View Poll Results: If you support workers ability to collectively bargain, what do you support?

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  • Workers have to join a specific union in order to get a job.

    8 11.27%
  • Workers have to join any workers union in order to get a job.

    4 5.63%
  • Workers don't have to join a union in order to get a job

    38 53.52%
  • Workers have to pay union dues in order to get a job.

    11 15.49%
  • Workers do not have to pay union dues in order to get a job.

    30 42.25%
  • Workers can form a different union if they do not like the unions that are avaliable.

    28 39.44%
  • Votes to join a union or other union related votes not being anonymous.

    3 4.23%
  • Votes to join a union or other union related votes being anonymous.

    33 46.48%
  • other.

    9 12.68%
  • I oppose unions.(please specify if it's all unions or just public sector unions you oppose).

    29 40.85%
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Thread: Those who support workers ability to collectively bargain what do you support?kkkkkkk

  1. #71
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    RGacky3's Avatar
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    Re: Those who support workers ability to collectively bargain what do you support?

    Work places where employees have to be part of the unions is no different than the employer demanding that employees wear a uniform ... I am for anything that makes the workplace more democratic.

  2. #72
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    Re: Those who support workers ability to collectively bargain what do you support?

    I am for private sector unions but against public sector unions. Public sector unions are to easily corruptible particularly in highly unionized areas. I am also against closed shops, I no not believe in forcing an employee into a union against their will only to become employed.

    Several mention free riders on union benefits. Nineteen years ago I worked in a partially unionized shop, I was not a union member. My union counterparts who preformed the same job received 45 mins more break time in an 8 hour shift, were payed $3.00+ more per hour, had a separate break room that had a small staffed cafe style eatery where workers could order hot food during breaks, more sick days and vacation time, better health and life insurance packages. So no benefits do not necessarily have to be shared or freely ridden.

    I was offered the opportunity to join the union force my very first day on the job (I think dues were about $35 a bi-weekly, its been a while) but I did not join. Now many may think that a stupid move I mean look at everything I would have gained by simply paying a few dollars a week in dues. My reason, I thought they were being over compensated for the job and harmful to the company. I mean 45 minutes additional break time in a 8 hour shift? Come on! thats all anyone needs in an 8 hour shift in my opinion, not additional to what we already received. Then when you take into account the spiffy break room with a staffed eatery for a small shop (probably 30 union workers max per shift) I quickly formed and held the impression that this was almost a vacation getaway and not viewed as a job to some of them. Several coworkers that I became familiar with overtime seemed to hold the impression that employment was something that should be made enjoyable and an employee should not feel they are having to preform tasks they dislike, like it was some sorta pastime activity and not a job. I am all for making your job as enjoyable as possible but not to the point it interferes with production or the bottom line. Also when I agreed to take the job I felt the compensation (non union) was fair and I agreed to it. I think it would have been pretty crappy of me to agree to the terms and then once hired say Nope! not good enough, Im joining the union! I do not live that way.

    Some safety measures may have been established by Union involvement but I do not believe safety should have a price (fee?) and all employees union and non-union should receive full benefits of improved safety equipment/procedures cost free.

    The place eventually closed down and moved to Mexico. I am not sure if this change had anything to do with the union presence but I would not be surprised.

    Summary- Unions left a bad taste in my mouth early in my working life and the taste has remained since, perhaps unfairly but it is what it is.
    Last edited by Baralis; 09-27-12 at 07:36 AM.

  3. #73
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    Re: Those who support workers ability to collectively bargain what do you support?

    Quote Originally Posted by Patrickt View Post
    Your hatred is obvious but you shouldn't allow it to lead you into a life of crime.
    If I had wanted to devote my life to crime, I would have joined the corporate parasites long ago.
    On the outside, trickling down on the insiders.
    We won't live free until the 1% live in fear.
    Hey, richboys! Imagine the boot of democracy stomping on your faces, forever.

  4. #74
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    Re: Those who support workers ability to collectively bargain what do you support?

    Quote Originally Posted by Patrickt View Post
    Is that supposed to make sense? I never joined a union. I never was conquered. For me, since I was not lazy, incompetent, corrupt, or brutal, I really didn't need a union. I realize some can't survive without extortion and violence. Some people can live by working but some either don't know how or simply aren't willing.

    Have you ever noticed the similarity in language between organized crime and unions. Rats, finks, stoolie. Never rat out your brothers no matter what they do. How pitiful.
    A little muscle is very effective.
    Do you have a problem with that? If you want to hire wimps, go to the Third World and you'll get all the slavish coolies you want. Oh wait, you've already done that. Aren't you proud of making money off people who love to grovel in the dirt before their Masters?
    On the outside, trickling down on the insiders.
    We won't live free until the 1% live in fear.
    Hey, richboys! Imagine the boot of democracy stomping on your faces, forever.

