View Poll Results: If you support workers ability to collectively bargain, what do you support?

Voters
71. You may not vote on this poll
  • Workers have to join a specific union in order to get a job.

    8 11.27%
  • Workers have to join any workers union in order to get a job.

    4 5.63%
  • Workers don't have to join a union in order to get a job

    38 53.52%
  • Workers have to pay union dues in order to get a job.

    11 15.49%
  • Workers do not have to pay union dues in order to get a job.

    30 42.25%
  • Workers can form a different union if they do not like the unions that are avaliable.

    28 39.44%
  • Votes to join a union or other union related votes not being anonymous.

    3 4.23%
  • Votes to join a union or other union related votes being anonymous.

    33 46.48%
  • other.

    9 12.68%
  • I oppose unions.(please specify if it's all unions or just public sector unions you oppose).

    29 40.85%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Thread: Those who support workers ability to collectively bargain what do you support?kkkkkkk

  1. #11
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    Re: Those who support workers ability to collectively bargain what do you support?

    I'm against some unions. The UAW for example is a cancer and was a significant part of the reason why GM and Chrysler went bankrupt. Others I'm more torn about. Teacher's unions do some good things (such as mandated minimum student to teacher ratios) and some bad (hiring and firing based strictly on seniority for example).

    I do not believe anyone should ever have to join a union or pay union dues to get a job, and I support anonymous votes on union issues so workers can't be intimidated into voting a certain way.
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  2. #12
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    Re: Those who support workers ability to collectively bargain what do you support?

    I believe in unions. I believe in free collective bargaining. I do not believe in the closed shop. I do not believe anyone should be forced to join a union but I also believe that anyone who does not join a union does not have the right to benefit from any pay increase or improvement of conditions campaigned for and negotiated by the unions in a company. The unions manage to increase paternity leave from 2 to 4 weeks, for example, then only union members should benefit from that change. Stands to reason.
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  3. #13
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    Re: Those who support workers ability to collectively bargain what do you support?

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    I believe in unions. I believe in free collective bargaining. I do not believe in the closed shop. I do not believe anyone should be forced to join a union but I also believe that anyone who does not join a union does not have the right to benefit from any pay increase or improvement of conditions campaigned for and negotiated by the unions in a company. The unions manage to increase paternity leave from 2 to 4 weeks, for example, then only union members should benefit from that change. Stands to reason.
    That's a good point, I hadn't thought about it like that. If you don't pay dues or contribute to an organization, you shouldn't benefit from what it negotiates. Without that stipulation, people could just not pay the money or make the effort and get the benefits for free.

  4. #14
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    Re: Those who support workers ability to collectively bargain what do you support?

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive View Post
    That's a good point, I hadn't thought about it like that. If you don't pay dues or contribute to an organization, you shouldn't benefit from what it negotiates. Without that stipulation, people could just not pay the money or make the effort and get the benefits for free.
    Yes that's why I'm on the fence: the issue of free-ridership. However, in practical terms how can you make an individual worker not benefit from improved or safer working conditions?

  5. #15
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    Re: Those who support workers ability to collectively bargain what do you support?

    Quote Originally Posted by molten_dragon View Post
    I'm against some unions. The UAW for example is a cancer and was a significant part of the reason why GM and Chrysler went bankrupt.
    Couldn't have anything to do with the crap cars they were designing, could it? What did the UAW do to make the Chrysler 200 a pale imitation of a Mercedes? Or a Chevrolet a re-badged Korean Daewoo? I know the big corporations are desperate to find someone to pin their monumental failures on, but the unions aren't it. Poor management, profit milking, lack of investment in product development, entrenched lock-step relations with the oil industry and poor competitor monitoring are the reasons the US motor manufacturers went belly-up. Don't blame it on the unions just because it's the fashionable thing to do these days - blame the wrongs of the world on the unions, not on crap capitalists.
    "The crisis will end when fear changes sides" - Pablo Iglesias Turrión

    "Austerity is used as a cover to reconfigure society and increase inequality and injustice." - Jeremy Corbyn

  6. #16
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    Re: Those who support workers ability to collectively bargain what do you support?

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    Yes that's why I'm on the fence: the issue of free-ridership. However, in practical terms how can you make an individual worker not benefit from improved or safer working conditions?
    I think I'm going to have to switch my vote on this one. I would be pissed if I paid dues to a union and someone who didn't got the same benefits without working for them, particularly if I went to union meetings and strategized or went on strike. In theory, I believe in choice, particularly if unions aren't supporting the parties you vote for, but I think that should probably be an issue addressed within the unions themselves.

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    Re: Those who support workers ability to collectively bargain what do you support?

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    Couldn't have anything to do with the crap cars they were designing, could it? What did the UAW do to make the Chrysler 200 a pale imitation of a Mercedes? Or a Chevrolet a re-badged Korean Daewoo? I know the big corporations are desperate to find someone to pin their monumental failures on, but the unions aren't it. Poor management, profit milking, lack of investment in product development, entrenched lock-step relations with the oil industry and poor competitor monitoring are the reasons the US motor manufacturers went belly-up. Don't blame it on the unions just because it's the fashionable thing to do these days - blame the wrongs of the world on the unions, not on crap capitalists.
    Their entire business structure was flawed, that's for sure.

  8. #18
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    Re: Those who support workers ability to collectively bargain what do you support?

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    Yes that's why I'm on the fence: the issue of free-ridership. However, in practical terms how can you make an individual worker not benefit from improved or safer working conditions?
    That's true, and one of the strongest (albeit not very strong) arguments for the closed shop. Most unionists wouldn't wish poorer H/S conditions on someone who chooses not to join, but negotiated wage settlements, improved pension conditions, improved leave conditions? Damn right they should only apply to those contributing to the negotiation process. You want to go it alone, then you go negotiate those things for yourself.
    "The crisis will end when fear changes sides" - Pablo Iglesias Turrión

    "Austerity is used as a cover to reconfigure society and increase inequality and injustice." - Jeremy Corbyn

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    Re: Those who support workers ability to collectively bargain what do you support?

    I'm against public sector unions, and against closed shop private unions. I don't believe people should be forced to join a union in order to have a job.

  10. #20
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    Re: Those who support workers ability to collectively bargain what do you support?

    Quote Originally Posted by DiAnna View Post
    I'm against public sector unions, and against closed shop private unions. I don't believe people should be forced to join a union in order to have a job.
    But do you believe that people who don't join a union should have the right to benefit from any wage or conditions improvements negotiated by the unions?

    Also, why do you believe that public sector workers have no right to self-organisation?
    "The crisis will end when fear changes sides" - Pablo Iglesias Turrión

    "Austerity is used as a cover to reconfigure society and increase inequality and injustice." - Jeremy Corbyn

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