View Poll Results: Do you support Obama's continuation of the war in Afghanistan?

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  • Yes, I support Obama's continuation of the war in Afghanistan.

    15 34.88%
  • No, I don't support Obama's continuation of the war in Afghanistan.

    22 51.16%
  • Other

    6 13.95%
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Thread: Do you support Obama in continuing the Afghanistan war?

  1. #51
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    Re: Do you support Obama in continuing the Afghanistan war?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Thank you for your thoughts Redress. There are many that agree with you. IMO, since Afghanistan has traditionally operated under tribal rule, I just don't see us having the time or the money to convert them to our way of central government. I think it is an unrealistic goal that we can't afford to pursue due to cost, both in terms of lives and National debt that is already bloated from the two wars over the course of a decade.
    Nearsighted nonesense. Let's just pull out before the Pathan government can keep the Tali-ban suppressed, thereby having to spend even more money later to have to send our troops right back to do what we should have given them time to do in the first place.

    Afghanistan: Land of Conflict and Beauty. - John C. Griffith
    Afghanistan: A Military History From Alexander The Great to the Fall of the Taliban. - Stephen Tanner
    Three Cups of Tea. - Greg Mortneson and David Oliver Relin
    The War for Muslim Minds. - Gilles Kepel


    Here are four good sources to what is going on. Do yourself a favor and gain some insight. The sophomoric protests and nearsighted sensationalist loyalities that would have Iraq controlled by Hussein or in ruins right now aren't in our best interests when it comes to Afghanistan either.

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    Re: Do you support Obama in continuing the Afghanistan war?

    Quote Originally Posted by DiAnna View Post
    I am so incredibly proud of our troops. Thank you for your service, from the bottom of my heart.
    I don't think anyone could fault the troops. They have excelled in every task given them and with valor! My thanks to all our service men and women, including my son who just returned from his 4th tour in the ME.
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  3. #53
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    Re: Do you support Obama in continuing the Afghanistan war?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Don't police usually get paid for their services?
    Oh...but we do get paid. Every time you purchase something from a store, it is due to safe passages through trade routes all around the world. It is due to stabilities in regions where uncontrolled disruptions would send the world into a spiral. To pretend that we haven't been paid since the Barbary Pirates Wars by our abilities to deploy into the outside world is foolish. Not every threat is about immediate defense. You don't need your very angry lunatic neighbor to shoot you in the face before you can recognize the threat. Even Somali pirates off that coast are a threat to free trade. And hey, look at that....without mentioning the global military and national treats off and on to the free democratic world's way of life, I went from Barbary pirates to Somali pirates.
    Last edited by MSgt; 02-13-11 at 05:21 PM.

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  4. #54
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    Re: Do you support Obama in continuing the Afghanistan war?

    Quote Originally Posted by MSgt View Post
    Nearsighted nonesense. Let's just pull out before the Pathan government can keep the Tali-ban suppressed, thereby having to spend even more money later to have to send our troops right back to do what we should have given them time to do in the first place.

    Afghanistan: Land of Conflict and Beauty. - John C. Griffith
    Afghanistan: A Military History From Alexander The Great to the Fall of the Taliban. - Stephen Tanner
    Three Cups of Tea. - Greg Mortneson and David Oliver Relin
    The War for Muslim Minds. - Gilles Kepel


    Here are four good sources to what is going on. Do yourself a favor and gain some insight. The sophomoric protests and nearsighted sensationalist loyalities that would have Iraq controlled by Hussein or in ruins right now aren't in our best interests when it comes to Afghanistan either.
    You are welcome to your viewpoint. I don't happen to share it. I still believe it is unrealistic to think we have the time or money to convert Afghanistan to our way of central government.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: Do you support Obama in continuing the Afghanistan war?

    Quote Originally Posted by MSgt View Post
    Oh...but we do get paid. Every time you purchase something from a store, it is due to safe passages through trade routes all around the world.
    It is due to stabilities in regions where uncontrolled disruptions would send the world into a spiral. To pretend that we haven't been paid since the Barbary Pirates Wars by our abilities to deploy into the outside world is foolish. Not every threat is about immediate defense. You don't need your very angry lunatic neighbor to shoot you in the face before you can recognize the threat. Even Somali pirates off that coast are a threat to free trade. And hey, look at that....without mentioning the global military and national treats off and on to the free democratic world's way of life, I went from Barbary pirates to Somali pirates.

