View Poll Results: Which Religion is more "pushy?" Christianity or Islam?

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  • Christianity

    22 26.19%
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    62 73.81%
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Thread: Which Religion is more "pushy?" Christianity or Islam?

  1. #161
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    Re: Which Religion is more "pushy?" Christianity or Islam?

    Quote Originally Posted by SheWolf View Post
    He already mentioned that early Christians were persecuted in Rome, and I am not debating that part. It's true, it's a fact... I am not white washing anything. They were victims, but they also victimized and persecuted other religions.
    You highlighted his comment "The initial spread of Christianity was largely peaceful." and went on to say "Are you telling me that the Catholic Church didn't persecute Pagans in the early days of Christianity?" You then proceeded to cut out the first sentence which sets the precedent about the early spread of Christianity.

    His comments are factual and correct. By time the Romans became Chrsitians hundreds of years had passed. So you are trying to compare what happend long after Christianity had spread and was no longer a fledging religion.

    You are indeed trying to whitewash the time progression to suit your argument. The facts however refute your statements.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

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    Re: Which Religion is more "pushy?" Christianity or Islam?

    I defy anyone to find one passage of Christian Scripture that propagates the spread of Christianity through violence. There are many false premises attempting to be established. The Holy Bible is the only valid source that Christian Faith derives (Romans 10:16), "Faith cometh by hearing and hearing by the Word of God". All the messages that are propagated by Christianity profess that All SCRIPTURE is inspired of God and only THE WORD holds the capacity to make the man of God perfect in seeking righteousness (2 Tim. 3:16-17).

    One false premise is presented in attempting to Blame the religion of Christianity for the Crusades and Inquisitions, again I defy anyone to find one passage where Christianity is to be spread at the point of the sword...just one. The Crusades and Inquisitions came about due to CATHOLIC DOGMA as declared through Papal "TRADITION"....not because of the Doctrine presented in the Inspired Word of God. In fact the Vatican ruled most of the European States during that time period, and one Papal Edict made it illegal for any lay person to be in possession of any Biblical Text...thus, the only Doctrine being taught was a doctrine of Dogma and Tradition which brought us such noble traditions as the Crusades and Inquisitions.

    With the Advent of the printing press and the translation of the Holy Bible from Latin into the King James English...the PEOPLE found the chance and opportunity to discover what the actual record presented, and the rest is history...its Called the Protestant Reformation of the Church when the people rose up in mass and decided to go back to the Written Word as the only source of Christian Doctrine which in turn lead to the eventual founding of these United States of American which really was nothing but a rebellion against Roman Catholic Doctrine and its totalitarian despotism. Thus, the very first amendment to the United States Constitution....WE the PEOPLE made it clear that no CENTRAL GOVERNMENT had the authority to ESTABLISH a STATE MANDATED CHURCH to the exclusion of any one protestant movement of which there were many in the early days of this nation's founding.

    The Argument being made that CHRISTIANITY is someone responsible for the evil that lays in the heart of men who have been endowed will FREE WILL is absurd. The comparison is like making the statement because you were bitten by a certain breed of DOG....I am responsible because I own the same bread of dog, therefore ALL SUCH animals are evil...without the consideration that any domestic animal only reflects the teaching their masters have bestowed upon them, its an absurd argument. What? Are we to outlaw the practice of OPEN HEART SURGERY because up to 10% of those who undergo that life saving procedure are lost due to the danger of that operation? The same applies to the use of modern Technology, are we to ban the use of Electrical Energy because some have abused that source of energy and have been killed through IGNORANCE? MY DOG BITES....so YOURS MUST? Really? Not logical in the least.
    Last edited by Walter; 02-18-11 at 05:31 PM.

  3. #163
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    Re: Which Religion is more "pushy?" Christianity or Islam?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    You highlighted his comment "The initial spread of Christianity was largely peaceful." and went on to say "Are you telling me that the Catholic Church didn't persecute Pagans in the early days of Christianity?" You then proceeded to cut out the first sentence which sets the precedent about the early spread of Christianity.

    His comments are factual and correct. By time the Romans became Chrsitians hundreds of years had passed. So you are trying to compare what happend long after Christianity had spread and was no longer a fledging religion.

