View Poll Results: Should I join the Marine Corps

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  • Yes

    7 50.00%
  • No

    6 42.86%
  • Other (Please explain)

    1 7.14%
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Thread: Moral Dilemma Poll

  1. #11
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    Re: Moral Dilemma Poll

    Mr. Invisible,

    I had similar notions of government and I now work for government. It's important to keep in mind that the upper levels of power in these organizations tend to be handed off to people in similar class and standing. Most army leaders for example were part of the upper-middle to upper class in the first place. They either arrived in the corps with specialized training or they got it via the corps and attained a higher standing. They weren't grunts.

    If you want to change the organization from the inside, it will be next to impossible. Its structure is self-perpetuating. You would have to change congress and their power is also concentrated in the aristocracy. Once you realize that democracy is a joke and the choices we vote on are created by the aristocracy, you'll see that nothing truly changes.

    If you want to join the corps, do it because you want to serve your country. If it's to change things, you will likely just end up being changed instead.

  2. #12
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    Re: Moral Dilemma Poll

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Invisible View Post
    Hey everyone! I came here to ask for some moral advice.

    Ever since I was 16 I've wanted to be a US Marine rifleman. However, my critiques of the US government and writing (Yes, I did write that) on war do no go together. I realize the irony and hypocrisy that would occur if I did join up.

    The only good thing that would happen if I did not join up is that I want to get a job at the Department of Defense and rise in standing from there to try and make sure that if the US does go to war, it is to defend the US or its allies, not corporate interests or have wars based on lies and deceit.

    So I wanted to know if any of you had any advice for me as to what I should do, it would be much appreciated.

    Sincerely,

    Mr. Invisible
    Hell yes, an invisible marine would be a hell of a mission asset.

    If you're seeking to prevent the US from not going to war to protect corporate interests and the prevent our participation in wars based on lies and deceit, your goal is to establish Nirvana on Earth. Good luck with that. Can't be done with a marine's rifle, though.


    Some reasons to join the Corps:

    You can learn a damn useful skill, even if you never use it after your discharge.

    You can learn things that can't be taught in books or school, such as leadership, or even how to follow orders.

    You'll be treated like a man from the minute you raise your hand and take the Oath. All your friends going to college or work will continue to be treated like little boys. But be warned, you'll be expected to do a man's work.

    To paraphrase General Patton, you'll be able to tell your grandchildren that you did something in 'the war", and you weren't just going to college or getting a job in the US of A.

    You'll have a really cool looking discharge certificate to hang next to your college diploma, if you go to college after your service. It's a quite different experience to go to college as a veteran than as a snot-nosed brat fresh from his high school prom. The Mayor, for example, corrected his chemistry professor's explanation of the creation of the hydrogen bubble at TMI2.

    Respect is earned.

    You'll have a perspective on life you won't get anywhere else.

    You'll have your personal sense of accomplishment. Again, means boatloads of intangibles that last a lifetime.

    You'll have EARNED that voting privilege, unlike those sissy-pants that never wanted to risk their life for their country.

    On the down side, you risk getting killed or maimed. So pay close attention to your drill instructors and your veterans, they're trying to keep you alive.

    On the whole, it's worth it to join.
    Last edited by Mayor Snorkum; 03-26-11 at 05:10 AM.

  3. #13
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    Re: Moral Dilemma Poll

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    I've struggled with the same questions. It's not news that troops are often sent to fight in wars that they might be morally opposed to, but you don't have a choice, you signed the mutha****in contract. At the end of the day, you have to realize that you must surrender a part of yourself to be part of an institution like the military. You have to follow orders, no questions asked (the only exception being is if you believe a superior has given an illegal order).

    I DO think that we need more honest and in-depth national discussions about the policy decisions that could potentially lead us to war. Today, ordinary Americans are so disconnected from military life and the policy decisions that affect the lives of our troops have little impact on people's daily lives. I don't remember the numbers, but Afghanistan was on the low end of voters' concerns during the last midterm elections. Having a quality all-volunteer military can be a great tool, but it also is detrimental when the vast majority of Americans are divorced from the realities of war. I once had a Marine recruiter tell me that the military is like the beef in a hamburger. Everyone loves the hamburger, but nobody wants to see how the cow is killed and butchered. I think this relationship between the military and the American people needs to be rectified, or the propensity for Americans to continue not giving a **** when politicians deploy military force cavalierly will only get worse.

    I'm not a Marine yet, but I believe they have a certain saying: "America is not at war. The Marine Corps is at war. America is at the mall." This is something that needs to change.
    I have never heard a Marine ever say that before. Hell that's the first time I have ever heard that.

  4. #14
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    Re: Moral Dilemma Poll

    When I was trying to sign up, I was looking for valuable professional training and on-the-job experience. I wouldn't have had any moral qualms about following orders.

