View Poll Results: Amendments to the US Constitution

Voters
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  • Repeal the income tax and replace with the Fair Tax

    15 27.27%
  • Repeal Amendment 14

    9 16.36%
  • Abolish Govt-run welfare, health care, education, etc.

    10 18.18%
  • Mandate a balanced budget every year

    20 36.36%
  • Limit total taxes and spending to under 15%

    12 21.82%
  • Stop all wars and meddling abroad

    14 25.45%
  • Abolish all meddlesome regulations and mandates

    10 18.18%
  • Privatize social security

    12 21.82%
  • Make all states independent nations

    1 1.82%
  • Other (specify)

    25 45.45%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Thread: New Constitutional Amendment

  1. #71
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    Re: New Constitutional Amendment

    Quote Originally Posted by tlmorg02 View Post
    Get rid of the income tax, but I would say flat tax over "fair".
    Flat tax is not flat for sole proprietors... they wouldn't be able to deduct their business expenses... fair tax would be better for very low income earners than a straight flat tax...
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  2. #72
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    Re: New Constitutional Amendment

    Quote Originally Posted by ludahai View Post
    Flat tax is not flat for sole proprietors... they wouldn't be able to deduct their business expenses... fair tax would be better for very low income earners than a straight flat tax...
    Sole proprietors'll get screwed in any tax system if they are honest.
    Tucker Case - Tard magnet.

  3. #73
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    Re: New Constitutional Amendment

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    Sole proprietors'll get screwed in any tax system if they are honest.
    How would they get screwed in a Fair Tax system? Though, you are probably right...

    I like the provision in the Fair Tax for refunds to everyone equal to the amount of the tax up to the poverty line, but does anyone know if there is recompense for taxes paid on items for your business?
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  4. #74
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    Re: New Constitutional Amendment

    Quote Originally Posted by ludahai View Post
    How would they get screwed in a Fair Tax system? Though, you are probably right...

    I like the provision in the Fair Tax for refunds to everyone equal to the amount of the tax up to the poverty line, but does anyone know if there is recompense for taxes paid on items for your business?
    Granted, this is an assumption on my part, but my thinking is that somehow, the fact that sole proprieters have to buy more stuff in general will end up leaving them with a larger burden, much like the current state leaves sole proprietors with a larger burdern.

    I know that I've been paying more in taxes than wage earners at the same income level for most of my adult life. And I have to buy more stuff than they do in order to work. Currently, I can write off the stuff I have to buy, but I still get taxed differently.
    Tucker Case - Tard magnet.

  5. #75
    onomatopoeic
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    Re: New Constitutional Amendment

    My last post on FairYtax.
    The virus/Cult that keeps popping up everywhere on this board

    Quote Originally Posted by mbig View Post
    Virtually everyone will do better with Fairtax calculator because, well.. the rate is PHONY.

    Independent scoring of Fairytax (WSJ/NYT/Congressional Joint committee taxes, CTJ, etc) all score the REAL NEEDED Rate at 56%-57%.
    (Not including state sales taxes and state income taxes converted to sales taxes to make it work)
    65%-70% anyone?
    How would you do then?
    Because that's what's needed to offset the loss of rev from the rich.

    And the Claimed FairYtax rate is on EVERYTHING not just what state taxes are on now.

    FairYtax taxes FOOD, RENT (killing the lower classes and urban dwellers), Medicine, Surgical procedures.. EVERYTHING.

    That's right.. add any percent you like to rent or heart/Kidney ops and what have you got?
    Disaster. Debtor Prison.

    Because if you make, ie, $30 million and only spend $3 million to live... your tax rate goes from 38% of income + 15% tax on Div and cap gains, + estate tax.... goes to 10%.

    And the math even gets better if you make a Billion.
    Your rate goes from 38% of income to basically 0%-1% say 30% of $10 million
    A loss to the Federal govt of $350,000,000.
    Probably half a million people get to pay more to give Buffett alone a tax break!

    So since FairtYtax is 'revenue neutral'.. who pays more?

    Do ya think it's you? .. or the two Texas Billionaires who designed it?

    in fact, FairYtax basically inverts the current burden.
    The poor and middle who have to spend virtually All their income to live, pay 30% (read 60%) of all the make/spend.
    They become the New top Bracket.
    While the rich whose current Bracket is 35% drop to single digits.

    FairYtax is an obvious Scam.
    You don't need a degree to figure it out.
    'Flattax' is better but still Impossibly Regressive.

