View Poll Results: What is same sex marriage?

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  • A special right

    109 56.77%
  • Equal protection

    62 32.29%
  • Other

    21 10.94%
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Thread: Same sex marriage: what is it really?

  1. #761
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    Re: Same sex marriage: what is it really?

    Quote Originally Posted by Your Star View Post
    But the same reason to institute SSM is the reason to institute opposite sex marriage.
    No it is not.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
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    Re: Same sex marriage: what is it really?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    No it is not.
    Why? You can't just say no, and have that be it.

    The reason to institute opposite sex marriage is to legally make people family, encourage people to provide a stable home for children, etc. And those same things can be accomplished, encouraged with SSM. And that is a fact.
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    Re: Same sex marriage: what is it really?

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    As was already posted, the reasoning would be the same for allowing any man/woman couple to marry. Since there is no distinction of those couples having to be able to or even to want to procreate, and the ability to naturally procreate is the only actual difference between all same sex couples and many opposite sex couples.
    As I have explained over and over and why, I do not agree.

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    And, I have explained, in detail, how discrimination can be OK.
    And I think that is bull**** and was not OK in any way. We keep seeing the effects of that stupidity today and it is not by any means OK.

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    Like I said before, you need context when you try to post what someone else has said. I have legal basis for my discrimination, that even the SCOTUS has held up. So far, there has been no rational, legal argument to discriminate against homosexuals.
    Well then I guess I also have a legal bases as it is illegal federally and in the vast majority of states.

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    And then you must also think that marriage for a man and woman of two different races is not a right?
    Please again race and sexuality are not even remotely connected.

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    There is no reason to actually endorse marriages between the races, is there?
    Not really, but it is still one man and one woman, so it is irrelevant. The only reason it even became an issue is because it was not illegal initially. Some states made it illegal much later. Homosexual marriage has never been legal in the US.

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    Afterall, marriage isn't a right (according to you), so why didn't the SCOTUS simply strike down laws that made it illegal for interracial couples to cohabitate. Why did they actually need the legal marriage?
    It is a right for one man and one woman, period.

    Again race has nothing at all to do with this issue.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

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    Re: Same sex marriage: what is it really?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    Homosexual marriage has never been legal in the US.
    It's currently legal in sevearl states.

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    Re: Same sex marriage: what is it really?

    Quote Originally Posted by Your Star View Post
    Why? You can't just say no, and have that be it.
    Ummmm.. I can and I did. Sort of blows a hole in that theory.

    Quote Originally Posted by Your Star View Post
    The reason to institute opposite sex marriage is to legally make people family, encourage people to provide a stable home for children, etc. And those same things can be accomplished, encouraged with SSM. And that is a fact.
    You have got to be kidding? It's for the children? really?

    You know as well as I do it has nothing at all to do with children.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

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    Re: Same sex marriage: what is it really?

    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    It's currently legal in sevearl states.
    5 small states in the east are not "several" unless you are including civil union states which I am OK with.

    The majority of states have already said no or are trying to outright ban it by changing their constitutions.

    Context...

    Well then I guess I also have a legal bases as it is illegal federally and in the vast majority of states. - Blackdog
    Last edited by Black Dog; 01-13-11 at 04:46 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

  7. #767
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    Re: Same sex marriage: what is it really?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    Ummmm.. I can and I did. Sort of blows a hole in that theory.
    Just cause you can do it doesn't make it logical, or an argument with substance.

    You have got to be kidding? It's for the children? really?

    You know as well as I do it has nothing at all to do with children.
    This has everything to do with families, and children are an integral part of families. Just because you want to pretend that it doesn't have anything to do with LGBT families doesn't mean that it isn't true. The fact is that LGBT families are just as legitimate as heterosexual families, and deserve the same benefits as straight families. It is in the best interest of the nation to promote family, and a stable living conditions for children, and SSM does that. And you can't argue that unless you want to argue that opposite marriage doesn't do that as well.
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    Re: Same sex marriage: what is it really?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    As I have explained over and over and why, I do not agree.



    And I think that is bull**** and was not OK in any way. We keep seeing the effects of that stupidity today and it is not by any means OK.



    Well then I guess I also have a legal bases as it is illegal federally and in the vast majority of states.



    Please again race and sexuality are not even remotely connected.



    Not really, but it is still one man and one woman, so it is irrelevant. The only reason it even became an issue is because it was not illegal initially. Some states made it illegal much later. Homosexual marriage has never been legal in the US.



    It is a right for one man and one woman, period.

    Again race has nothing at all to do with this issue.
    Discrimination is not always based on race. I specifically pointed out discrimination based on sex (women in combat). Do you think women should be able to serve in combat roles right now?

    Which is actually what same sex marriage discrimination is. The discrimination is about sex, not sexuality. As has been pointed out numerous times, gays can marry anyone of the opposite sex. In fact, two homosexuals can get a legal marriage. A homosexual woman can legally marry a homosexual man. There is absolutely no question on the legal marriage license about the sexuality of the two people involved. The only thing that matters is the sex of the two people involved. Which means that according to the 14th Amendment and the SCOTUS's standing that there are levels of scrutiny for the Equal Protection clause, race and religion being highest, followed by sex, then by everything else, same sex marriage should be evaluated under the middle tier scrutiny level (the government must show that the challenged classification serves an important state interest and that the classification is at least substantially related to serving that interest) since sex is the determining factor in the discrimination, not sexuality.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  9. #769
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    Re: Same sex marriage: what is it really?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    5 small states in the east are not "several" unless you are including civil union states which I am OK with.

    The majority of states have already said no or are trying to outright ban it by changing their constitutions.

    Context...

    Well then I guess I also have a legal bases as it is illegal federally and in the vast majority of states. - Blackdog
    You also said it was never legal in the United States, which is a fact.
    MA and CT are in no way 'small' unless you mean in terms of land size, which is irrelevant.

    Until something is illegalized, you should have the right to do it. How messed up would our country be otherwise?
    Until DOMA, the federal govt. did not legally define marriage.

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    Re: Same sex marriage: what is it really?

    Quote Originally Posted by Your Star View Post
    Just cause you can do it doesn't make it logical, or an argument with substance.
    Already put forth the arguments more times than I can remember. You guys don't want to accept it and I am OK with that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Your Star View Post
    This has everything to do with families, and children are an integral part of families. Just because you want to pretend that it doesn't have anything to do with LGBT families doesn't mean that it isn't true. The fact is that LGBT families are just as legitimate as heterosexual families, and deserve the same benefits as straight families. It is in the best interest of the nation to promote family, and a stable living conditions for children, and SSM does that. And you can't argue that unless you want to argue that opposite marriage doesn't do that as well.
    It is not about families or children etc. It is about forcing acceptance on others and making it "right." It has always been about that.

    Again; you know this as well as I do.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

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