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Is Palin's political career over?

Is Palin's political career over?

  • Yes, she's toast

    Votes: 14 51.9%
  • No, everything is fine

    Votes: 6 22.2%
  • She can fix the mess. It's not too late.

    Votes: 5 18.5%
  • Not sure, explain

    Votes: 2 7.4%

  • Total voters
    27
NP. I don't think that its completely off the wall for people to think she may've been a bad pick, or likely hurt him. I do have problems with people who state it as if its an unquestionable, undisputable, without a doubt fact. Specifically, those of either of the two I just listed who state it with little to no real facts backing up their suggestion....or using polls or peoples feelings about her from months to years AFTER the fact rather than accurately and honestly looking at information, atmosphere, and numbers from the actual campaign season.

In that case I'd have to repeat my question from post #15, if you were McCain's advisor in 2008 which potential running mate do you think would have been the best choice?
 
I have two opinions: one - she most likely is indeed toast. She was destroyed by her own excesses, namely the cross hairs gun sights and the connection with the assassination attempt in Arizona. She will forever be damaged goods.

Having said that, she has one chance and only one chance to still get the nomination. She must go full speed balls-to-the-walls and enlist all the various tea party extremists to her cause and let it be known that she is the GOP choice for prez or its third party for her. If she can mount a full blown 100% effort starting very soon, she just might be able to pull out the nomination. However, if she plays coy or attempts to finesse anything with any effort less than what I have described, she is indeed toast.
 
as long as she can keep the left busy crapping themselves and screaming about how much she sucks...it's all good. ;)

She will not bother. Palin cares only about Palin. She is one of the most selfish and greedy people I have ever seen on the political scene. Her instincts are those of a cheap street hooker who always knows what she has to do for the money and is scheming for a way to cheat everybody around her to end up with an even larger cut of the swag. She could not care less about attacking the left unless it benefits her with the nomination.
 
NP. I don't think that its completely off the wall for people to think she may've been a bad pick, or likely hurt him. I do have problems with people who state it as if its an unquestionable, undisputable, without a doubt fact. Specifically, those of either of the two I just listed who state it with little to no real facts backing up their suggestion....or using polls or peoples feelings about her from months to years AFTER the fact rather than accurately and honestly looking at information, atmosphere, and numbers from the actual campaign season.

She helped him, and she hurt him... She helped him with the based, but she hurt him with moderates and independents.. She also offended a lot of Hillary supporters who were threatening to vote McCain.

Remember when Palin always praised Hillary in her speeches, especially in that first speech when McCain announced the pick? I guess he thought she'd bring in the Hillary voters, but she didn't...
 
She helped him, and she hurt him... She helped him with the based, but she hurt him with moderates and independents.. She also offended a lot of Hillary supporters who were threatening to vote McCain.

McCain was hurting significantly with the base, and wasn't doing great with moderates at the time. He had to get someone that would please the base or he was doomed for a Mondale like loss most likely. To get someone the base was happy with it was going to be someone that was staunchly conservative. Someone staunchly conservative, be it Palin or someone else, was going to annoy independents. McCain's best choice was to pick someone to motivate the base and HE move to the middle...because it was obvious he wasn't going to excite the base.

Seriously, what potential VP candidate from the 2008 time period would've excited the base but not caused problems with moderates?
 
considering how many lefties on the board desperatly want her to win the GOP nomination in 2012 (and completely believe she will), the current poll results must be in error.
 
As I stated above, with the way they apparently picked her, I absolutely agree....

that's a bungle on the McCain camps part, not hers. She was a good pick, picked in the wrong fashion, and then used poorly in a larger campaign scope after that.

but we disagree that she was a good pick. i think she was a horrible pick. she was supremely NOT READY. and what she's done since then hasn't made her more palatable to voters in general. not her "base"......but overall.
 
She will not bother..

she doesn't have to bother. all she has to do is exist and they will go after her. even if she is never a candidate ever again, they will still keep attacking her and bringing her up.
 
McCain was hurting significantly with the base, and wasn't doing great with moderates at the time. He had to get someone that would please the base or he was doomed for a Mondale like loss most likely. To get someone the base was happy with it was going to be someone that was staunchly conservative. Someone staunchly conservative, be it Palin or someone else, was going to annoy independents. McCain's best choice was to pick someone to motivate the base and HE move to the middle...because it was obvious he wasn't going to excite the base.

Seriously, what potential VP candidate from the 2008 time period would've excited the base but not caused problems with moderates?

I just think that the gop pandering to that base is hurting the gop in the long run... but that's my opinion. The Tea Party built their success in part by saying it wasn't about the religious base, but lowering the debt... People tend to care more about issues that affect them, than OMG that woman is in her 40s and has 5 kids because she so profile and loves Jesus.
 