    You simply can't raise the rates on the low/middle at all. (while lowering it on the rich)
    Someone who makes 26k - aka Walmart, our largest employer- simply can't pay the same, ie, 25% as someone who makes 300k, or 300M.

    In past years we have had to regularly send out stimulous checks (which are progressive and mean more to the bottom) to keep the whole system running.. at all.
    Yes the proof of the pudding is even the big guys and the congress they finance have to send out some goodies so their Stock portfolios don't collapse because the Bulk of consumers can't afford that computer or car.

    No, what's need is to leave the rates alone.. just add a bracket 50%, for those making over $1 Mil a year. (and perhaps return the cap gains/Divs tax to what it was before the Bush Halving of those rates).

    That would return us to our more traditional top marginal rates when we were a 'socialist' country.

    Top US Marginal Income Tax Rates, 1913--2003 (TruthAndPolitics.org)
    Historical rates (married couples, filing jointly)

    Year/ Top Rate%/ Over

    1913 --- 7% 500,000
    1914 --- 7% 500,000
    1915 --- 7% 500,000
    1916 --- 15% 2,000,000
    1917 --- 67% 2,000,000
    1918 --- 77% 1,000,000
    1919 --- 73% 1,000,000
    1920 --- 73% 1,000,000
    1921 --- 73% 1,000,000
    1922 --- 58% 200,000

    1923 --- 43.5% 200,000
    1924 --- 46% 500,000
    1925 --- 25% 100,000
    1926 --- 25% 100,000
    1927 --- 25% 100,000
    1928 --- 25% 100,000
    1929 --- 24% 100,000
    1930 --- 25% 100,000
    1931 --- 25% 100,000
    1932 --- 63% 1,000,000
    1933 --- 63% 1,000,000
    1934 --- 63% 1,000,000
    1935 --- 63% 1,000,000
    1936 --- 79% 5,000,000
    1937 --- 79% 5,000,000
    1938 --- 79% 5,000,000
    1939 --- 79% 5,000,000
    1940 --- 81% 5,000,000
    1941 --- 81% 5,000,000
    1942 --- 88% 200,000
    1943 --- 88% 200,000
    1944--- 94 200,000
    1945 --- 94% 200,000
    1946 --- 86% 200,000
    1947 --- 86% 200,000
    1948 --- 82.% 400,000
    1949 --- 82% 400,000
    1950 --- 84.36% 400,000
    1951 --- 91% 400,000
    1952 --- 92% 400,000
    1953 --- 92% 400,000
    1954 --- 91% 400,000
    1955 --- 91% 400,000
    1956 --- 91% 400,000
    1957 --- 91% 400,000
    1958 --- 91% 400,000
    1959 --- 91% 400,000
    1960 --- 91% 400,000
    1961 --- 91% 400,000
    1962 --- 91% 400,000
    1963 --- 91% 400,000
    1964 --- 77% 400,000
    1965 --- 70% 200,000
    1966 --- 70% 200,000
    1967 --- 70% 200,000
    1968 --- 75.25% 200,000
    1969 --- 77% 200,000
    1970 --- 71.75% 200,000
    1971 --- 70% 60% 200,000
    1972 --- 70% 50 200,000
    1973 --- 70% 50 200,000
    1974 --- 70% 50 200,000
    1975 ----70% 50 200,000
    1976 --- 70% 50 200,000
    1977 --- 70% 50 203,200
    1978 --- 70% 50 203,200
    1979 --- 70% 50 215,400
    1980 --- 70% 50 215,400
    1981 --- 69% 50 215,400
    1982 --- 50% 85,600
    1983 --- 50% 109,400
    1984 --- 50% 162,400
    1985 --- 50 % 169,020
    1986 --- 50 % 175,250

    1987 --- 38.5% 90,000
    1988 --- 28% <8> 29,750 <8>
    1989 --- 28% <8> 30,950 <8>
    1990 --- 28% <8> 32,450 <8>
    1991 --- 31% 82,150
    1992 --- 31% 86,500
    1993 --- 39.6% 89,150
    1994 --- 39.6% 250,000
    1995 --- 39.6% 256,500
    1996 --- 39.6% 263,750
    1997 --- 39.6% 271,050
    1998 --- 39.6% 278,450
    1999 --- 39.6% 283,150
    2000 --- 39.6% 288,350
    2001 --- 39.1% 297,350
    2002 --- 38.6% 307,050
    2003 --- 35% 311,950
    It seems any attempt to return to historical Norms is "Class warfare"... when in Fact "There has been class warfare, and my side is winning" - Warren Buffett.

