View Poll Results: Who Was the Greatest Military Leader in History?

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  • Napoleon Bonaparte

    2 6.90%
  • Georgy Zhukov

    1 3.45%
  • Sir Arthur Wellesly (Duke of Wellington)

    1 3.45%
  • Alexander the Great

    13 44.83%
  • Ghenghis Khan

    8 27.59%
  • Alexander Suvorov

    1 3.45%
  • Julius Caesar

    1 3.45%
  • Helmuth von Moltke

    0 0%
  • Oliver Cromwell

    0 0%
  • Charlemagne

    2 6.90%
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Thread: The Greatest General in History

  1. #61
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    Re: The Greatest General in History

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    I too must agree with apdst, and I see no trouble doing so, when our views coincide.

    While Napoleon was defeated in the end, the way he revolutionised warfare has earned him a spot at the very top of nearly anyone's list.

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    Re: The Greatest General in History

    Maybe its the red, white and blue blood that flows through my viens, but I have to recomend George Washington. I mean he did start one of the most powerful militaries known on planet earth by defeating the previously most powerful military. that should count for something.

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    Re: The Greatest General in History

    I am disgruntled to see that Korean admiral Yi-Soon-Sin. He's a legendary character in military history.
    Here's an excellent link:Lord High Admiral Lee Soon Shin
    His most famous victory was when his 12 ships won over a Japanese fleet of 333. He didn't lose a single ship. Now, that's impossible to beat
    "The misery of being exploited by capitalists is nothing compared to the misery of not being exploited at all" - Joan Robinson
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    Re: The Greatest General in History

    Quote Originally Posted by Le Marteau View Post
    The US bit was indeed obvious -- but just as someone from London is not the same as someone from Manchester, someone from New York is not the same as someone from Chicago.

    In the UK, though, the term 'educated' means strictly higher education -- that is, university. When you say educated on the west coast, do you mean you went to uni there, or that you grew up there?
    CSUF Titans... Cailf State Universty Fullerton. It's in Orange County about 25 miles sou of Los Angeles.

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    Re: The Greatest General in History

    Quote Originally Posted by AmericanPatriot View Post
    Maybe its the red, white and blue blood that flows through my viens, but I have to recomend George Washington. I mean he did start one of the most powerful militaries known on planet earth by defeating the previously most powerful military. that should count for something.
    On the contrary, George Washington lost almost every battle he fought against the British -- his only victories were at Trenton and Princeton, in which he snuck across the Delaware in the middle of the night on Christmas Eve, and killed a bunch of Germans who were sleeping on Christmas morning. How bloody impressive.

    The war would have been lost by Washington, if not for the French. The French put thousands of troops on the ground, stalemated the British navy, and supported the war financially in its entirety -- the French won the war, without any caveat or but clause.

    Furthermore, the American military was ****e until after the First World War -- so it certainly wasn't Washington who founded the American military of today.

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    Re: The Greatest General in History

    There are a lot of people in the Polls forum, so I'm bumping this in the hopes of discussion.

  7. #67
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    Re: The Greatest General in History

    ... If Napoleon was brilliant at the operational level, there was little glitter and less subtlety on the battlefield. True, he produced a run of successes in his early years, leading up to the triumph of Jena-Auerstadt (1806). Thereafter, for every victory, there was a disaster or near-disaster. He won at Friedland (1807), but only after the bitter winter battle of Eylau; Wagram recovered the near-disaster of Aspern-Essling at huge cost; and there was little to celebrate at Borodino (1812). His flash of genius was apparent at Lützen (May 2nd, 1813), but Bautzen (May 20th–21st) was a draw, and the success of Dresden (August 26th–27th) was followed by the defeats of Kulm, the Katzbach and, finally and decisively, Leipzig (October 16th–19th). After the escape from Elba, Nap oleon’s success against the Prussians at Ligny (June 16th, 1815) was an illusion, shattered the same day by Quatre Bras and by Waterloo two days later.

    One common aspect of Napoleonic battles was the blood-letting. Because of his insistence on rapid marching to gain time, the myth grew up that ‘the Emperor uses our legs instead of our bayonets’. Nothing in the history of his campaigns shows this to be true. In battle after battle, the French conscripts would hold on in desperate combat, waiting for support from the rest of the army. Then, when the greatest possible mass had been assembled, the day would be settled – in victory or in a draw – by the crude application of force: massed artillery fire to blast holes in the enemy, and columns of infantry and cavalry pouring in. There is no subtlety here.

    A key judgement for any general is to understand what his army is capable of doing, and what is beyond its abilities. In the early years, Napoleon’s Grande Armée was the most capable battlefield force in the world; Napoleon could demand feats of endurance, sacrifice and complexity beyond those of his opponents. But the quality of its later performances declined as casualties took their toll on the troops and on his marshals. After the Russian campaign, Napoleon rarely tried to unite dispersed corps on the battlefield in the presence of the enemy during offensive operations because he could no longer rely on a high-quality holding action to buy time for the assembly of his main army. As performance declined, so the cost of fighting rose still higher. Bautzen cost Napoleon more than 20,000 casualties. Despite Dresden, the French army lost 150,000 men between June and September 1813. Leipzig cost him 70,000 men, including seventeen general officers. These figures equal the very worst days on the Western Front, yet the First World War generals are often vilified while Napoleon’s reputation shines.

    In the century after 1815 Napoleon’s legend was dominant: every general wanted to be him, to crush his enemy’s army, march into his capital, and attain the decisive victory. What did not dawn on his admirers, or on those responsible for teaching the military class of the future, was the simple fact that, in the end, Napoleon lost.

    Of course, Napoleon himself, writing his memoir, on St Helena, did all he could to disguise this. ...

    Napoleon was successful on many battlefields; and he may have been a master of campaigning. However, in strategic terms, he was a failure principally because he never succeeded in transforming a defeated enemy into a willing ally. He won wars, but he never won the peace.
    Jonathon Riley served in Bosnia and Iraq, where he was the general officer commanding British forces. He is now military adviser to CENTCOM and the author of several military histories; the latest, Napoleon as a General, is published by Continuum Books.
    How Good Was Napoleon? | History Today

    this is probably not what you wanted when bumping the thread
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

  8. #68
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    Re: The Greatest General in History

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    Jonathon Riley served in Bosnia and Iraq, where he was the general officer commanding British forces. He is now military adviser to CENTCOM and the author of several military histories; the latest, Napoleon as a General, is published by Continuum Books.
    How Good Was Napoleon? | History Today

    this is probably not what you wanted when bumping the thread
    Are you still trying to argue that Napoleon was a crappy general?
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  9. #69
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    Re: The Greatest General in History

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Are you still trying to argue that Napoleon was a crappy general?
    amazing! you were able to figure that out all by yourself
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

  10. #70
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    Re: The Greatest General in History

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    amazing! you were able to figure that out all by yourself
    Have you figure out that you're still wrong?

    We're guaging generals, not secretaries of state, of war, presidents, or government ministers.

    tactically speaking, Napoleon is at the top of the list. Do you recall any Civil War generals referencing Wellington's tactics?

    You don't actually think that Napoleonic Tactics that were used all the way through WW1 were called Napoleonic Tactics, because Someone else developed them, do you?

    I mean, hell, anytime the French win a battle, they definitely had one helluva leader at the head of the column.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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