    Considering we spend more on the military than the rest of the world combined, I'm not too worried about modern day pirates to tell you the truth. This is not a problem that requires our world wide military occupation.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  6. #56
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    Re: Do you support Obama in continuing the Afghanistan war?

    Quote Originally Posted by MSgt View Post
    Afghanistan has a chance and is improving exponentially. Stop looking for Vermont and you won't be dissapointed.
    I'm not looking for Vermont, I'm looking for signs that Afghanistan is any better off economically than it was before...and more to the point, that it is sufficiently better off to warrant the enormous amount of resources we have poured into nation-building there. I'm not seeing it. Afghanistan is still one of the poorest countries on earth. It's still one of the most corrupt countries on earth. And its geography isn't going to change anytime soon. Afghanistan is landlocked and will remain dependent on its coastal neighbors, like Pakistan, for a very long time. As long as Pakistan remains poor, Afghanistan is not going to be able to develop its economy very much. If we're going to go on a nation-building adventure, Pakistan would be a much better target than Afghanistan...or even better, plenty of spots in Africa and India that we've forgotten exist.

    Quote Originally Posted by MSgt
    Because of Iraq, Afghanistan has not had 10 years of focus. They have it now. U.S. Marines are no longer deploying to Iraq. Without "pulling them out now" in ten years, Afghanistan will be strong while the fractured insignificant Tali-Ban is probably seeking to topple the Pakistani government. I've stated this for years....."The War on Terror is generational and region wide."
    The US military is not well-equipped to build nations. They can (sometimes) provide security, but that alone is not going to build a nation. And there is absolutely no reason to expect the economic or political situation in Afghanistan to improve anytime soon.

    If our purpose for being in Afghanistan is national security, then let's have THAT debate and stop muddling the mission by pretending that we're nation-building. And if we're legitimately interested in being altruistic and building nations, then let's focus our humanitarian efforts on places that it CAN work: India, Bangladesh, Ghana, Cote d'Ivoire, etc.
    Last edited by Kandahar; 02-13-11 at 05:45 PM.
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    Re: Do you support Obama in continuing the Afghanistan war?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    You are welcome to your viewpoint. I don't happen to share it. I still believe it is unrealistic to think we have the time or money to convert Afghanistan to our way of central government.
    That is precisely why we (they, the guys and gals in theater) are working on promoting a secure DECENTRALIZED solution to this problem, by empowering the provinces. MSgt could perhaps clarify this, but I recall having read that this is the new strategy given the tribal nature of Afghanistan and the centralized corruption.

  8. #58
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    Re: Do you support Obama in continuing the Afghanistan war?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    You are welcome to your viewpoint. I don't happen to share it. I still believe it is unrealistic to think we have the time or money to convert Afghanistan to our way of central government.
    And this is why you are destined to be dissapointed. Like Iraq, the goal is not Vermont in the desert.

    In regards to Afghanistan, its history is very Pathan controlled. As long as the central government respects the soveriegnty of the local outlying tribes (which shares a common divided theme with the others around the borders), then the tribes will accept Pathan government. This is historical. This is where the Soviets and so many other outsiders failed. Even between outside invasions over the last 2,500 years, their internal frictions and "wars" it was the Pathan government that offerred the greatest stability. A strong Pathan government with a trained ANSF/ANAF will do the job we need against the Taliban and Al-Queda base of operations so that we can leave.

    In other words, "We are not about to send American boys nine or ten thousand miles away from home to do what Asian boys ought to be doing for themselves" isn't possible without providing them the means to do it.

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    Re: Do you support Obama in continuing the Afghanistan war?

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    A positive outcome would be a relatively stable government in place and with enough power to police itself to prevent the return of terrorist groups who threaten the US. How long it will take I have no idea.
    The terrorist groups are just going to move somewhere else and we can't invade EVERYONE. All we're doing is justifying their position that the U.S. is sticking our nose into places we don't belong and fueling their hatred.

    Yeah, that's a good idea.
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    Re: Do you support Obama in continuing the Afghanistan war?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    The terrorist groups are just going to move somewhere else and we can't invade EVERYONE. All we're doing is justifying their position that the U.S. is sticking our nose into places we don't belong and fueling their hatred.

    Yeah, that's a good idea.
    Please let's remember we are all just expressing our opinions here. Redress was answering a question I had asked and gave an honest opinion. No need to be uncivil.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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