority of it...

    And in my mind, “non-essential” needs redefined…

    Among many other things…

    Like what constitutes unemployment….

    For some reason, the official unemployment number =/= the number of people who have need of a job.

    But meh.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mayor Snorkum View Post
    Right.

    Very first thing on every budget line item must be a statement that this spending is consistent a specific delegated power in Article I, Section 8 of the Constitution, and naturally, all honest people are fully aware that the phrase "general welfare" is not a specified power.

    Heck, honest people even know that the phrase "general welfare" does not mean the socialist scams perpetrated on America in the 20th and 21st Centuries.

    So, First Step: Query - Is It Constitutional, or "What Would James Madison Say?"

    Note Well, Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, Education, Welfare, NPR, the NEA, etc are only the beginning of a list of items that don't meet Constitutional muster.

    Second Step: - The Federal Budget Should not have more pages than Barney Frank.

    People should be able to read the thing.

    Third Step: GAAP. Generally Accepted Accounting Principles. Use them. It's how the rest of America works and what the IRS expects when it audits a business.

    Fourth Step: The President requires a line-item veto to eliminate wasteful and plain wrong spending. If NPR is so wonderful its fans can get it voted back in by overriding the veto. This should be Amendment 29. Amendment 28 will limit the terms of Congressmen and Senators so they can stop wasting taxpayer funds widening the Capitol doors to fit their bloated heads through.
    My idea is somewhat more likely to occur, methinks...Although that's not saying much...

    Quote Originally Posted by Mayor Snorkum View Post
    Any "surplus" should go towards the next years budget and taxes reduced accordingly to return the overcharge to the people. Under no circumstances should the Congress be led to believe that they can create a surplus to stuff into a slush fund for later use. Nothing slushier than a rainy winter's day. If we need to fight a war, i.e., the US is attacked, then the rules can be written to sell bonds ...after the proper declaration of war is passed by Congress. There should be enough reserve in the military to handle short term crises.
    Interesting point... Any kind of surplus would need to be extremely well protected from poaching...

    Not keeping the surplus around (as in your suggestion) is probably the safest way.

    One of the problems is, if I understand it correctly, that if there's a surplus in some area of government, the next year funding can (and IMO, should) be reduced on that area...so no government agency/department lets themselves have a surplus, since they don't want to be somewhat reduced in funds...

    Quote Originally Posted by Mayor Snorkum View Post
    DO THE MATH.

    If...no, WHEN the Cascadia fault ruptures, it will damage the Washington/Oregon/maybe California coast to the tune of $300 billion. That's 93% right there. One would expect an emergency fund to be a minimum of 15% of the annual budget. One would also expect that it would take a 2/3 vote of the House and the Senate to unlock it.
    I have no knowledge of this potential disaster, outside knowing there are faults in that area, and they shift every so often...So I cannot make any kind of educated guess on how accurate you are.

    That said, does this statement not somewhat contradict your previous contention that we shouldn't have a "rainy day fund"?
    Or did I miss something?

    WOT!!! *cringe*
    Education.

    Sometimes I think we're alone. Sometimes I think we're not. In either case, the thought is staggering. ~ R. Buckminster Fuller

  9. #69
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    Re: If the government shuts down due to defunding who is at fault?

    Shutdown is 7 and a half hours away...

    Get ready for spin.

  10. #70
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    Re: If the government shuts down due to defunding who is at fault?

    Budget debates should always happen after elections. Can you imagine how bad this debate would be if there were an election next week on top of it?

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