View Poll Results: Is the debate on evolution between scientists and the religious?

Voters
71. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes

    38 53.52%
  • No

    33 46.48%
Page 42 of 42 FirstFirst ... 32404142
Results 411 to 420 of 420

Thread: In the US: Is the debate on evolution between scientists and the religious?

  1. #411
    Sage
    scourge99's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    The Wild West
    Last Seen
    01-27-12 @ 02:50 AM
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    6,233

    Re: In the US: Is the debate on evolution between scientists and the religious?

    Quote Originally Posted by LookingGlass View Post
    Perhaps it was an overstatement. Scientists involved in evolutionary studies are usually more concerned with when their next government grant is coming, since that is how they get paid.
    So you go from the claim that scientists are determined to disprove religions to scientists are all (or mostly) producing fraudulent works to get money. What's next? That the scientists are involved in a big conspiracy? Where are you getting these ideas?

    I agree that scientists are human and thus are prone to greed and other less an reputable actions. But
    its almost impossible to produce lasting but fraudulent work in science because other people have to verify your work. They have to independently produce your results in their own labs or witness the same phenomenon. There is also peer review where anonymous scientists in the field are PAID to find every little problem they can find and report back on it.

    Is it absolutely perfect? No. For example, pilt down man, cold fusion, and the cloning fiasco with Hwang Woo-suk.

    The problem with fraudulent scientific work is that it all deals with the real world. If people can't verify your work in the real world then your work is discredited until someone can. This is exactly how all the above hoaxes and frauds were caught. No scientific claim is taken on faith.

    Quote Originally Posted by LookingGlass View Post
    I think you are confusing evolution and genetics. While the two are linked, they are not the same thing.
    There isn't a field of study known as "evolutionology". Many branches of biology such as genetics, paleontology, and microbiology, heavily rely on the theory of evolution. Its similar to how mechanical engineers and aeronautical engineers are heavily reliant on the theory of gravitation.

    Its possible that evolution or the theory of gravitation could be wrong. But its unlikely given the enormous amount of evidence in support of them. Minor revisions and changes are possible and expected (such as the effects of relativity) but massive paradigm shifts are unlikely. After all, if we had already figured everything out in these fields then we wouldn't need biologists and physicists, we'd only need engineers.


    On a side note, I'm not a biologist. I'm an computer engineer. So I don't know all the nitty-gritty details of evolution nor can I defend evolution for very specific and narrow criticisms. I don't spend much time discussing evolution beyond the basics nor do I care to. There are a few biologists on this board who can address those or I'm sure there are plenty of books that can as well such as the book I mentioned earlier. Talkorigins.org is also very well known and reputable resource.
    If you believe in the Supernatural then you can become a millionaire!

    Questioning or criticizing another's core beliefs is inadvertently perceived as offensive and rude.

  2. #412
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    United States
    Last Seen
    01-21-16 @ 12:21 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    51,124

    Re: In the US: Is the debate on evolution between scientists and the religious?

    Quote Originally Posted by scourge99 View Post
    So you go from the claim that scientists are determined to disprove religions to scientists are all (or mostly) producing fraudulent works to get money. What's next? That the scientists are involved in a big conspiracy? Where are you getting these ideas?

    I agree that scientists are human and thus are prone to greed and other less an reputable actions. But
    its almost impossible to produce lasting but fraudulent work in science because other people have to verify your work. They have to independently produce your results in their own labs or witness the same phenomenon. There is also peer review where anonymous scientists in the field are PAID to find every little problem they can find and report back on it.

    Is it absolutely perfect? No. For example, pilt down man, cold fusion, and the cloning fiasco with Hwang Woo-suk.

    The problem with fraudulent scientific work is that it all deals with the real world. If people can't verify your work in the real world then your work is discredited until someone can. This is exactly how all the above hoaxes and frauds were caught. No scientific claim is taken on faith.


    There isn't a field of study known as "evolutionology". Many branches of biology such as genetics, paleontology, and microbiology, heavily rely on the theory of evolution. Its similar to how mechanical engineers and aeronautical engineers are heavily reliant on the theory of gravitation.

    Its possible that evolution or the theory of gravitation could be wrong. But its unlikely given the enormous amount of evidence in support of them. Minor revisions and changes are possible and expected (such as the effects of relativity) but massive paradigm shifts are unlikely. After all, if we had already figured everything out in these fields then we wouldn't need biologists and physicists, we'd only need engineers.


    On a side note, I'm not a biologist. I'm an computer engineer. So I don't know all the nitty-gritty details of evolution nor can I defend evolution for very specific and narrow criticisms. I don't spend much time discussing evolution beyond the basics nor do I care to. There are a few biologists on this board who can address those or I'm sure there are plenty of books that can as well such as the book I mentioned earlier. Talkorigins.org is also very well known and reputable resource.
    If that were true, then global warming would have been put to bed 30 years ago.

  3. #413
    Student
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Last Seen
    04-11-11 @ 09:43 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    295

    Re: In the US: Is the debate on evolution between scientists and the religious?