    You are indeed trying to whitewash the time progression to suit your argument. The facts however refute your statements.
    I look at early days of Christianity and the spread of the religion throughout Rome and Europe as two separate things. The spread of Christianity met a lot of resistance in Rome and then in Europe, and Europe wasn't completely converted until after the establishment of the Holy Roman Empire... which was after Rome fell of course.

    Inquisitions and persecution of European Pagans lasted well into the Medieval Era, and the slowest places to accept the religion in Europe was the North. The Catholic Church also sent crusaders to northern Europe, so even after the majority of Romans accepted the religion it was still spreading to Europe.

    I honestly don't think I am white washing the facts... I was always thinking about the spread of Christianity in these terms, not as you define it.

    By time the Romans became Chrsitians hundreds of years had passed.


    ... Yes that's true, but that doesn't mean I am being dishonest, because even though 100 years may have passed, the religion wasn't done spreading.

    The quote pretty much sums it up...

  4. #164
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    Re: Which Religion is more "pushy?" Christianity or Islam?

    This question is a lot like asking whether Coke or Pepsi taste better.
    Never think that war, no matter how necessary, nor how justified, is not a crime.~ Ernest Hemingway

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    Re: Which Religion is more "pushy?" Christianity or Islam?

    Quote Originally Posted by Arcadius View Post
    This question is a lot like asking whether Coke or Pepsi taste better.
    Except COKE does not propagate the sale of their product with the intent being world domination...at the point of a sword.

  6. #166
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    Re: Which Religion is more "pushy?" Christianity or Islam?

    Quote Originally Posted by Walter View Post
    Except COKE does not propagate the sale of their product with the intent being world domination...at the point of a sword.
    I believe I was using Coke as analogy for them both doing that. Christians just aren't as blatant about it. How recently isn't really an issue.
    Never think that war, no matter how necessary, nor how justified, is not a crime.~ Ernest Hemingway

  7. #167
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    Re: Which Religion is more "pushy?" Christianity or Islam?

    Quote Originally Posted by SheWolf View Post
    I look at early days of Christianity and the spread of the religion throughout Rome and Europe as two separate things. The spread of Christianity met a lot of resistance in Rome and then in Europe, and Europe wasn't completely converted until after the establishment of the Holy Roman Empire... which was after Rome fell of course.

    Inquisitions and persecution of European Pagans lasted well into the Medieval Era, and the slowest places to accept the religion in Europe was the North. The Catholic Church also sent crusaders to northern Europe, so even after the majority of Romans accepted the religion it was still spreading to Europe.

    I honestly don't think I am white washing the facts... I was always thinking about the spread of Christianity in these terms, not as you define it.
    Then your response to his statement was not correct as I pointed out.

    Then you purposely cut out the first sentence as I said. It may have been unintentional, but re-reading your post, I doubt it. So this more than anything else was a hit on the credibility of the statement you picked to use.

    If I give you the benefit of the doubt about the whitewashing, at the very least you were manipulating the data to enforce your point.

    Quote Originally Posted by SheWolf View Post
    ... Yes that's true, but that doesn't mean I am being dishonest, because even though 100 years may have passed, the religion wasn't done spreading.
    It is actually still spreading to this day in some places. So I guess the early expansion according to your statement never ended?

    Quote Originally Posted by SheWolf View Post
    The quote pretty much sums it up...
    What quote?
    Last edited by Black Dog; 02-18-11 at 06:11 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

  8. #168
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    Re: Which Religion is more "pushy?" Christianity or Islam?

    Quote Originally Posted by Arcadius View Post
    I believe I was using Coke as analogy for them both doing that. Christians just aren't as blatant about it. How recently isn't really an issue.
    And I demonstrated that you are WRONG. (not to be PROGRESSIVELY assumed to mean WRONG!!!!!) There is only one standard that calibrates the Christian Religion and that would be the Holy Bible, and no where can you find a declaration of converting anyone to the faith against their will.....nowhere. Are you suggesting that people are born with an innate faith in Christianity and that faith has not been translated from generation to generation by the content of the Holy Scriptures? Its absurd to blame Christianity for the wrongs preformed by man when there is nothing in the standard that accepts such an act as being righteous. While on the other hand its a most easy thing to point to the Holy book of Islam and see the contrasting difference between the two religions. Its a most simple thing....point to the Book, Chapter and Verse where anyone could even assume that Christianity is to be promoted by violence.....but on the other hand............