    You're presumably a moral person, concerned about the morality of things. I think serving in the military is a fundamentally honorable and moral thing to do, regardless of the specific tasks you are required to perform. Even if you disagree with those tasks and the reasons you are being ordered to perform them, you are serving your country. Your foreign policy views are a personal matter, and I believe you should fight for them; if you join the service, you should continue to fight for them in every fashion you are allowed to by the rules of military conduct.

    The question you have to ask yourself is just how far you disagree with our foreign policy. If you think it's wrong but you are still comfortable carrying it out, you should join the service. If your objection is strenuous enough that it would create a conflict of interest, you should not.

  5. #15
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    Re: Moral Dilemma Poll

    you don't necessarily have to agree with the Governments foreign policy stance. there is more than one reason why your Country will go to war and you don't have to agreee with all of them. just remember to find your own cause, your own intent for why you might need to fight. fighting doesn't always have to be about death. they don't always go hand in hand.

    whatever your reasons may be, you can always find a purpose.
    Why do we fall?
    So we can learn to pick ourselves up.

  6. #16
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    Re: Moral Dilemma Poll

    Quote Originally Posted by cpgrad08 View Post
    I have never heard a Marine ever say that before. Hell that's the first time I have ever heard that.
    Yea though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I shall fear no evil; for I am the meanest mother****** in the whole God-****** valley.

    I don't know why this quote gives me chills, but it does. Marines. Gotta' love 'em.
    The devil whispered in my ear, "You cannot withstand the storm." I whispered back, "I am ​the storm."

  7. #17
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    Re: Moral Dilemma Poll

    Quote Originally Posted by cpgrad08 View Post
    I have never heard a Marine ever say that before. Hell that's the first time I have ever heard that.
    I have. I remember being completely freaked out by background music when I walked into a shopping center after my first tour. they have background music here!!! :-p. Then i almost caused a 6-car-pileup on I-95 'cause some dumbass had left a box in the middle of the highway.


    as for being a grunt in the Marine Corps; I just left that MOS after 4 years, and I can tell you a few basics up front. Firstly, if you are motivated, you are going to get abused. nothing sucks more than the life of an 03 LCpl in the Marines; and they know it. Secondly, if you don't go infantry, you are going to get abused. Nothing more manly or better than being an infantryman in the Marines, and they know it. Alot of brass don't appreciate him, but if you will peruse through this guy's site: Terminal Lance - You can't spell "Disgruntled" without "Grunt". you will get a general picture (in funny cartoons, too!) of how the LCpl views the world. I would also strongly recommend watching Generation Kill. There is nothing that Marines love more than being Marines, and nothing that they hate more than being in the Marine Corps.

    should you join - yes. simply because you want to, and if you don't, you will have 6-7 decades to hate yourself for not doing it. if you do and decide you can't take it, then you will have roughly 3 years operational time (1 year for training on the front end and outprocessing on the back) to hate yourself for doing it. in the second scenario you get the silver lining of the education benefits, lifelong pride at having accomplished something, etc. In the first scenario, you get the silver lining of never having to deal with cpgrad (he is very ugly), and you won't spend the rest of your life fanatically hating mosquitos.

  8. #18
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    Re: Moral Dilemma Poll

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    I have. I remember being completely freaked out by background music when I walked into a shopping center after my first tour. they have background music here!!! :-p. Then i almost caused a 6-car-pileup on I-95 'cause some dumbass had left a box in the middle of the highway.


    as for being a grunt in the Marine Corps; I just left that MOS after 4 years, and I can tell you a few basics up front. Firstly, if you are motivated, you are going to get abused. nothing sucks more than the life of an 03 LCpl in the Marines; and they know it. Secondly, if you don't go infantry, you are going to get abused. Nothing more manly or better than being an infantryman in the Marines, and they know it. Alot of brass don't appreciate him, but if you will peruse through this guy's site: Terminal Lance - You can't spell "Disgruntled" without "Grunt". you will get a general picture (in funny cartoons, too!) of how the LCpl views the world. I would also strongly recommend watching Generation Kill. There is nothing that Marines love more than being Marines, and nothing that they hate more than being in the Marine Corps.

    should you join - yes. simply because you want to, and if you don't, you will have 6-7 decades to hate yourself for not doing it. if you do and decide you can't take it, then you will have roughly 3 years operational time (1 year for training on the front end and outprocessing on the back) to hate yourself for doing it. in the second scenario you get the silver lining of the education benefits, lifelong pride at having accomplished something, etc. In the first scenario, you get the silver lining of never having to deal with cpgrad (he is very ugly), and you won't spend the rest of your life fanatically hating mosquitos.
    Ugliness runs in the "cp" family. =)

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    Re: Moral Dilemma Poll

    Joining the Marine Corps would be a very honorable thing to do. The experience will be an asset to you throughout your life.

    Good luck with your decision.

  10. #20
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    Re: Moral Dilemma Poll

    Quote Originally Posted by cpgrad08 View Post
    I have never heard a Marine ever say that before. Hell that's the first time I have ever heard that.
    Just do a google search. Hell, that quote is on google's autocomplete.

    Last edited by StillBallin75; 03-26-11 at 11:54 AM.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

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