View Poll Results: Should Wiscnson Democrats be paid while they hide in Illinois?

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  • Yes

    27 21.43%
  • No

    99 78.57%
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Thread: Should Wisconsin Democrats be paid while they hide out in Illinois?

  1. #111
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    Re: Should Wisconsin Democrats be paid while they hide out in Illinois?

    Quote Originally Posted by OhIsee.Then View Post
    I think you have missidentified their CO. I think their CO are the Dems that elected them. They are doing what they were elected to do, i.e. they are at work.
    no, the soveriegn is the people as a body. and the wisconsin people as a body turned them out and put republicans in specifically to take the kind of steps that he is last election. and they are specifically and explicitely not at work.

  2. #112
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    Re: Should Wisconsin Democrats be paid while they hide out in Illinois?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    no, i am saying they are willing to give ground to suck us into an ambush. giving up temporary benefits matters little so long as you retain the power to pump them right back up in the long term. THAT"s what this is about; as much as it is a this-year budget question, it's a ten-years-from-hence budget question.
    as usual, the Hammer puts it better than I ever could:

    ...Walker understands that a one-time giveback means little. The state’s financial straits — a $3.6 billion budget shortfall over the next two years — did not come out of nowhere. They came largely from a half-century power imbalance between the unions and the politicians with whom they collectively bargain.

    In the private sector, the capitalist knows that when he negotiates with the union, if he gives away the store, he loses his shirt. In the public sector, the politicians who approve any deal have none of their own money at stake. On the contrary, the more favorably they dispose of union demands, the more likely they are to be the beneficiary of union largesse in the next election. It’s the perfect cozy setup.

    To redress these perverse incentives that benefit both negotiating parties at the expense of the taxpayer, Walker’s bill would restrict future government-union negotiations to wages only. Excluded from negotiations would be benefits, the more easily hidden sweeteners that come due long after the politicians who negotiated them have left. The bill would also require that unions be recertified every year and that dues be voluntary.

    Recognizing this threat to union power, the Democratic party is pouring money and fury into the fight. Private unions have shrunk to less than 7 percent of the working population. The Democrats’ strength lies in government workers, who now constitute a majority of union members and provide massive support to the party. For them, Wisconsin represents a dangerous contagion....

  3. #113
    Student doctorhugo's Avatar
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    Re: Should Wisconsin Democrats be paid while they hide out in Illinois?

    This is all a bad joke and serious attempt against We The Perople by the Obama insurgency. All one need d is look at how they hit the ground running after he was elected. ObamaCare and Cap and Trade, the two main points of attack on the Americam system and way of life comprised much complicated wording and misdirectional references in the 'actual' bills calculated to confuse. You must ask yor self...WHY? And the answer is that it was all pr-planned as part of a bigger agenda to undermine this system of government and bring us down econoically to pave the way for a latter-day version of Marxian socialism, nothing less.

    You know how cozy Obama was with the two biggest union leaders. Why? They were a means to an end. It is NO COINCIDENCE that massive and disruptive protests started in Wisconsin IMMEDIATELY AFTER the men and women that you elected to Congress in November tried desperately to bring fiscal sanity to Washington. And in the days that follow, more protests may break out in a number of states across the nation.

    Barack Obama and his far-left allies heard the message you sent in November loud and clear and they are striking back. The chaos in Madison, Wisconsin is precisely the future Barack Obama wishes for every state in the union... it's the "change" he really promised when he campaigned in 2008... because only economic paralysis can pave the way for him to press forward with his extreme socialist agenda.

    If you believe that these Wisconsin protests are a local issue... you're sorely mistaken. If you believe that there is some "perfect storm" brewing and that it is a coincidence that the Wisconsin protests are happening now... you're wrong. And if you believe that these protests are, in actuality, about public-sector union employees demanding more of your hard-earned money during a time of extreme economic distress... while the rest of the nation suffers... you're still missing a huge... huge... part of the picture.

    These protesters are being used... Joseph Stalin coined the phrase, "useful idiots." These protesters are dupes... pawns in a very dangerous game that Barack Obama is playing with the United States of America. Barack Obama is not siding with the unions for the sake of the children... he's not siding with the unions for the sake of hard-working and dedicated teachers... and he's certainly not doing it for you.