    Quote Originally Posted by scourge99 View Post
    So you go from the claim that scientists are determined to disprove religions to scientists are all (or mostly) producing fraudulent works to get money. What's next? That the scientists are involved in a big conspiracy? Where are you getting these ideas?
    The condescension is duly noted.

    I never said anyone was producing fraudulent work for monetary gain. My point was paleontology or paleobotany or large chunks of archeology have no market value beyond government sponsored research. The two former areas of study are very soft sciences. Soft sciences don't get much attention in a competitive job market, well with psychology as the exclusion. I mean you can't leave a government sponsored research project and get a job at paleotologists R US. That only happens in Hollywood movies.

    Do you really think Jurassic Park happened? It was all CGI and animatronics, you know.

    As far as the conspiracy theory, well, all I can say is unless there was this ongoing "Scopes Trial", evolution wouldn't be very sexy. In order to gain the greater share of government dollars, evolution has to remain sexy and at least on one of the forward burners.

  4. #414
    Professor

    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Grand Junction, CO 81506
    Last Seen
    05-30-11 @ 07:02 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    2,236

    Re: In the US: Is the debate on evolution between scientists and the religious?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    Yes, unless it is based on fact, logic, observation, and experimentation. If it is based on thin air, then it is indeed a dirty word, just as it should be.
    Believe really doesn't describe scientific functions. Better, more descriptive words and terms, are accept, accede to, comply with, agree with...

    ricksfolly

  5. #415
    Professor

    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Grand Junction, CO 81506
    Last Seen
    05-30-11 @ 07:02 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    2,236

    Re: In the US: Is the debate on evolution between scientists and the religious?

    Quote Originally Posted by scourge99 View Post
    Its almost impossible to produce lasting but fraudulent work in science because other people have to verify your work. They have to independently produce your results in their own labs or witness the same phenomenon.
    True, they can verify all the present chemical results, but not the long term results.

    ...or the human element, or the logistics, or the reliability, or the built in tolerances and locations of their data processors, or the calculation of their yet to be determined time, and those are what the GW theories are based on.

    ricksfolly

  6. #416
    Educator
    Anarcho-fascist's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    T E X A S !
    Last Seen
    09-26-14 @ 11:51 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    1,069
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: In the US: Is the debate on evolution between scientists and the religious?

    wrong thread
    Last edited by Anarcho-fascist; 03-27-11 at 04:52 PM.

  7. #417
    Sage
    Dittohead not!'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    The Golden State
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 01:20 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    41,513

    Re: In the US: Is the debate on evolution between scientists and the religious?



    Uploaded with ImageShack.us
    "Donald Trump is a phony, a fraud... [he's] playing the American public for suckers." Mitt Romney

  8. #418
    Sage
    scourge99's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    The Wild West
    Last Seen
    01-27-12 @ 02:50 AM
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    6,233

    Re: In the US: Is the debate on evolution between scientists and the religious?

    If you believe in the Supernatural then you can become a millionaire!

    Questioning or criticizing another's core beliefs is inadvertently perceived as offensive and rude.

  9. #419
    Sage
    scourge99's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    The Wild West
    Last Seen
    01-27-12 @ 02:50 AM
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    6,233

    Re: In the US: Is the debate on evolution between scientists and the religious?

    Quote Originally Posted by LookingGlass View Post
    I never said anyone was producing fraudulent work for monetary gain. My point was paleontology or paleobotany or large chunks of archeology have no market value beyond government sponsored research.
    Oftentimes knowledge about our world provides the support in which future technologies, research, and other endeavors are born from. How much time and effort have you put into investigating the "market value" of paleontology or paleobotany? Or is this merely an arm-chair analysis from you that we should take on "faith"?

    Quote Originally Posted by LookingGlass View Post
    As far as the conspiracy theory, well, all I can say is unless there was this ongoing "Scopes Trial", evolution wouldn't be very sexy.
    Apparently you have the ability to generate a limitless supply of silly theories.

    Quote Originally Posted by LookingGlass View Post
    In order to gain the greater share of government dollars, evolution has to remain sexy and at least on one of the forward burners.
    Another perfect example of what I am talking about. You are a conspiracy theoriest, just of a different breed than 9/11 truthers and UFO'ers.
    If you believe in the Supernatural then you can become a millionaire!

    Questioning or criticizing another's core beliefs is inadvertently perceived as offensive and rude.

  10. #420
    Sage
    scourge99's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    The Wild West
    Last Seen
    01-27-12 @ 02:50 AM
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    6,233

    Re: In the US: Is the debate on evolution between scientists and the religious?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    If that were true, then global warming would have been put to bed 30 years ago.
    I haven't followed the global warming debate enough to know what you are talking about.
    If you believe in the Supernatural then you can become a millionaire!

    Questioning or criticizing another's core beliefs is inadvertently perceived as offensive and rude.

Page 42 of 42 FirstFirst ... 32404142

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •