View Poll Results: Were the Nazis...

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  • Predominantly Right Wing

    123 50.20%
  • Predominantly Left Wing

    75 30.61%
  • Largely in the center

    18 7.35%
  • Don't know/unsure/no opinion/none of the above

    29 11.84%
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Thread: Were the Nazis Right or Left Wing?

  1. #61
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    Re: Were the Nazis Right or Left Wing?

    It's both hard and easy to describe Nazism
    Political ideology is not simply "left" or "right" wing. There's economicalnd political left and right wing. Communism believes in economical left (collectives, etc...) and political left (surveillance, etc...). Nazism is a mix. Economical right (economic freedom without regulation or government interference), and political left (surveillance, etc...). It's very incorrect to say that Communism and Nazism (of Fascism for that matter) are similar. In fact, they are very different, with both sides hating the other.
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    Re: Were the Nazis Right or Left Wing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Proud South Korean View Post
    It's both hard and easy to describe Nazism
    Political ideology is not simply "left" or "right" wing. There's economicalnd political left and right wing. Communism believes in economical left (collectives, etc...) and political left (surveillance, etc...). Nazism is a mix. Economical right (economic freedom without regulation or government interference), and political left (surveillance, etc...). It's very incorrect to say that Communism and Nazism (of Fascism for that matter) are similar. In fact, they are very different, with both sides hating the other.
    Even the authoritarian/libertarian left/right dual spectra view is laughably simplistic.

    I prefer to take things issue by issue, these sorts of descriptions attempt to craft a model on top of innumerable individual issues, and one large flaw of this process is that it basically takes an average issue view, ignoring extremes. This allows people to take that average and claim that therefore one issue that someone is for therefore fits the curve perfectly.

    For example, imagine if Glenn Beck acknowledged global warming and was a true blue environmentalist. Just because on average his views tend to be "right wing" doesn't mean that that individual view on that individual issue fits the curve.

    There are numerable other problems, but I think I've made my point.

  3. #63
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    Re: Were the Nazis Right or Left Wing?

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Comments from the other thread:

    Remember. Nazism is closer to fascism than anything else. The father of modern fascism was Mussolini, who, in his description of fascism, indicated that it was completely opposed to socialism and any left wing ideology. Fascism really can't be categorized on a right-left spectrum, though the kind of fascism that Nazism was can be more easily described as "far right" than anything else. Those who try to paint it as "leftwing" don't know what they are talking about, and are only spewing partisan distortions.

    Here is the link to Mussolini's description:

    Mussolini - THE DOCTRINE OF FASCISM

    And a few key quotes:




    Notice how it is anti-liberal and anti-socialist.

    Nazism, a specific form of fascism, is anti-liberal, anti-communist (remember how much Hitler hated the communists), anti-socialist, and anti-capitalist. Also remember... during the Night of the Long Knives, Hilter killed George Strasser and all members of the left-wing part of the Nazi Party. From this point on, Nazism was solely right wing.
    There is a major difference between how Mussolini described fascism and how he carried it out.

    Ultimately, Fascism, Nazism, and Communism are neither left wing nor right wing. They are totalitarian ideologies based upon maximized authoritarian control and minimized individual freedom. The major difference between the two had to do with nationalism and mysticism.

  4. #64
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    Re: Were the Nazis Right or Left Wing?

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Also remember... socialism is about equality. Nazism was anything but that.
    But the equality of socialism espoused by historical figures is nothing to pine for. The equality of socialism has almost always (I can't think of an example to the contrary) led to slavery and starvation.

  5. #65
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    Re: Were the Nazis Right or Left Wing?

    Quote Originally Posted by SirPwn4lot View Post
    Were the Nazi Party of Germany a right wing or left wing establishment?

    I figure this is a better place to discuss than on someone else's thread like we were

    Opinions?
    Did you do a search before starting this thread? It's all been hashed out before.
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    Re: Were the Nazis Right or Left Wing?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    Here's a question then...

    Is it possible for fascism to be a good thing?

    Say, without some or all of the various negative parts Nazism involved?

    No state-sponsored/run racism, bigotry, homophobia, etc…
    Certain aspects of Nazism and fascism are "good".
    But even with the "good", these two are "bad", overall , the bottom line..
    As much as we malign Hitler, and others, he did care about the German people.
    But it was his own definition of the German people that,IMO, did him in..
    Excluding minorities was not very nice of this SOB.
    An excellent discussion within this thread.

  7. #67
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    Re: Were the Nazis Right or Left Wing?

    Quote Originally Posted by ElijahGalt View Post
    The Nolan Chart may be able to help you out:

    I had this mental picture of two spheres, one inside the other, mounted on one of those gyro things...


    But methinks I'm nuts...
    Education.

    Sometimes I think we're alone. Sometimes I think we're not. In either case, the thought is staggering. ~ R. Buckminster Fuller

  8. #68
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    Re: Were the Nazis Right or Left Wing?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    I had this mental picture of two spheres, one inside the other, mounted on one of those gyro things...


    But methinks I'm nuts...
    Naw, more of an 11-dimensional calibai-yau type figure



    nazis are where the pink folds into the bluish black beside the white.

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    Re: Were the Nazis Right or Left Wing?

    the Nazi party platform was built basically (as near as I can read it) on three things:
    1. German National Unity
    2. Jews are Subhuman
    3. Left-wing economics.

    excerpts from the Nazi Party Platform circa 1920 admittedly edited to the economic portions to highlight the point under discussion:

    We therefore demand:

    11. The abolition of all income obtained without labor or effort. Breaking the Servitude of Interest

    12. In view of the tremendous sacrifices in property and blood demanded of the Nation by every war, personal gain from the war must be termed a crime against the Nation. We therefore demand the total confiscation of all war profits.

    13. We demand the nationalization of all enterprises (already) converted into corporations (trusts).

    14. We demand profit-sharing in large enterprises.

    15. We demand the large-scale development of old-age pension schemes.

    16. We demand the creation and maintenance of a sound middle class; the immediate communalization of the large department stores, which are to be leased at low rates to small tradesmen. We demand the most careful consideration for the owners of small businesses in orders placed by national, state, or community authorities.

    17. We demand land reform in accordance with our national needs and a law for expropriation without compensation of land for public purposes. Abolition of ground rent and prevention of all speculation in land.

    18. We demand ruthless battle against those who harm the common good by their activities. Persons committing base crimes against the People, usurers, profiteers, etc., are to be punished by death without regard of religion or race.

    20. In order to make higher education—and thereby entry into leading positions—available to every able and industrious German, the State must provide a thorough restructuring of our entire public educational system. The courses of study at all educational institutions are to be adjusted to meet the requirements of practical life. Understanding of the concept of the State must be achieved through the schools (teaching of civics) at the earliest age at which it can be grasped. We demand the education at the public expense of specially gifted children of poor parents, without regard to the latter’s position or occupation.

    21. The State must raise the level of national health by means of mother-and-child care, the banning of juvenile labor, achievement of physical fitness through legislation for compulsory gymnastics and sports, and maximum support for all organizations providing physical training for young people.
    Fascism at it's time was a pretty thoroughly left-wing movement. which is why it was originally admired by leftists in other nations (including the US). even the more disgusting aspects (such as eugenics) had their mirrors in the Progressive elements abroad and in the US.

  10. #70
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    Re: Were the Nazis Right or Left Wing?

    Both fascist and communist states promote a corporatist economy, where the merger of political and economic influence occurs and politicians nationalize all industries.

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