    The end-game is the complete and utter destruction of the United States economy and your way of life. Obama and his allies are playing the game to win and each and every American who cherishes freedom and the American way of life MUST do the same. You must not let them get away with it. They must be stopped.
    "Ignorance confuses. Knowledge mediates. Truth resolves." (doctorhugo)

  4. #114
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    Re: Should Wisconsin Democrats be paid while they hide out in Illinois?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Why is it that there is no category as follows

    They should be paid, get a bonus and a medal for Heroism
    ANSWER = Because the poll, to be "fair", the ultimate liberal standard, cannot be slanted to idiots with an answer opition as it would then be a prejudicial poll.

    Aren't you glad that you asked?
    ****************************************
    Btw, I see that like many lefties you love using a "voluntary" database like wikipedia for your source. Not very good as a reliable authority. To wit, this article excerpt:


    Authority
    by Jim Lengel, Education and Technology Consultant, 02/07/2006

    Wikipedia is (was) an example of an unmediated web site. It is an encyclopedia compiled by the voluntary contributions of hundreds of writers and editors. Anyone can write an article and post it to the Wikipedia; anyone else can come along later and edit the article. It's a kind of open, voluntary, work in progress. As such, it's the most up-to-date encyclopedia you'll find. But it's hardly error-free. It relies on its readers (all of whom may be editors) to keep it fresh and accurate. Very democratic. Very useful. But also very dangerous, if you don't understand what you are looking at.

    It turns out that the offending biography of Mr. Seigenthaler was contributed by a 38-year-old deliveryman in Tennessee who posted it as a practical joke. It remained posted for four months, until a friend of Seigenthaler's saw it and replaced it with a an accurate article. So the self-policing system worked, but not fast enough to keep inaccurate information from finding its way into many reader's minds. (Wikipedia has since revised its methods to restrict editing and postings to registered members.)

    Compare the process of developing the online Wikipedia with that of a traditional reference work such as the Encyclopedia Britannica. Britannica, in fact, is compiled from the contributions of hundreds of writers and editors, chosen carefully for their expertise in a certain field. Their articles are carefully reviewed by other experts and editors before they appear in the print or online versions of the encyclopedia. This is an example of a highly mediated work -- lots of eyes and minds examine and modify each article on its way to publication. Thus many people around the world regard Britannica as a respected, authoritative source.
    Source: Power to Learn - Authority

    No need to thank me as I do this as a public service.
    Last edited by doctorhugo; 02-25-11 at 09:06 AM.
    "Ignorance confuses. Knowledge mediates. Truth resolves." (doctorhugo)

  5. #115
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    Re: Should Wisconsin Democrats be paid while they hide out in Illinois?

    A Wisconsin Republican Senator was just interviewed on WLS-Chicago. She said rumor has it that the Democratic Senators are raising union money for their campaigns by staying away.

    If this is true, then I guess unions are in charge...
    The devil whispered in my ear, "You cannot withstand the storm." I whispered back, "I am ​the storm."

  6. #116
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    Re: Should Wisconsin Democrats be paid while they hide out in Illinois?

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    A Wisconsin Republican Senator was just interviewed on WLS-Chicago. She said rumor has it that the Democratic Senators are raising union money for their campaigns by staying away.

    If this is true, then I guess unions are in charge...
    i dont' know if it's accurate to say that they are in charge, as much as it is to say that public sector unions and the DNC are now, for practical purposes, not fully distinguishable.

  7. #117
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    Re: Should Wisconsin Democrats be paid while they hide out in Illinois?