Palin is making way too much money on TV to bother with petty things like politics. Keep in mind, she already quit being a governor to pursue this career. She has chosen her path.
 
considering how many lefties on the board desperatly want her to win the GOP nomination in 2012 (and completely believe she will), the current poll results must be in error.

The poll was "what do you think," not "what do you want."
 
Zyphlin, something you talked briefly in your analysis on, but did not give enough attention to, is why she was a needed pack for him, which is the primaries. Most candidates, as you mention, work for their base in the primaries. McCain could never have won the primaries that way since pretty much every other candidate was stronger with the republican base. McCain's only option was to pick up moderate republicans, independents where they could vote, and hope that gave him enough, which it did. This left him with really no hope come general since he was not going to have strong appeal from the base, and his only hope was to pick some one who would give him that appeal.

But he needed more, and Palin fit the bill for that. Being a woman gave him something historic to counter Obama in that area, and being a Washington outsider and unknown gave him a chance to keep his "maverick" credentials without actually running as that maverick, or at least that was the probably hope. It all failed because Palin was not ready for primetime, and a republican in the political climate had almost no shot to begin with.

McCain lost for a lot of reasons, but to be fair, Palin was not one of them. She probably was a net positive for his campaign, just not enough of one.
 
McCain was hurting significantly with the base, and wasn't doing great with moderates at the time. He had to get someone that would please the base or he was doomed for a Mondale like loss most likely. To get someone the base was happy with it was going to be someone that was staunchly conservative. Someone staunchly conservative, be it Palin or someone else, was going to annoy independents. McCain's best choice was to pick someone to motivate the base and HE move to the middle...because it was obvious he wasn't going to excite the base.

Seriously, what potential VP candidate from the 2008 time period would've excited the base but not caused problems with moderates?

I'm not sure why exciting the base is necessary in terms of the general election though. For the most part party loyalists will still vote in the general election.
 
Zyphlin, something you talked briefly in your analysis on, but did not give enough attention to, is why she was a needed pack for him, which is the primaries. Most candidates, as you mention, work for their base in the primaries. McCain could never have won the primaries that way since pretty much every other candidate was stronger with the republican base. McCain's only option was to pick up moderate republicans, independents where they could vote, and hope that gave him enough, which it did. This left him with really no hope come general since he was not going to have strong appeal from the base, and his only hope was to pick some one who would give him that appeal.

But he needed more, and Palin fit the bill for that. Being a woman gave him something historic to counter Obama in that area, and being a Washington outsider and unknown gave him a chance to keep his "maverick" credentials without actually running as that maverick, or at least that was the probably hope. It all failed because Palin was not ready for primetime, and a republican in the political climate had almost no shot to begin with.

McCain lost for a lot of reasons, but to be fair, Palin was not one of them. She probably was a net positive for his campaign, just not enough of one.

You made some good points... like if she was ready for the limelight and was a strong candidate, he would have had a real good chance
 
I'm not sure why exciting the base is necessary in terms of the general election though. For the most part party loyalists will still vote in the general election.

Because you need the base to come out and vote for you. Supporting you does no good if you don't care enough to stand in line and vote. Further, a weak to the base candidate can loose votes to third parties...for example Gore.
 
You made some good points... like if she was ready for the limelight and was a strong candidate, he would have had a real good chance

I don't think so. Remember the famous saying attributed to James Carvelle, "it';s the economy, stupid"? With the economy where it was at come election, McCain could have been a perfect republican candidate with a perfect running mate and still lost. It was made the worse since he had to energize his base during the general, which was the exact wrong thing to have to be doing with the economy bad. He was tying himself with the republicans who were largely being blamed for the economy.
 
Because you need the base to come out and vote for you. Supporting you does no good if you don't care enough to stand in line and vote. Further, a weak to the base candidate can loose votes to third parties...for example Gore.

I find it hard to believe that a dedicated base will come out in the primaries but not show up in the general election simply because the nominee was too moderate, but I might be wrong.
 
In that case I'd have to repeat my question from post #15, if you were McCain's advisor in 2008 which potential running mate do you think would have been the best choice?

Remembering back during that time, I'm really not sure of someone that would've been better. Its easy to play a bit of arm chair quarterback and grab some names that are bigger now that weren't even on the radar in 2008, like Paul Ryan, but that's really not productive nor realistic.

