View Poll Results: Is the debate on evolution between scientists and the religious?

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    38 53.52%
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Thread: In the US: Is the debate on evolution between scientists and the religious?

  1. #151
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    Re: In the US: Is the debate on evolution between scientists and the religious?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    What the hell is "faith based money"? Money given by religious people? Money is money. There's just as much, if not more, given by secular charities. Some of the largest charities out there, like the American Red Cross, are on the front lines of tragedy and disaster every day.
    The largest amount of aid and charity in the history of man kind.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
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    Re: In the US: Is the debate on evolution between scientists and the religious?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    No, faith cannot be verified because anyone can have faith in anything they want, whether it's true or not. You can have faith in leprechauns and Santa Claus if you like, even though we know those things simply are not true.

    Faith means nothing except to the emotionally and intellectually weak.
    Yes faith can be verified to the person of faith. Mine has been many times. So it is exactly as I have said.

    So now anyone who has faith is emotionally and intellectually weak? Man I know some people of faith who would laugh at the ignorance of such an untrue blanket statement.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

  3. #153
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    Re: In the US: Is the debate on evolution between scientists and the religious?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    Yes faith can be verified to the person of faith. Mine has been many times. So it is exactly as I have said.

    So now anyone who has faith is emotionally and intellectually weak? Man I know some people of faith who would laugh at the ignorance of such an untrue blanket statement.
    No, faith cannot be verified by anyone. It can be justified, it simply cannot be demonstrated to be objectively true to anyone, including the believer. Faith is an emotional crutch, it's a means of feeling better about the world when you cannot accept it for what it actually is. It's a security blanket for those who are too weak to cast it off and deal with reality as it is. You can laugh at it all you want, that doesn't change a thing.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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  4. #154
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    Re: In the US: Is the debate on evolution between scientists and the religious?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    No, faith cannot be verified by anyone. It can be justified, it simply cannot be demonstrated to be objectively true to anyone, including the believer. Faith is an emotional crutch, it's a means of feeling better about the world when you cannot accept it for what it actually is. It's a security blanket for those who are too weak to cast it off and deal with reality as it is. You can laugh at it all you want, that doesn't change a thing.
    This is nothing but your own false security schema used to reduce your own cognitive dissidence between the reality that God exists and the fact that he doesn't talk to you. Faith is not an emotional crutch, it a personality trait of the strong.

  5. #155
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    Re: In the US: Is the debate on evolution between scientists and the religious?

    Quote Originally Posted by Your Star View Post
    You have to admit, evolution is the best we got right now.
    I disagree, I think the holes make it not feasible and it's not proven. I think it's the best secular explanation and that's why many chose to accept it.
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    Re: In the US: Is the debate on evolution between scientists and the religious?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    No, faith cannot be verified by anyone.
    Yes it can, if it could not I would not believe in God. The same can be said for many others.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    It can be justified, it simply cannot be demonstrated to be objectively true to anyone, including the believer.
    It does not need to be justified and it does not need to be demonstrated. I know because of anicdotal evidence, it would mean nothing to you. That is OK because as I said it does not need to be objectivly demonstrated to you or anyone else other than the person of faith.

    You have already closed your mind to the possibility of God and the power of faith so no matter what anyone says, you will not accept the truth. That truth is that more exists outside the realm of science than exists within it. The fact that we discover new unknowns every day should clue you in on this.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    Faith is an emotional crutch, it's a means of feeling better about the world when you cannot accept it for what it actually is. It's a security blanket for those who are too weak to cast it off and deal with reality as it is. You can laugh at it all you want, that doesn't change a thing.
    It is a crutch for some, but not for most. It is not a security blanket as much as a spark of hope for those who have nothing left. It is the courage to believe in the face of great danger or great poverty. It is a mover of nations and a destroyer of tyrants. It's allot of things beyond your simple blanket explanations. It is more complex than anything science has to offer a man.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

  7. #157
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    Re: In the US: Is the debate on evolution between scientists and the religious?

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    I disagree, I think the holes make it not feasible and it's not proven. I think it's the best secular explanation and that's why many chose to accept it.
    Would you say the best secular explanation is worse than the best theological explanation. Because if it is, and if it is the best secular explanation, then it is the best explanation we have.
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    Re: In the US: Is the debate on evolution between scientists and the religious?

    Quote Originally Posted by iamitter View Post
    Would you say the best secular explanation is worse than the best theological explanation. Because if it is, and if it is the best secular explanation, then it is the best explanation we have.
    I think the best secular explanation is false, leaving only a theological explanation that I believe is more strongly supported by scientific evidence than even the secular one.
    When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser. -Socrates
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    Re: In the US: Is the debate on evolution between scientists and the religious?

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    How does he get over the issue that YEC requires God to be a liar? After all, if the world was only 6,000 years old, then basically physics doesn't apply in practice as to what we see today. Either God lied in the Torah or he is lying to us now as to how the world operates.

    How can one be a Christian when their belief requires their God to be the biggest deceiver of all time?
    We can trace back basically to how the Earth looked like when it was formed, how it changed, etc. Difference for him is, he believes the tracking and physical explanations up to 6000 years ago, which is when god put everything into place the way it looked 6000 years ago. He somehow finds ways to reconcile his studies with his faith.
    The thing is, he acknowledges that he has no proof whatsoever of this. The best I've gotten out of him was that he knows it "because god told him in a way no one else could see or hear, like your phone being on vibrate in your pocket."

    Now, I don't buy it, but that's the way he is. There's some things he's supremely logical about and there's some things where he uses no logic at all.
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    Re: In the US: Is the debate on evolution between scientists and the religious?

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    I think the best secular explanation is false, leaving only a theological explanation that I believe is more strongly supported by scientific evidence than even the secular one.
    You think the theological explanation is more strongly supported by scientific evidence than evolution?
    Give a man a fish, or he will destroy the only existing vial of antidote.

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