View Poll Results: Is Obama A War Criminal

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    46 53.49%
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Thread: Is Obama A War Criminal

  1. #91
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    Re: Is Obama A War Criminal

    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch View Post
    That would be my point, we pretty much need to start thinking about being "realistic" here. In my fantasy world I'm a lot younger and my wife looks suspiciously like a young sophia loren. {sigh}

    lol I think your age is showing here Dutch.

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    Re: Is Obama A War Criminal

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    lol I think your age is showing here Dutch.
    That's nice to look at at any age!!

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  3. #93
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    Re: Is Obama A War Criminal

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    There's nothing common about good sense. Many a person has thougth something sounded good and made sense only to find it was flawed, majorly flawed. You can't spread freedom or democracy at gun pont. And the fact is, iraq slowed down the movement and did not advance it.
    This is very bumper sticker. Fortunately, we have not spread freedom and democracy by gun point. We merely removed the hinderance we used to support. These people freely went to the polls and freely voted. They accomplished something that Arabs have never accomplished in history, despite their well to do it since the beginning of European colonialism. For peopole to dismiss this and default to their bumper srticker protest, they absolute disrespect these people as insignificant. They matter because an entire region is looking at them.


    The fact is that Iraq is going to push this region further than was possible before 2003. Are you watchning what is going on in Egypt? Do you think these people would be organizing in their protests for modernization and democracy were it not for the heart land of Islam serving as an example? You have been wrong in your shallow protests and the region is going to prove it. They already are. The protest of Iraq has become simple habit for most. Upon further analysis, the old pundits have become silent and only those too stubborn to admit they were short sighted continue the bumper sticker stage.

    Like it or not, but civilizational advancement and true peace has never come without blood shed. And ours depends on this backwards region's ability to emerge from their path into hellish terrorism and religious doctrine. Just what do you think this civilization will turn to when oil runs out if all theyt know is dictators, religious zealism, and oppression? 9/11 was nothing in a region where nuclear weapons are the future.


    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    No, Iraq is not the world. but it is the country we invaded needlessly.
    Only to the near sighted and short visioned. Iraq will and is changing the region.

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post

    And it is more than a little imperialistic to see us as remaking the world, especially by force. Woudl we really apporve of any other country, say Iran or Russia or China, remaking the world for us?
    Call it what you want, but it is the reality. Crack open any social history book. ....and Iran, China, and Russia stand for nothing that the majority of the world wants. This is why the majority of the world gravitated towards us. Even today, they may gripe about details, but they damn sure want us here. You should learn a little bit more about what this country has stood for since 1775 and what it has done for this world. People don't seem to realize that 1991 marked the end of thousands of years of oppressive prescription. Empire, Monarchy, Colonialism, Dictatorship, and Communism failed. What was left? And who made the global organizations to encourage "peace?" You should be prouder than what you are displaying.

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  4. #94
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    Re: Is Obama A War Criminal

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    No, I don't see your argument at all.

    C'mon man. It's because you have grown accustomed to shutting down and withdrawing into the 2003 protest. Even President Obama has recognized the path the region is on and even he can't avoid that a democratic Iraq is the focus. But you can? Maybe you haven't thought it through as you think. Hate Bush, hate Rumsfeld, hate the execution they planned, but recognize what's going on at least.
    Last edited by MSgt; 01-28-11 at 05:36 PM.

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    Re: Is Obama A War Criminal

    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch View Post
    Well, alrightie then!! let's start rounding up all american leaders starting with anyone still alive connected to fdr's administration because that man committed the most awful atrocities in american history. We might as well dig up anyone left from the truman administration as well. Nuking innocent japanese citizens just for nothing.....shame, shame.
    See, the problem is that pampered Americans (and pretending Europeans) like to feel that everything they see around them has been brought to them via perfect behavior and larger-than-life righteousness. A few (4 to be exact) terrorists get waterboarded and we automativcally become the German Nazi scourge of our times. Only Americans are so deluded as to thinking that their life styles are not earned by others who can't live up to the surface image of perfection.

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    Re: Is Obama A War Criminal

    Quote Originally Posted by MSgt View Post
    Only Americans are so deluded as to thinking that their life styles are not earned by others who can't live up to the surface image of perfection.
    If we don't live up to the "surface image of perfection," as you call it, then our lifestyle is not earned, it is cheated.

  7. #97
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    Re: Is Obama A War Criminal

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Incognito View Post
    If we don't live up to the "surface image of perfection," as you call it, then our lifestyle is not earned, it is cheated.
    Congratulations. This is the world you live in. Surface image of perfection is for your kind. Making it possible is for others. America has not built its reputation on dreams alone. Why...I even heard about a couple atomic bombs over civilian cities somewhere in our history too. Our image is sound. But traveling the gutter to achieve our global station is sometimes always necessary. I live it and see it. It's the rest of you that would secretly rather just not know so you don't have to feel that you have to address it.
    Last edited by MSgt; 01-29-11 at 03:15 PM.

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    Re: Is Obama A War Criminal

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    Well, Guy IS a Libertarian.
    So, what, you mean I'm principled?

  9. #99
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    Re: Is Obama A War Criminal

    Quote Originally Posted by MSgt View Post
    Congratulations. This is the world you live in. Surface image of perfection is for your kind. Making it possible is for others.
    If it's not possible then it's not possible, so be it. Better to succeed or fail as a country of high moral standards than using torture to achieve our goals.

    Quote Originally Posted by MSgt View Post
    America has not built its reputation on dreams alone. Why...I even heard about a couple atomic bombs over civilian cities somewhere in our history too. Our image is sound. But traveling the gutter to achieve our global station is sometimes always necessary. I live it and see it. It's the rest of you that would secretly rather just not know so you don't have to feel that you have to address it.
    I'm not sure why you keep bringing up atomic bombs, that was no war crime. Its irrelevant to this discussion. Torture of prisoners, however, is very much a war crime.

    I disagree with your utilitarian view of war crimes. The ends do not justify the means. We as a nation must respect the laws of war. The fact that we torture our prisoners signals an erosion of human rights. It's despicable. If we don't uphold the standard who will?

    I thank you for your service to this country. And it is brave people such as yourself that the laws of war protect.

  10. #100
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    Re: Is Obama A War Criminal

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Incognito View Post
    I'm not sure why you keep bringing up atomic bombs, that was no war crime. Its irrelevant to this discussion. Torture of prisoners, however, is very much a war crime.
    I bring up nuclear bombs, because if any President today drops them over Tehran or Beijing he would be blasted as a war criminal. This is my point. We need to get over our fascination to decree every damn thing a war crime just to satisfy our sense of self righteous superiority. As if war is something that is supposed to come with Milton Bradley instructions. The torture of prisoners is a war crime. Of course, being placed into uncomfortable positions is not torture. And waterboarding is a pascifists next step to declaring the use of bullets and harsh speak as a war crime. We can't even sand bag our prisoners on the battle field anymore in order to disorient him to his surroundings (which is prisoner 101) because the "watchdogs" whined about it being unnecessary and torturous. Once it became a political liability, decades old rules were out the window.

    Guess what.....these types of things will persist without CNN's attention. But the American people will have back their illusions won't they? Or do you really think that Cold War spies were treated with kid gloves? Or that combatants on the battle field are given massages? The way these people were behaving was criminal and comparing the U.S. and it's "servents" to Nazis and actual torturous monsters was depraved.
    Last edited by MSgt; 01-30-11 at 11:46 AM.

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