View Poll Results: Should the government be able to prevent discriminating against job applicants?

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Thread: Can employers reject applicants who have a criminal history

  1. #51
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    Re: Can employers reject applicants who have a criminal history

    I was asked by a reporter once what we could do to protect women in relationships. I had two suggestions. One was that both parties should be required to make a full financial and criminal history disclosure. Second, since people are quite likely to discount anything negative the disclosures reveal, they should have to get letter approving of the relationship from six friends.

    A man called me about a family member's boyfriend. I broke the news that the boyfriend had gone to prison for murder. Shot his brother seven times. The gun didn't hold seven shots so he obviously reloaded and kept shooting. The man said, "Wait till she hears this." "Oh, she knows but it doesn't matter. It wasn't his fault, nobody understands, and their love is so great it will conquer all." He called the next day to asked me how I knew.

    I'm all for full disclosure. For the government to withhold information citizens need to make decisions is wrong, imo.

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    Re: Can employers reject applicants who have a criminal history

    Quote Originally Posted by TOJ View Post
    First off, the chance of you getting that is slim to none and slim left town.

    That said however, I misspoke. We do not do the checks, ourself. For USA based employees, we give the position requirements to a couple of offshore companies. Those requirements always include extreme honesty and trustworthness. We get a list of folks that meet those requirements. So far, these two companies have not disappointed us.

    .
    Ok that's not really what we're talking about on this thread, though.

    Company has position open, company discriminates against off-the-street applicant.

  3. #53
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    Re: Can employers reject applicants who have a criminal history

    Employers shouldn't reject applicants based purely on prejudice. However, they should be able to reject an applicant based on, for example, a determination that he is dangerous. Criminal records sometimes don't fairly represent the personality and propensity of people, but I think there are cases where, for example, you have a guy with three different violent assault incidents. I think it's safe to assume that is not a person you want representing your business, and to reject him on those grounds.

    I can't think of an easy way for the government to regulate in this area, so they should probably just leave it alone.

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    Re: Can employers reject applicants who have a criminal history

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Ok that's not really what we're talking about on this thread, though.

    Company has position open, company discriminates against off-the-street applicant.
    I guess I missed that qualifier somewhere. I thought it was about Can employers reject applicants who have a criminal history and that expanded to include bad credit.

    .

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    Re: Can employers reject applicants who have a criminal history

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    I totally agree. I think discrimination because of a previous felony should be enforced with the same vigor as race/religion/sex. If one's previous crime has nothing to do with the job for which one is being interviewed, I think it's very wrong to discriminate.

    Many men and women who've served their time want nothing more than to "go straight." If we are going to go out of our way not to hire felons who've served their time, we might as well just shoot them. I think it's very wrong to discriminate in this way -- and very sad for those who are trying their best to get their lives together.
    "I think it's very wrong to discriminate" - this seems to be the basis for your argument (and everyone's) - Though I may agree with you, my point is, does that matter? This questions isn't a question of should companies discriminate. But rather should it be made illegal for them to discriminate? Two completely different questions. One questions morals, on which we agree partially. The other questions what can be made illegal. Can the government intervene so much that can tell a company why it can't deny somebody work? Regardless of right or wrong, can the government say that every person has the RIGHT to be considered for a job, regardless of gender, race, age and criminal background? Isn't THAT the choice of the company? If no, why not??? Why doesn't the company get to choose that?

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    Re: Can employers reject applicants who have a criminal history

    Quote Originally Posted by fredmertz View Post
    "I think it's very wrong to discriminate" - this seems to be the basis for your argument (and everyone's) - Though I may agree with you, my point is, does that matter? This questions isn't a question of should companies discriminate. But rather should it be made illegal for them to discriminate? Two completely different questions. One questions morals, on which we agree partially. The other questions what can be made illegal. Can the government intervene so much that can tell a company why it can't deny somebody work? Regardless of right or wrong, can the government say that every person has the RIGHT to be considered for a job, regardless of gender, race, age and criminal background? Isn't THAT the choice of the company? If no, why not??? Why doesn't the company get to choose that?
    I think it should be against the law to discriminate based on gender, race, age, religion, family and felony status. It is in society's best interest to protect certain groups of people. There's nothing sadder than a guy who's served his time and can't find a job. He's paid his debt. Let him feed his family. And himself.
    The devil whispered in my ear, "You cannot withstand the storm." I whispered back, "I am ​the storm."