    Islam promotes a message in the Koran that suggests when any Muslim "thinks" they are being persecuted that it is the duty of the loyal Muslim to "...smite them on the neck until you have routed them..." (Surah 47:4), "Fight in the way of Allah against those who fight against you......slay the aggressors wherever you find them....fight them until PERSECUTION is no more" (persecution can be perceived as anything, one can be interpreted as being a persecutor for simply supporting the nation of Israel) -- Surah 2:190-194).

    WARFARE IS ORDAINED IN YOU.................(Surah 2: 216-217).

    One does not need a blindfold to take the COKE v PEPSI challenge, just "commonsense".
    Last edited by Walter; 02-18-11 at 08:41 PM.

  9. #169
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    Re: Which Religion is more "pushy?" Christianity or Islam?

    Quote Originally Posted by Walter View Post
    One false premise is presented in attempting to Blame the religion of Christianity for the Crusades and Inquisitions, again I defy anyone to find one passage where Christianity is to be spread at the point of the sword...just one. The Crusades and Inquisitions came about due to CATHOLIC DOGMA as declared through Papal "TRADITION"....not because of the Doctrine presented in the Inspired Word of God. In fact the Vatican ruled most of the European States during that time period, and one Papal Edict made it illegal for any lay person to be in possession of any Biblical Text...thus, the only Doctrine being taught was a doctrine of Dogma and Tradition which brought us such noble traditions as the Crusades and Inquisitions.
    Source for that???

    With the Advent of the printing press and the translation of the Holy Bible from Latin into the King James English...the PEOPLE found the chance and opportunity to discover what the actual record presented, and the rest is history...its Called the Protestant Reformation of the Church when the people rose up in mass and decided to go back to the Written Word as the only source of Christian Doctrine which in turn lead to the eventual founding of these United States of American which really was nothing but a rebellion against Roman Catholic Doctrine and its totalitarian despotism. Thus, the very first amendment to the United States Constitution....WE the PEOPLE made it clear that no CENTRAL GOVERNMENT had the authority to ESTABLISH a STATE MANDATED CHURCH to the exclusion of any one protestant movement of which there were many in the early days of this nation's founding.
    Umm.. you know that the printing press (in Europe) was invented by a Catholic, the Bible initially printed by a Catholic, and the first translations into vernacular languages were done by Catholics? Right? Protestants took books out of the Bible and changed important passages in the New Testamement, and your beloved King James version was written by someone representing a church created for the purpose of getting an annulment as well as to establish his personal control over the national Church.
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    Re: Which Religion is more "pushy?" Christianity or Islam?

    Quote Originally Posted by ludahai View Post
    Source for that???



    Umm.. you know that the printing press (in Europe) was invented by a Catholic, the Bible initially printed by a Catholic, and the first translations into vernacular languages were done by Catholics? Right? Protestants took books out of the Bible and changed important passages in the New Testamement, and your beloved King James version was written by someone representing a church created for the purpose of getting an annulment as well as to establish his personal control over the national Church.
    Source? What, another progressively educated person. Source History Actual. Why do you not present the evidence that proves that passages where taken out of the TEXT of the Holy Scriptures, and those supposedly omitted passages changed the CONTEXTUAL truth of that message being relayed? Truth is Truth. Regardless of who invented the PRINTING PRESS...that does not preclude the Papal Edicts from existing that made the possession of the Holy Scriptures illegal, nor does it hide from the fact that Europe was controlled from the Vatican. Simply look at the history of how the Catholics persecuted Galileo when they stuck to the FLAT EARTH SCIENCES offered in the Greco-Roman tradition, and they did the same thing in perverting the Christian Doctrine to use in Spreading the Modern Roman Empire which is Catholicism by instigating the Inquisitions and Crusades under dogmatic tradition instead of Scriptural Doctrine.

    Roman Catholicism did not exist until the 4th Century when the Romans decided to USE Christianity under false premises to continue the falling empire. (if you can't bet them you join them)...but that did not stop the historical fact from existing that over 5000 copies of the Original Manuscripts existed long before any Council of Nicaea in 325 AD.
    Last edited by Walter; 02-18-11 at 10:15 PM.

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