View Poll Results: Is founding fatherism a religion?

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    34 61.82%
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Thread: Is founding fatherism a religion?

  1. #111
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    Re: Is founding fatherism a religion?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    See, this is why we need to retain the original intent and strict constructionism of the Constitution as our national frame of reference and supreme law... otherwise we devolve into populism.

    What if the majority felt that rape should be legal? What if 51% felt it should be legal to abuse/mistreat/discriminate against the other 49%? Unrestricted "democracy" was something the Founders were smart enough to fear... with very good reason.
    I don't know what makes this more ironic. The fact that you clearly state that you're from 'Dixie' or the fact that you're talking about 'legal discrimination' and the founders. Yes, those founders who created a document so purposely vague that it allowed for the legal discrimination of women and minorities. The best part is that you talk about populism. Wasn't it because of populism that the founders allowed the 3/5s? How else would they get the people of the South to join the Union? Yes... if it weren't for the constitution, we'd devolve into populism...
    Last edited by Hatuey; 01-03-11 at 04:44 AM.

  2. #112
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    Re: Is founding fatherism a religion?

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    If it was fairly straight forward as you say then why do you people think judges should be allowed to ignore the founding forefathers intentions?
    But just how do you know the "intentions" of each of the men who wrote the Constitution? Sure, with the Federalist Papers we have a good indicator of how a few of them felt at that time or at least what they felt they had to say to get ratification through. That leaves dozens of others. How do you know what their "intentions" were?
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  3. #113
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    Re: Is founding fatherism a religion?

    i think what most fail to grasp is that what the FF did was institute a government of for and by the people, a thing radically different from previous governments, what they all stood for was liberty of the individual, and that is the foundation of the USC, restriction of Government, not people....


    Some forget this, others, like myself, still fully believe in that ideal of liberty. I find this thread sad in a way.....
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

  4. #114
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    Re: Is founding fatherism a religion?

    Quote Originally Posted by TOJ View Post
    So if a majority feels slavery is right, you think that makes it only right that civilization turns in that direction?

    Interesting.

    How about human sacrifice? Or honor killing? Or any number of other dispicable things people have supported.
    If there was such a groundswelling of support for slavery or human sacrifice that enough people want it badly enough for fundamentally alter our society in favor of these things, I doubt we would even be asking these sort of questions.

    I personally think these things are wrong, but I also exist and was raised within the context of the modern US.
    Last edited by tacomancer; 01-03-11 at 05:11 PM.

  5. #115
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    Re: Is founding fatherism a religion?

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    If there was such a groundswelling of support for slavery or human sacrifice that enough people want it badly enough for fundamentally alter our society in favor of these things, I doubt we would even be asking these sort of questions.

    I personally think these things are wrong, but I also exist and was raised within the context of the modern US.
    So are you saying you personally don't agree with them, but you think they are just fine in places where a majority of the people do? You do realize slavery, honor killing, and similarly dispicable practices are currently being practiced in some areas, don't you?

    Is there anything you think should be prohibited, even if a majority approve of it?

    .

  6. #116
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    Re: Is founding fatherism a religion?

    Quote Originally Posted by TOJ View Post
    So if a majority feels slavery is right, you think that makes it only right that civilization turns in that direction?
    Whether you realize it or not, slavery is very much alive today. Workers have to do what demanding bosses tell them or lose their jobs. Of course they can quit and find another job but they'll still have to please the new boss. Maybe not as compelling as whips or beatings but just as effective.

    One way or another everyone works for a demanding boss, and bosses have their bosses all the way up to CEOs. Only the retired and SS recipients are exempt.

    ricksfolly

  7. #117
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    Re: Is founding fatherism a religion?

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    In a debate today, someone tried to settle a point by referencing what one of the founding fathers thought about it instead of arguing the point on its own merits.

    Is there some sort of religion out there that I am not aware of that considers these guys the end all and be all of argumentation as opposed to a person using their own reasoning?
    I think that understanding the thought-processes of the founding fathers is important. . .knowing *why* things were done is important to apply such thoughts to your actions or the future . . .and so on.

    But I think people tend to take it *too* far - and examine things *too much*
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  8. #118
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    Re: Is founding fatherism a religion?

    Quote Originally Posted by ricksfolly View Post
    Whether you realize it or not, slavery is very much alive today. Workers have to do what demanding bosses tell them or lose their jobs. Of course they can quit and find another job but they'll still have to please the new boss. Maybe not as compelling as whips or beatings but just as effective.

    One way or another everyone works for a demanding boss, and bosses have their bosses all the way up to CEOs. Only the retired and SS recipients are exempt.

    ricksfolly
    IMO, comparing a person that is working for a wage that they agreed to and is free to quit any damn time they please to slavery is dispicable and a person is dispicable for doing it.

    I find it hard to believe that anyone would even try to say Joe Blow working for wages from a legitmate company has it as bad as the real slaves of the past and those currently kept enslaved under penalty of severe physical harm or death.

    .

  9. #119
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    Re: Is founding fatherism a religion?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    I think that understanding the thought-processes of the founding fathers is important. . .knowing *why* things were done is important to apply such thoughts to your actions or the future . . .and so on.
    Too late for that. They're all dead and gone. The only things left are their words, letters, certain documents, and after the fact historian impressions.

    ricksfolly

  10. #120
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    Re: Is founding fatherism a religion?

    Quote Originally Posted by TOJ View Post
    IMO, comparing a person that is working for a wage that they agreed to and is free to quit any damn time they please to slavery is dispicable and a person is dispicable for doing it.

    .
    Like or not, that's the way things are and no excuses or rationalizations will make it any better. .. Not much different from the army where DIs made us all eat dirt.

    I'm retired with a pension and out of the rat race, finally able to see things the way they were...

    ricksfolly

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