View Poll Results: Should they?

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  • yes

    49 30.82%
  • no

    100 62.89%
  • other

    10 6.29%
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Thread: Should individuals born in foreign countries be able to run for president?

  1. #211
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    Re: Should individuals born in foreign countries be able to run for president?

    Quote Originally Posted by TOJ View Post
    Maybe I am wrong, but I thought the OP was referring to those who are not USA citizens at birth. Otherwise they would meet the birth qualification, would they not?



    What I was getting at is, what would be the point of changing the Constitution, if the results would be unlikely to improve.

    Also, you do realize that the constitutional change would have to be approved by the politicians in Congress and the states and probably 80% of those politicians think they should be President and would not want the additional competition.

    .
    How would you know that? I believe widening the pool of qualified individuals to be President might improve some results. And substantively, what makes a natural-born US citizen inherently better at being a President than a naturalized citizen?
    Last edited by StillBallin75; 03-26-11 at 12:11 AM.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

  2. #212
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    Re: Should individuals born in foreign countries be able to run for president?

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    How would you know that? I believe widening the pool of qualified individuals to be President might improve some results. And substantively, what makes a natural-born US citizen inherently better at being a President than a naturalized citizen?
    If leaders being elected in countries other than the USA are not better than those available in the USA, why do you think someone better would be elected in the USA.

    It is really no concern of mine. If the good citizens of the USA want to make that change to their Constitution they should have at it.

    But some people are arguing as if they think it might actually happen and I think that is rather silly.... or maybe they are just that naive.

    .

  3. #213
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    Re: Should individuals born in foreign countries be able to run for president?

    Quote Originally Posted by TOJ View Post
    If leaders being elected in countries other than the USA are not better than those available in the USA, why do you think someone better would be elected in the USA.

    It is really no concern of mine. If the good citizens of the USA want to make that change to their Constitution they should have at it.

    But some people are arguing as if they think it might actually happen and I think that is rather silly.... or maybe they are just that naive.

    .
    Well yes I don't think it's going to happen, but that's not what the poll is about. The poll is whether or not you think people born in foreign countries SHOULD be allowed to run for President.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

  4. #214
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    Re: Should individuals born in foreign countries be able to run for president?

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    Well yes I don't think it's going to happen, but that's not what the poll is about. The poll is whether or not you think people born in foreign countries SHOULD be allowed to run for President.
    If you say so.

    Obviously my original question went over your head. I asked it because it seems many think some fantastic candidate from another country would run and be elected. If they are not being elected in those countries where they are already qualified, what makes you think they would run and be elected to the USA Presidency.

    Also, some folks, including you, seemed to think that no one born outside the USA could be a natural born citizen or that natural born USA citizens born in other countries were disqualified from being the USA President. I don't believe that is the case, but then I could be wrong. After all, I don't have the benefit of an education in the USA government schools.

    If this whole thread was just meant to be a meaningless exercise, well... never mind.

    .

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    Re: Should individuals born in foreign countries be able to run for president?

    Obviously my original question went over your head. I asked it because it seems many think some fantastic candidate from another country would run and be elected. If they are not being elected in those countries where they are already qualified, what makes you think they would run and be elected to the USA Presidency.
    I don't know how you are coming to this conclusion. I believe there ARE foreign leaders who are more capable at running their countries than some US presidents are at governing America.

    Also, some folks, including you, seemed to think that no one born outside the USA could be a natural born citizen or that natural born USA citizens born in other countries were disqualified from being the USA President.
    I don't know where you are getting this. John McCain is one such example. However I believe the thread/poll is about naturalized US citizens born outside of the US, since natural born citizens born outside the US, like McCain, are already able to become President, that's not an issue.
    Last edited by StillBallin75; 03-26-11 at 02:44 PM.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

  6. #216
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    Re: Should individuals born in foreign countries be able to run for president?

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    I don't know how you are coming to this conclusion. I believe there ARE foreign leaders who are more capable at running their countries than some US presidents are at governing America.
    So then what was all the dancing around? Why didn't you just answer the damn question?

    Which was:
    What current foreign leader would you want as the President of the USA?


    Unless you think governing all countries is the same, it doesn't really matter how those leaders are running their countries. Do you think a leader that does an acceptable job leading their country would be a better USA President than anyone qualified under the current rules?


    I don't know where you are getting this. John McCain is one such example. However I believe the thread/poll is about naturalized US citizens born outside of the US, since natural born citizens born outside the US, like McCain, are already able to become President, that's not an issue.
    This may shock you, but its not all about you.

    Maybe if you would read some posts of others instead of trying to show how brilliant you are, you might see where I got that impression....or maybe your reading comprehension is just a tad off.

    .

  7. #217
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    Re: Should individuals born in foreign countries be able to run for president?

    Which was:
    What current foreign leader would you want as the President of the USA?
    Sorry, I hadn't seen your earlier post.

    Edit: I had seen your question, but didn't really understand it, sorry about that.

    Unless you think governing all countries is the same, it doesn't really matter how those leaders are running their countries. Do you think a leader that does an acceptable job leading their country would be a better USA President than anyone qualified under the current rules?
    It's possible. Yes, I understand governing other countries is not the same as governing the US, but it would never hurt to widen the pool of qualified candidates.

    Maybe if you would read some posts of others instead of trying to show how brilliant you are, you might see where I got that impression....or maybe your reading comprehension is just a tad off.
    Is it my responsibility to read every other post in the thread, now? I was just chiming in with my own opinion. Others are responsible for their opinions, and I'm responsible for mine, that is all.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

  8. #218
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    Re: Should individuals born in foreign countries be able to run for president?

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    Sorry, I hadn't seen your earlier post.

    Edit: I had seen your question, but didn't really understand it, sorry about that.



    It's possible. Yes, I understand governing other countries is not the same as governing the US, but it would never hurt to widen the pool of qualified candidates.
    So which ones?


    Is it my responsibility to read every other post in the thread, now? I was just chiming in with my own opinion. Others are responsible for their opinions, and I'm responsible for mine, that is all.
    Not if you don't mind looking stupid.

    .
    Last edited by TOJ; 03-26-11 at 07:52 PM.

  9. #219
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    Re: Should individuals born in foreign countries be able to run for president?

    Quote Originally Posted by TOJ View Post
    So which ones?


    Not if you don't mind looking stupid.

    .
    I wouldn't mind having someone like Angela Merkel over here, even if her approval ratings aren't so hot.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

  10. #220
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    Re: Should individuals born in foreign countries be able to run for president?

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    I wouldn't mind having someone like Angela Merkel over here, even if her approval ratings aren't so hot.
    OK, well there's one.

    Do you really think she is better than any natural born citizen of the USA would be? I suppose you probably know your country's citizens better than I.

    The USA government education system sure doesn't get the masses off to as good a start as the systems in many other countries so maybe some infusion of brains is needed.

    I don't know about Merkel though. She may very well be better than anything the USA has to offer, but I've never been that impressed with her. But I've not been all that impressed with those the good citizens of the USA have chosen lately either.

    .

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