View Poll Results: Should individual police officers pay out-of-pocket for wrongfully charged crimes?

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  • Absolutely

    5 13.16%
  • Absolutely not

    22 57.89%
  • Both cops and the court system should be held liable

    7 18.42%
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Thread: Should individual police officers pay out-of-pocket for wrongfully charged crimes?

  1. #31
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    Re: Should individual police officers pay out-of-pocket for wrongfully charged crimes

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    I am convinced that under US Federal Law and the American Constitution, being found not guilty means you're innocent. Remember, innocent until proven guilty.
    That is not how she meant it. Innocent in the eyes of the law, and innocent as in you did not do it, are two different things.
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    Re: Should individual police officers pay out-of-pocket for wrongfully charged crimes

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    That is not how she meant it. Innocent in the eyes of the law, and innocent as in you did not do it, are two different things.
    that is why the verdict is officially given as "not guilty", instead of "innocent"
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    Re: Should individual police officers pay out-of-pocket for wrongfully charged crimes

    No, police shouldn't have to pay out of pocket for wrongfully charged crimes. Should they take a gamble every time they decide to act? I can't support this.
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    Re: Should individual police officers pay out-of-pocket for wrongfully charged crimes

    Quote Originally Posted by ElijahGalt View Post
    In general, would you agree with a new law that requires individual police officers to pay, out of their own pockets, all costs that accrue from a false or wrongfully charged crime?

    After all, if the individual suspect is eventually cleared of the charges, it doesn't mean they're not affected by being charged with a false crime. They have to pay the lawyer fees and they may even lose their jobs because of such charges. And without such a law, they're forced to eat all costs despite the fact that the charges have been dropped or dismissed.

    I know I was pissed when the cops pulled me over and charged me with a false crime. I was on my way to work and I could have lost my job. Thank God I didn't, but I did lose a day's worth of pay and that isn't cheap. My lawyer's fees are also not cheap and if since I'm completely innocent, why is it my obligation to just eat the costs? If not the police officers, perhaps the courts should retrospectively pay all my costs that I've accrued thanks to their ridiculous laws and incompetent enforcers.

    If we held them liable for their own wrongdoings, perhaps it would provide a crucial incentive for them to prevent any future wrongdoing.
    No, but they probably should be repremanded in some way. Anything from unpaid suspension to being fired. The cops do need to be controlled for sure, any and all branches of the government must be controlled. We don't take it seriously now and I think that's why we start seeing the attitude and actions now that are so previlant amongst cops. I don't know if we should make them pay out of pocket; but they do need to be punished particularly for wrongful arrests. They have too much power and have stopped being challenged so they think they can do whatever they want. Gotta reel that dog in, make it understand who the real master is.
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    Re: Should individual police officers pay out-of-pocket for wrongfully charged crimes

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    No, but they probably should be repremanded in some way. Anything from unpaid suspension to being fired. The cops do need to be controlled for sure, any and all branches of the government must be controlled. We don't take it seriously now and I think that's why we start seeing the attitude and actions now that are so previlant amongst cops. I don't know if we should make them pay out of pocket; but they do need to be punished particularly for wrongful arrests. They have too much power and have stopped being challenged so they think they can do whatever they want. Gotta reel that dog in, make it understand who the real master is.
    Please give us an example of a wrongful arrest.
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    Re: Should individual police officers pay out-of-pocket for wrongfully charged crimes

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    I am convinced that under US Federal Law and the American Constitution, being found not guilty means you're innocent. Remember, innocent until proven guilty.
    Under the law, yes because one is innocent unless proven guilty.

    However, the person has not been proven to be innocent. They've simply been proven to be not guilty. There's a difference between literal speaking and legal speaking.

    The government comes from a stance that everyone is innocent, so there's no need to prove innocence. Due to that however, the courts do not directly proclaim someone as "innocent" but as simply "not guilty". In some cases, the level to be "not guilty" could have every person strongly believing you're guilty but not enough to bypass a reasonable doubt. Legally, that would mean you're not guilty and in a legal sense guilt and innocence are binary...0 and 1...guilty or innocent. In a realistic and literal sense, anyone that understands or looks are our legal code can understand that's not the case and that there is grey area between the two.

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    Re: Should individual police officers pay out-of-pocket for wrongfully charged crimes

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    I am convinced that under US Federal Law and the American Constitution, being found not guilty means you're innocent. Remember, innocent until proven guilty.
    You are wrong. Being found not guilty doesn't even mean you won't lose a civil lawsuit for the same conduct. Just because the state couldn't meet the standard of ""proof beyond a reasonable doubt does not necessarily mean one is innocent.

    A jury's choice is Guilty or Not Guilty. It isn't Guilty or Innocent.
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    Re: Should individual police officers pay out-of-pocket for wrongfully charged crimes

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    Please give us an example of a wrongful arrest.
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  9. #39
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    Re:

    Quote Originally Posted by ElijahGalt View Post
    Should individual police officers pay out-of-pocket for wrongfully charged crimes
    If its found out that they deliberately lied then sure those police officers should loose their job and pay any costs. The question is how do you prove that they lied. Charges being dropped or dismissed does not mean the police deliberately lied or knowingly tried to charge you with a crime you didn't do.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

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    Re:

    There is no law that says you are presumed innocent until proven guilty. It is a precept that is often followed but it isn't a law. It also isn't reality. I worked a case where a college student was stabbed to death by a stranger. The stranger had possession of the bloody knife, clothing saturated with the victims blood, and he confessed. He was found not guilty by reason of insanity. He certainly wasn't innocent. And, six months later when the hospital said, "It's a miracle. He's all better," that wasn't justice either. Actually, the hospital actually said they had no reason to believe he was ever insane and the hired experts had conned the court.

    Anyway, there is no law concerning innocent until proven guilty and an acquital means the state did not prove their case beyond a resonable doubt. It does not mean the defendant isn't guilty as sin.

    And that doesn't address the use of the exclusionary priniciple where all evidence may be supressed over an error resulting in a clearly guilty defendant giggling and going free. Does the name William Ayers ring a bell. He's quoted as saying, "Guilty as sin...free as a bird," and laughing.

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