  5. #75
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    jamesrage's Avatar
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    Re: Those who support workers ability to collectively bargain what do you support?

    Quote Originally Posted by RGacky3 View Post
    Work places where employees have to be part of the unions is no different than the employer demanding that employees wear a uniform ... I am for anything that makes the workplace more democratic.
    Actually those two things are different.

    Uniforms distinguish employees from the customers and in some cases indicate their position or job title in the company.The employer has the right to dictate those things.

    The union does not own the company.If a company or public sector job is closed shop it is due to the fact the union extorted the company or tax payers into making the company or public sector job 0a closed shop.The only purpose of this is to refill the ranks of the union and to help replenish the union's money.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

  6. #76
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    Re: Those who support workers ability to collectively bargain what do you support?

    Its more complicated than that beacuse you have closed shops, company unions, paid off leaders etc.

    Suffice to say that all are part of a union and must pay dues. All benifit, so all pay.

    but, for one item, ALL leaders need to be elicted by members, with instant recall elections.

    Another reform is to ban multi tier wages and pensions. Core union rule that has been corrupted is "equal work- equal pay"

    Unions have been corrupted one rule at a time for 60 years. Time to repeal taft-Hartly slave act.

  7. #77
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    Re: Those who support workers ability to collectively bargain what do you support?

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage
    Actually those two things are different.

    Uniforms distinguish employees from the customers and in some cases indicate their position or job title in the company.The employer has the right to dictate those things.

    The union does not own the company.If a company or public sector job is closed shop it is due to the fact the union extorted the company or tax payers into making the company or public sector job 0a closed shop.The only purpose of this is to refill the ranks of the union and to help replenish the union's money.
    The RIGHT? This is the market, no one has a RIGHT to anything, the Union has a right to demand conditions for labor, and if that condition is that only union members are hired then that is their right.

    Also generally most comapnies are not owned by the employer, most of the time they are executives selected by boardmembers who are appointed by executives who are rubber stamped by the dispersed, liquid, and generally disinterested "owners."

    Also whatever the purpose the Union has, is up to the Union, which is a democratically controlled organization, unlike the Capitalist company, who's ONLY purpose, by definition is profit.

  8. #78
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    Re: Those who support workers ability to collectively bargain what do you support?

    Quote Originally Posted by RGacky3 View Post
    The RIGHT? This is the market, no one has a RIGHT to anything, the Union has a right to demand conditions for labor, and if that condition is that only union members are hired then that is their right.

    Also generally most comapnies are not owned by the employer, most of the time they are executives selected by boardmembers who are appointed by executives who are rubber stamped by the dispersed, liquid, and generally disinterested "owners."

    Also whatever the purpose the Union has, is up to the Union, which is a democratically controlled organization, unlike the Capitalist company, who's ONLY purpose, by definition is profit.
    To those who believe in the free-market fantasy where all participants have the power they deserve, a closed shop does look unfair. However, in real life, it is Man Against Millionaire, the Christians Against the Lions. The union is a team, if not an army, and no team would let anyone play who thought he could show up or not for the games, whatever he felt like doing. The union needs everybody on board manning the ship or it will be sunk by the corporate speedboat.
    On the outside, trickling down on the insiders.
    We won't live free until the 1% live in fear.
    Hey, richboys! Imagine the boot of democracy stomping on your faces, forever.

  9. #79
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    Re: Those who support workers ability to collectively bargain what do you support?

    To those who believe in the free-market fantasy where all participants have the power they deserve, a closed shop does look unfair.
    Wait why???? If the union got the closed shop without the state, then they deserved it.

    (thats what baffles me about libertarians).

  10. #80
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    Re: Those who support workers ability to collectively bargain what do you support?

    Quote Originally Posted by PrometheusBound View Post
    A little muscle is very effective.
    Do you have a problem with that? If you want to hire wimps, go to the Third World and you'll get all the slavish coolies you want. Oh wait, you've already done that. Aren't you proud of making money off people who love to grovel in the dirt before their Masters?
    Actually, I do. I object to assault, rape, murder, and arson being considered negotiating. I object to liberal politicians exhorting their brown shirts to go into the streets and get bloody. I object to thugs trying to dominate decent people.

    You attitude is pitiful but is typical of internet wimps and union thugs. I'm sure in a mob you are quite brave.

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