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    Re: Can employers reject applicants who have a criminal history

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    I think it should be against the law to discriminate based on gender, race, age, religion, family and felony status. It is in society's best interest to protect certain groups of people. There's nothing sadder than a guy who's served his time and can't find a job. He's paid his debt. Let him feed his family. And himself.
    I agree that it is a sad situation for the person who really is trying to get back on his feet and society should try to help that person.

    But I think it is MORE immoral for the government to tell me that I must consider an ex-convict equally to the man who has always been hard working and law-abiding for a job in which I need utmost trust (i.e. balancing my books). Isn't that a decision I, as the owner of my company, should be able to make freely?

    When convicted of a misdemeanor or felony, their immediate punishment is jail-time, community service and/or fines. The other consequence is the inevitable judgment people will make for the rest of the ex-convicts life. And it is the right of the people to make such judgments. Can the government really enforce people to not judge other people? Isn't that limiting our freedom to think and act freely?
    Last edited by fredmertz; 03-30-11 at 11:15 AM.

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    Re: Can employers reject applicants who have a criminal history

    I found this if anyone is interested...
    RECENT EEOC DEVELOPMENTS INVOLVING DISQUALIFICATION OF APPLICANTS BASED ON CRIMINAL HISTORY

    Furthermore, we would ask the Commission to emphasize the categorical bars on the employment of persons who have been
    convicted of serious violent crimes will not violate Title VII as long as the prohibition is demonstrated by the employer to be job related and consistent with business necessity, which I think is consistent with what you’ve heard from others.
    Good ppiece with a lot of information, including details on several legal actiosn in process on this topic.

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    Re: Can employers reject applicants who have a criminal history

    Quote Originally Posted by fredmertz View Post
    I agree that it is a sad situation for the person who really is trying to get back on his feet and society should try to help that person.

    But I think it is MORE immoral for the government to tell me that I must consider an ex-convict equally to the man who has always been hard working and law-abiding for a job in which I need utmost trust (i.e. balancing my books). Isn't that a decision I, as the owner of my company, should be able to make freely?

    When convicted of a misdemeanor or felony, their immediate punishment is jail-time, community service and/or fines. The other consequence is the inevitable judgment people will make for the rest of the ex-convicts life. And it is the right of the people to make such judgments. Can the government really enforce people to not judge other people? Isn't that limiting our freedom to think and act freely?
    Well, the government is enforcing people to not judge other people for a variety of criteria already. I'd have to say that our world has become a better place because of it. I think many are missing the point here. "Have you been convicted of a felony?" should, in my opinion, be removed from job applications. In and of itself, I think that is discriminatory. That doesn't mean that a company has to hire a felon. It just means that he/she cannot be excluded from further consideration simply because they answer "yes" to that question. It costs about $15 to check public records through a background check service. If I'm being considered for a roofer job, I just don't think it's relevant that I have a record for passing a bad check.

    Again, if we're not going to allow felons who've done their time to reintegrate into society as rehabilitated human beings, we should just shoot them. Hyperbole to the max. Ha!
    The devil whispered in my ear, "You cannot withstand the storm." I whispered back, "I am ​the storm."

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    Re: Can employers reject applicants who have a criminal history

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    Well, the government is enforcing people to not judge other people for a variety of criteria already. I'd have to say that our world has become a better place because of it. I think many are missing the point here. "Have you been convicted of a felony?" should, in my opinion, be removed from job applications. In and of itself, I think that is discriminatory. That doesn't mean that a company has to hire a felon. It just means that he/she cannot be excluded from further consideration simply because they answer "yes" to that question. It costs about $15 to check public records through a background check service. If I'm being considered for a roofer job, I just don't think it's relevant that I have a record for passing a bad check.

    Again, if we're not going to allow felons who've done their time to reintegrate into society as rehabilitated human beings, we should just shoot them. Hyperbole to the max. Ha!
    certainly, as a roofer, I wouldn't not consider an ex-convict for the job because he is an ex-convict. If I'm hiring somebody for payroll who had previously been worked the books of another company, I may want to discriminate against that person for that reason. The government shouldn't be able decide what job applications the "Have you been convicted of a felony?" box should be on and when it shouldn't. The world is better because of the non-discriminatory laws, I agree. But society/individual companies should be able to decide whether or not an ex-felon should be able to apply for a particular job within society. Society should decide if an ex-convict should be able to re-integrate into society. Not the government.

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