View Poll Results: What kinds of private schools would you support vouchers for?

Voters
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  • Any religious private school that included religious education/indoctrination.

    0 0%
  • Specific religious private schools that included religious education/indoctrination.

    1 3.33%
  • Religious private school that only use tax dollars for secular education.

    1 3.33%
  • Any religious private school whose education is secular.

    2 6.67%
  • Non-religious private schools.

    6 20.00%
  • I support school vouchers regardless of the type of school.

    8 26.67%
  • I do not support school voucher at all regardless of the private school.

    13 43.33%
  • other/I do not know

    4 13.33%
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Thread: What kinds of private schools would you support vouchers for?

  1. #11
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    Re: What kinds of private schools would you support vouchers for?

    I don't support vouchers. Taxes go to public schools and we should work on fixing poor performing public schools, not on helping a few lucky kids go to private schools while the unlucky ones stay in the crap schools.

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    Re: What kinds of private schools would you support vouchers for?

    I support vouchers. If parents are spending money for their kids to go to private school they aren't receiving government funding that would go towards their child if they did. I have no problem with that money being given to families in the form of vouchers. Personally, I support scrapping public education and making all schools private that would be funded by parents and vouchers. Our current education system is failing.
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  3. #13
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    Re: What kinds of private schools would you support vouchers for?

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive View Post
    I don't support vouchers. Taxes go to public schools and we should work on fixing poor performing public schools, not on helping a few lucky kids go to private schools while the unlucky ones stay in the crap schools.
    Doesn't vouchers allow the unlucky kids to go to private schools instead of staying at crap schools? Besides that why would you want those unlucky kids to be stuck at crap school instead of going to a private school?
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

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  4. #14
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    Re: What kinds of private schools would you support vouchers for?

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    Doesn't vouchers allow the unlucky kids to go to private schools instead of staying at crap schools? Besides that why would you want those unlucky kids to be stuck at crap school instead of going to a private school?
    They will be stuck in the public schools because the private schools can discriminate on admission. This means that the private schools don't have to take children who might need a little extra work.

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    Re: What kinds of private schools would you support vouchers for?

    Fine arguments.

    Misses the point that right now the private schools are not skimming the cream, and yet public schools are simply not able to educate those capable of being taught. Therefore, if the private schools were allowed to take the "cream of the crop", more children capable of being educated would be educated, which is the putative goal of public education spending, and those who cannot be educated will be no worse off. The median level of education would rise, the number of students exposed to crass unionism would decline, the number of parents aware that their children are receiving a crappy education in that publicly funded warehouse would rise, and overall, the pressure to improve education without spending even more tax dollars would increase, which would in turn improve the quality of educatoin at the public warehouses...er schools.

  6. #16
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    Re: What kinds of private schools would you support vouchers for?

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    Doesn't vouchers allow the unlucky kids to go to private schools instead of staying at crap schools? Besides that why would you want those unlucky kids to be stuck at crap school instead of going to a private school?
    I agree with OhReally?.

    Also, there are public schools all over the country that work and produce good students. It seems to me that we should focus on implementing what already works in those schools in the poor performing schools. I also have a problem with paying taxes so that kids can go to private schools instead of the public schools that the government has the responsibility and the ability to make better.

    I get that vouchers would help some students get a better education, but it seems like putting a bandaid on a gaping wound.

  7. #17
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    Re: What kinds of private schools would you support vouchers for?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mayor Snorkum View Post
    Fine arguments.

    Misses the point that right now the private schools are not skimming the cream, and yet public schools are simply not able to educate those capable of being taught.
    But why is this true? First it is true that if you cannot pay or do not get a scholarship, you likely will not be attending a private school. Vouchers might change that, however without forcing private schools who accept tax dollars to have an open enrollment policy, you cannot guarantee an improvement in education results for students who are not currently in private schools. Why can't public schools educate? Because their primary goal has been forced to change. Public schools are unfortunately the primary "parent" for many of their students. They are forced into advanced babysitting the students who are problem causers. In addition, increased class sizes don't help the teachers ability to work with the students.

    Therefore, if the private schools were allowed to take the "cream of the crop", more children capable of being educated would be educated, which is the putative goal of public education spending, and those who cannot be educated will be no worse off.
    You are making the assumption that private schools will take students. Again, they are not required to do so. Until that point your assertion is merely hoping that things will change.

    The median level of education would rise, the number of students exposed to crass unionism would decline, the number of parents aware that their children are receiving a crappy education in that publicly funded warehouse would rise, and overall, the pressure to improve education without spending even more tax dollars would increase, which would in turn improve the quality of educatoin at the public warehouses...er schools.
    Not exactly. Again without putting private schools on an equal playing field, none of this will happen. Beyond that, you are leaving students who's parents cannot pay the difference to languish in the public system.