    The problem is oft here - young idealogues/partisans who have no history- just Hannity.
    Last edited by mbig; 01-12-11 at 07:14 PM.
    I'm personally sick of not being able to dunk a basketball because of racism.
    anon

  6. #76
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    Re: New Constitutional Amendment

    II.

    I am for a Balanced Budget except for years in extremis, such as the last two.

    About The Concord Coalition | The Concord Coalition

    Bigger govt, Smaller govt. Vote away!

    I care less on about size of govt than how Responsibly/Honestly it's run.

    (ie, You want to run a war/wars and give prescription drug benefits? You Cannot Lower taxes. Instead we should have a tax surcharge to pay for it and make people aware of what it costs. 100 Billion a yr)
    Last edited by mbig; 01-12-11 at 07:24 PM.
    I'm personally sick of not being able to dunk a basketball because of racism.
    anon

  7. #77
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    Re: New Constitutional Amendment

    Quote Originally Posted by ludahai View Post
    Flat tax is not flat for sole proprietors... they wouldn't be able to deduct their business expenses... fair tax would be better for very low income earners than a straight flat tax...
    I really don't care how the tax is manipulated as long as it doesn't effect me. As a Senior citizen, I pay no taxes, zippo...

    ricksfolly

  8. #78
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    Re: New Constitutional Amendment

    And by "other" I mean none of the above.

  9. #79
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    Re: New Constitutional Amendment

    Quote Originally Posted by mbig View Post
    My last post on FairYtax.
    The virus/Cult that keeps popping up everywhere on this board


    'Flattax' is better but still Impossibly Regressive.

    You simply can't raise the rates on the low/middle at all. (while lowering it on the rich)
    Someone who makes 26k - aka Walmart, our largest employer- simply can't pay the same, ie, 25% as someone who makes 300k, or 300M.

    In past years we have had to regularly send out stimulous checks (which are progressive and mean more to the bottom) to keep the whole system running.. at all.
    Yes the proof of the pudding is even the big guys and the congress they finance have to send out some goodies so their Stock portfolios don't collapse because the Bulk of consumers can't afford that computer or car.

    No, what's need is to leave the rates alone.. just add a bracket 50%, for those making over $1 Mil a year. (and perhaps return the cap gains/Divs tax to what it was before the Bush Halving of those rates).

    That would return us to our more traditional top marginal rates when we were a 'socialist' country.

    It seems any attempt to return to historical Norms is "Class warfare"... when in Fact "There has been class warfare, and my side is winning" - Warren Buffett.

    The problem is oft here - young idealogues/partisans who have no history- just Hannity.
    In 1982 taxes dropped from 69 to 50 pct and in 1987 down to 38.5 pct, a thirty percent drop during Reagan's term. Also during his term the Public Debt tripled. I wonder if his favoritism of the wealthy and big business had anything to do with it.

    ricksfolly

  10. #80
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    Re: New Constitutional Amendment

    Quote Originally Posted by mbig View Post
    My last post on FairYtax.
    The virus/Cult that keeps popping up everywhere on this board


    'Flattax' is better but still Impossibly Regressive.

    You simply can't raise the rates on the low/middle at all. (while lowering it on the rich)
    Someone who makes 26k - aka Walmart, our largest employer- simply can't pay the same, ie, 25% as someone who makes 300k, or 300M.

    In past years we have had to regularly send out stimulous checks (which are progressive and mean more to the bottom) to keep the whole system running.. at all.
    Yes the proof of the pudding is even the big guys and the congress they finance have to send out some goodies so their Stock portfolios don't collapse because the Bulk of consumers can't afford that computer or car.

    No, what's need is to leave the rates alone.. just add a bracket 50%, for those making over $1 Mil a year. (and perhaps return the cap gains/Divs tax to what it was before the Bush Halving of those rates).

    That would return us to our more traditional top marginal rates when we were a 'socialist' country.

    It seems any attempt to return to historical Norms is "Class warfare"... when in Fact "There has been class warfare, and my side is winning" - Warren Buffett.

    The problem is oft here - young idealogues/partisans who have no history- just Hannity.
    One thing your source ignored about the Fair Tax is that ALL tax paid up to the poverty line would be refunded. So, if you were in a family of four making 20k a year, you would pay ZERO federal tax... no income tax, no payroll tax, and yes, you pay tax on your rent, BUT that would be refunded, so for those living below the poverty line, not only would they not pay any tax, but they would get what is, in effect, an Earned Income Tax credit...
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