View Poll Results: Should the AZ shooter have been able to buy a gun?

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Thread: Should the AZ shooter have been able to buy a gun?

  1. #161
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    Re: Should the AZ shooter have been able to buy a gun?

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    It's easy to use hindsight, but there's no way to prove that he couldn't have inserted a fresh magazine, locked, cocked and rocked.

    It's all about reaction time. With a 30 round mag, the defenders had more reaction time than they would if he would have been firing a 15 round mag. based on that fact--and yes, it's a fact--there's no guarantee that they would have been able to to stop him from emptying, or nearly emptying the second 15 round mag. He scored 20 hits out of 30 rounds. That's not exactly expert shooting, considering the range and the fact that he was receiving return fire, but it ain't "maggie's drawers", either.

    So, let's say that he scored the same percentage with a 15 round mag. He would have scored 10 hits. With a higher probability of reloading and engaging more targets.

    It's highly possible that he didn't practice shooting, unlocking, reloading and recommencing fire, because he had a 30 round mag and didn't really think he would empty that mag, much less reload a second. Had he two 15 round mags and he was prepped to reload, he could have pulled it off.

    Based on my own firearms experience, I doubt it would have made much of a difference.
    How does using a 15 round magazine give the shooter a "higher probability of reloading and engaging more targets?" Also, what is about using a 15 round clip would lessen the possibilities of the shooter being tackled before he could reload?

    If we could reduce the number killed in a gun massacre, would it be worth the effort? What hardship does it present to average citizens to not have weaponry that is superior to standard issue for police officers?
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  2. #162
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    Re: Should the AZ shooter have been able to buy a gun?

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    He may had a extra gun or used better aim. Plus there is no guarantee if he would have been stopped while quickly removing the empty magazine and sticking in a full magazine.
    Are you really arguing that we shouldn't bother banning the sale of high capacity magazines because he could always have done something else? It's bizarre. By conservative lights, there's no point in fixing something because something else will just go wrong!
    “Real environmentalists live in cities, and they visit what's left of the wilderness as gently and respectfully as possible.” — Donna Moulton, letter to the editor, Tucson Weekly, published on August 23, 2001

  3. #163
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    Re: Should the AZ shooter have been able to buy a gun?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chappy View Post
    Are you really arguing that we shouldn't bother banning the sale of high capacity magazines because he could always have done something else?
    That and the fact I do not want you anti-2nd amendment loons getting a baby step.


    It's bizarre. By conservative lights, there's no point in fixing something because something else will just go wrong!
    Nothing needs to be fixed. It does not take long to eject an empty magazine and to load a full one.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpQB3Id_3go
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

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  4. #164
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    Re: Should the AZ shooter have been able to buy a gun?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chappy View Post
    Are you really arguing that we shouldn't bother banning the sale of high capacity magazines because he could always have done something else? It's bizarre. By conservative lights, there's no point in fixing something because something else will just go wrong!
    Your opinion. There is no need to ban "high capacity magazines" as you put it. Nice spin on your last statement of, " there's no point in fixing something because something else will just go wrong!". We have adequate laws for the sell of firearms. Let me ask you something, we have laws against robbing banks, yet banks still get robbed. Will adding more laws stop bank robbers? Evil people will do evil things even with laws in place.
    "I can explain it to you but, I can't understand it for you"

  5. #165
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    Re: Should the AZ shooter have been able to buy a gun?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chappy View Post
    We actually control access to fertilizer more than we do to handguns.

    Logical people understand that these instruments in the wrong hands can cause enormous harm, indeed were made to do enormous harm, and hence should be carefully constrained. Today the constraints are laughable.
    Stricter controls on fertilizer? I can go right now and buy some no questions asked. Also a convicted felon or someone found to be mentally deficient can buy fertilizer.

    You mist want to back up your statement with some proof.
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  6. #166
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    Re: Should the AZ shooter have been able to buy a gun?

    Quote Originally Posted by mike2810 View Post
    … We have adequate laws for the sell of firearms. …
    Really? Should the sale of high capacity magazines be allowed? Who needs such things?
    “Real environmentalists live in cities, and they visit what's left of the wilderness as gently and respectfully as possible.” — Donna Moulton, letter to the editor, Tucson Weekly, published on August 23, 2001

  7. #167
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    Re: Should the AZ shooter have been able to buy a gun?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chappy View Post
    Why don't you ask the additional 10 people who he was able to shoot because he had a 30 round mag, or at least their next of kin?
    How about you send them an email and ask them to draw straws and see who would have gotten capped and who wouldn't?
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  8. #168
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    Re: Should the AZ shooter have been able to buy a gun?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chappy View Post
    Really? Should the sale of high capacity magazines be allowed? Who needs such things?

    And free man or woman who wants one.


    Need has nothing to do with it... Its none of your god damn business.
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

  9. #169
    I'm kind of a big deal

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    Re: Should the AZ shooter have been able to buy a gun?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chappy View Post
    We actually control access to fertilizer more than we do to handguns.

    Logical people understand that these instruments in the wrong hands can cause enormous harm, indeed were made to do enormous harm, and hence should be carefully constrained. Today the constraints are laughable.
    nice dodge, nice try, what about SUVs? Never been carded or asked questions to get fertilizer either lol
    sorry i just don't buy into your "the sky is falling" rhetoric

    what about gasoline? Kerosene? rat poison?

    Like I said LOGICAL people blame the person, without a gun he could have found a number of ways to kill less equal or more people, thats just common sense you choose to ignore and focus on the wrong thing LOL
    Last edited by AGENT J; 01-12-11 at 06:30 PM.
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  10. #170
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    Re: Should the AZ shooter have been able to buy a gun?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    How does using a 15 round magazine give the shooter a "higher probability of reloading and engaging more targets?" And what is about using a 15 round clip would lessen the possibilities of the shooter being tackled before he could reload?
    Because of the reaction times of the defenders. It would take the same amount of time for them to get passed the initial shock, determine where the fire was coming from and then react. So, one 30 round mag, or two 15 round mags; I don't think it would have made much difference, if any.

    If we could reduce the number of hand gun deaths, would it be worth the effort? What hardship does it present to average citizens to not have weaponry that is superior to standard issue for police officers?
    History has proven that it won't reduce hand gun deaths. So, at the end of the day, all you've accomplished is violating the rights of American citizens.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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