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    Well, it strikes me that you (and us over here in Europe) are suffering a crisis that was 100% the creation of the private, financial sector. They came running to dip into the public purse to have their debts underwritten by the tax payer, which stupidly the governments decided to do. You are now expecting the public sector workers to soak up the impact of those debts, taken on by the western governments on behalf of, but without consulting, the tax-payers. At the same time, the corporate recipients of those trillions of tax dollars, who haven't yet repaid the bail-outs, are still giving themselves multi-million dollar bonuses...and you're getting angry at the firemen, teachers and health workers. I think you need to rethink your values, Maggie.
    The government(s) shares the blame equally with the private sector
    A screaming comes across the sky.
    It has happened before, but there is nothing to compare it to now.
    Pynchon - Gravity's Rainbow

  8. #118
    Student doctorhugo's Avatar
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    Re: Should Wisconsin Democrats be paid while they hide out in Illinois?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    The government(s) shares the blame equally with the private sector
    Way to go Aunt Spiker. Don't take that bucketfull of bilgewater without splashing it back in his face.
    Governments are responsible for setting up the regulatons that control private business and enforcing them. There is NO wiggle-room in that resposibility. They, governments, are also responsible for the monetary policies they follow, business has NO rsponsibility for that. So, mister Andalublue I would suggest that governments are even MORE RESPONSIBLE and this share MORE BLAME than private business.

    Matter of fact your knowledge of what precipitated our downfall on this side of the pond is abysmally lacking in knowledge of the truth. Your comment that it's "100% the creation of the private, financial sector" reveals your ignorance.

    Over here, in the colonies, Congress makes the laws to control and regulate the money policy. The Fed corrupts that authority and, acting as a quasi-governemnt entity, interjects itself as a wholly unauthorized money policy manager to really direct Treasury Dept policy and when and how much more money to print to devalue our dollar and enable our continuing downfall. "Monetizing of the debt", which the current head of the Fed testified under oath he wouldn't be doing and then did, without facing the bar of justice for such along with "quantitative easing", which is like to call Helicopter Ben's economic suppository only worsened things. The tax-cheat in charge of that Treasury Department the unindicted Timmie Geitner and his senior in command, O-bambi, have colluded to exacerbate the poor policy initiated in the Little Georgie-boy Bush years and corrupted the system with a fervor not seen before. The politicians use their contacts on Wall Street to further enrich and empower themselves whilst all the while assuring the public that all is honkey-dorey. Hell blue, may I call you that for short..., I haven't even mentioned the CRA or Frank or Dodd or no underwriting standards maintained or toxic assets or bad securities or F&F etcetera ad nauseum, but... do believe I've made my point. GOVERNMENT IS THE RAT HIDING IN THE WOODPILE!

    Just a thought to you, but given all the problems you have over there in merry olde England maybe you'd be better sticking your political nose deeper into the House of Commons...ay what! (I've got you on my little list now!)
    "Ignorance confuses. Knowledge mediates. Truth resolves." (doctorhugo)

  9. #119
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    Re: Should Wisconsin Democrats be paid while they hide out in Illinois?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    The government(s) shares the blame equally with the private sector
    Well, the Bush government does, certainly, as does the Brown administration, not for causing the crisis, but for the knee-jerk protectionist reaction to it which has ensured that the effects of the crash have impacted more on ordinary wage-earners than they have on the guilty speculators. This is unsurprising as the latter pay better kick-backs.
    Last edited by Andalublue; 02-25-11 at 03:29 PM.
    "The crisis will end when fear changes sides" - Pablo Iglesias Turrión

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  10. #120
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    Re: Should Wisconsin Democrats be paid while they hide out in Illinois?

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    Well, the Bush government does, certainly. As does the Brown administration, not for causing the crisis, but for their knee-jerk protectionist reaction to it which has ensured that the impact of the crash has impacted more on ordinary wage-earners than it has on the guilty financiers. Unsurprising as the latter pay better lick-backs.
    Republicans and Democrats are equally to blame for the issues in government. They're both in it for shared glory - votes and hoes.

    Just like a Conglomerate of corporations and the business oligopolies that dominate the market corners - they work side by side to fix issues and keep everyone else that might be adequate competition for their seats *out* of the picture.

    I see both ends of hte spectrum as being vile doers of mass evil - all of our problems are from all of *them* - in order to fix our issues all the old cattle need to be processed out.
    A screaming comes across the sky.
    It has happened before, but there is nothing to compare it to now.
    Pynchon - Gravity's Rainbow

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