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    Re: What kinds of private schools would you support vouchers for?

    Quote Originally Posted by OhReally? View Post
    They will be stuck in the public schools because the private schools can discriminate on admission. This means that the private schools don't have to take children who might need a little extra work.
    Oh, they can?

    That's nonsense. The current voucher system in use strictly prohibits discrimination on race, sex, religion, blah blah blah. Any idiot can go to college these days. That some schools have stricter academic entrance requirements than others isn't strange. They have standards to meet and an image to maintain.

    But I don't see anyone complaining that Stanford has a more restrictive entrance policy that UC Davis. The voucher system for the lower levels of public education funding will introduce much needed competition into the education market. Right now only the rich can send their spawn to private schools, (for the sake of argument we're going just ignore the catholic schools that perform much much better than public schools for less than half the money) and people with smart children and no money are doomed to see their child's future squandered on a sub-standard publicly funded education system that views each child as nothing but a head to be counted for money in homeroom who must be kept in his age related peer group throughout school.

    Enabling vouchers, if the unconstitutional practice of federal funding for education is continued, allows those gifted children unlucky enough to be born to rich parents, the opportunity to show the rich brats that money can't buy brains. Now, you're an obvious proponent of class envy, you should be happy to give the wealthy this tweak on their upturned noses.

    But you're not. You want to see talented children held back and stifled to preserve a status quo that's beneficial to no one but educrats and union members. Why is that?

  9. #19
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    Re: What kinds of private schools would you support vouchers for?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mayor Snorkum View Post
    Oh, they can?

    That's nonsense. The current voucher system in use strictly prohibits discrimination on race, sex, religion, blah blah blah.
    Not discrimination based on race, etc., discrimination based on academic ability and behavior problems....

  10. #20
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    Re: What kinds of private schools would you support vouchers for?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mayor Snorkum View Post
    Oh, they can?
    Yes, absolutely.

    That's nonsense
    No, it's a sad fact.

    The current voucher system in use strictly prohibits discrimination on race, sex, religion, blah blah blah. Any idiot can go to college these days. That some schools have stricter academic entrance requirements than others isn't strange. They have standards to meet and an image to maintain.
    First, you cannot compare financial aid for college to basic funding for primary and secondary schools. They are two different animals. College is not mandatory while primary/secondary education is. Because college is not mandatory, they are permitted to set standards for entrance. And colleges DO discriminate on sex and religion. It is why we have all female colleges like Wellesley or Christian colleges.

    But I don't see anyone complaining that Stanford has a more restrictive entrance policy that UC Davis.
    Because they do not participate in a level of education that is mandatory.

    The voucher system for the lower levels of public education funding will introduce much needed competition into the education market.
    On this we can agree.

    Right now only the rich can send their spawn to private schools
    Not exactly true. Most private schools offer academic scholarships for students who are excellent in terms of academics.

    (for the sake of argument we're going just ignore the catholic schools that perform much much better than public schools for less than half the money)
    Let's not ignore them. Let's talk about them. Catholic schools have the right to refuse service to students they don't want. Public schools do not. Public schools must find some accommodation for students.

    and people with smart children and no money are doomed to see their child's future squandered on a sub-standard publicly funded education system that views each child as nothing but a head to be counted for money in homeroom who must be kept in his age related peer group throughout school.
    False, see above. Smart children can apply for scholarships to private schools. In addition, there are valid reasons that both private and public schools try to keep children with their age group for at least part of the day. It promotes positive social interaction on a developmental level for which the student is prepared.

    Enabling vouchers, if the unconstitutional practice of federal funding for education is continued, allows those gifted children unlucky enough to be born to rich parents, the opportunity to show the rich brats that money can't buy brains.
    I don't dispute that enabling vouchers CAN help children. I have stated that in virtually every post relating to vouchers. I also noted that the bulk of funding for education comes from the LOCAL level so the question of Constitutionality is virtually void. Federal funds make up a small portion of the budget in schools when viewed as a whole.

    Now, you're an obvious proponent of class envy, you should be happy to give the wealthy this tweak on their upturned noses.
    Funny, the only way I would be an obvious proponent of class envy is if you failed to actually read my posts.

    But you're not. You want to see talented children held back and stifled to preserve a status quo that's beneficial to no one but educrats and union members. Why is that?
    Again, you failed to read. I am all for vouchers if the playing field is level. You cannot improve public schools without putting their competition on the same level. If you want public schools to perform at the levels of private schools, eliminate mandatory education and the requirements for public schools to take all who wish to be educated. I frankly don't care which way you do it, but the playing field must be level lest you create the class envy you claimed I have.

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