I think the senator "moderates"/liberals that were rumored such as Lieberman or Graham would've been disasterous. I think the executive "moderates" and stereotypical Republicans like Guilliani or Romney wouldn't have really helped him much at all. I think your outliers would've been iffy...for example Huckabee may've helped with the base and may've not hurt independents quite as much as Palin, but didn't have the potential Palin had for countering the Obama grasp on message. Paul would've energized a small portion of the base while keeping the other side unhappy, gained him some independents, but would've likely been worse off than Palin.

As I said, my issue wasn't with the pick...but with how the pick was done, and how the campaign was handled after said pick.

If I was McCain's advisor back in 2008, from a completely political science strategy mindset, the moment it looked like the Primaries were locked up (and during the long wait for Obama/Hillary to be done) I would've suggested to start looking around the governor ranks for a minority, preferably young and charismatic, with a good conservative pedigree. I would like one from a state who either dealt with some kind of issues that we could translate to a national stage or has some decent handle on national issues, or at least make a selection early enough to let them study up on those things.

Executive...you want to hammer Obama's inexperience, which in part is his lack of executive experience. McCain doesn't have any himself, though at least has military experience which is part of what the President's job is (Commander in Chief). By getting an executive you have the potential to push that issue a bit.

Minority...this removes or at least reduces the "historic" notion of the campaign. Strategically speaking, it reasonable to suggest people who are previously not interested in voting might do so if they feel it will be a "historic" event or a part of "history". By allowing your ticke to fall in that same fashion you reduce the appeal of this.

Age...this, along with the above, allows for a better image for the campaigned. We'd want to push his inexperience, at the same time we don't want to look old, crusty, and out of touch. This would allow McCain to look Presidential and wise while having someone who interjects energy and a fresh perspective onto the ticket.

Conservative credentials...McCain would not win over the conservative base. Especially after the method of his primary win. From the moment the Primaries ended I would have realized where he stands with the conservative base and start planning to get a bonified conservative VP while pushing McCain to stay the course with regards to his true moderate stances and tendencies. This way he wouldn't have appeared phony by putting on an act that wouldn't fool conservatives and would just annoy independents.

Issue....with an issue that could be made to expand into a national thing, then we have a basis to jump off of. Be it getting a states budget back on track, dealing with health care or education, energy production, etc. This would give them something we could use as the initial focal point for them to talk on as they get their legs under them more fully with talking about all national things.

Now, I don't know who all the governors were during 2008, but my guess is few really fit that mold any better than Palin did. Which is why I don't have a huge problem with Palin's pick from a strategic stand point but in a procedural one.
 
In my opinion, Sarah Palin isn't interested in an elected position anymore - it just too much work. She's happy just making the money she does. John McCain did her a huge favor by picking her as his running mate, it has made her rich and famous.
 
Whovian said:
considering how many lefties on the board desperatly want her to win the GOP nomination in 2012 (and completely believe she will), the current poll results must be in error.
The poll was "what do you think," not "what do you want."

They believe she will win... therefore the current results of the poll must be wrong... or the lefties are wrong, and that could never happen;)
 
I just think that the gop pandering to that base is hurting the gop in the long run... but that's my opinion. The Tea Party built their success in part by saying it wasn't about the religious base, but lowering the debt... People tend to care more about issues that affect them, than OMG that woman is in her 40s and has 5 kids because she so profile and loves Jesus.

The problem with people who obviously aren't who was being targeted nor the base trying to act as if they know what was the appealing thing for those people is that they routinely get it wrong.

I'm part of the conservative base. I'm someone that identifes with the Tea Party. Sarah Palin didn't excite me because hse's got 5 kids and loves jesus. She excited me because she seemed to be fiscally and governmentally conservative and someone who was steadfast in her conservative views.

I'm not talking about the long run...in which I COMPLETELY disagree with you...I wa talking about that election. If McCain couldn't get his base he basically had zero sizable bases that were leaning in his favor for that election because he sure as hell wasn't getting Independents to go majoritly in his direction by the time of the Palin pick and he sure wasn't going to get the base excited for decent turnout and donations on his own.
 
Now, I don't know who all the governors were during 2008, but my guess is few really fit that mold any better than Palin did. Which is why I don't have a huge problem with Palin's pick from a strategic stand point but in a procedural one.

If you look back at when it happened, Palin's pick was seen at first as huge. The problem was that she could not live up to the expectations, especially being a below average public speaker. Given time to groom her she would have been better however, and there really was no way of knowing that she would fare so badly as a speaker. It was not a bad pick on his part.
 
They believe she will win... therefore the current results of the poll must be wrong... or the lefties are wrong, and that could never happen;)

I think you need some more straw for the straw man you are building.
 
They believe she will win... therefore the current results of the poll must be wrong... or the lefties are wrong, and that could never happen;)

lol many "lefties" might want her to win, but in all honesty I don't think she will if she ran.
 
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