View Poll Results: How would you vote on the compromise as described in the OP?

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Thread: Would you vote for the compromise?

  1. #71
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    Re: Would you vote for the compromise?

    Here is a thought


    As the US originally did not have an income tax, and funded most of the budget through excise taxes or tariffs, the US government should have only allowed merchants both foreign and US citizens to vote. Not property owners as they were not paying income taxes
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  2. #72
    Stigmatized! End R Word! Kali's Avatar
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    Re: Would you vote for the compromise?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    lets stop being evasive

    You know there are plenty of people who make no positive contributions to society-lets start with them.
    Maybe we should just put em in slave labor camps. You would probably support it
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  3. #73
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: Would you vote for the compromise?

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    You seem to believe that the only way one contributes is through their wallet. A VERY narrow view, indeed.
    you seem to think that existence is contribution. You also seem to think almost everyone is a net contributor

    but why should someone who doesn't contribute have equal say with those who do?



  4. #74
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    Re: Would you vote for the compromise?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    and why should they vote?
    Because as a citizen, they have to abide by the laws and rules of this society and country. I would be fine with them not voting if they did not have to do this or if there were no consequences for NOT doing it. Are you saying that you believe that if someone lives somewhere, it is reasonable for the government to take away their ability to have a say in how they are governed? You are sounding like a fascist.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
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    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
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  5. #75
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    Re: Would you vote for the compromise?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    but why should someone who doesn't contribute have equal say with those who do?
    Who would measure that contribution? The government? Direct conflict of interest.
    I'm already gearing up for Finger Vote 2014.

    Just for reference, means my post was a giant steaming pile of sarcasm.

  6. #76
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: Would you vote for the compromise?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kali View Post
    Maybe we should just put em in slave labor camps. You would probably support it
    maybe you should actually try to state what I believe rather than making up idiotic straw man arguments to justify emotobabbling views. The worst I believe in is benign neglect--its people like you who believe in governments enslaving others or depriving people of their labor and wealth



  7. #77
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    Re: Would you vote for the compromise?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    you seem to think that existence is contribution. You also seem to think almost everyone is a net contributor

    but why should someone who doesn't contribute have equal say with those who do?
    You are still stuck on contrabution=money. You're right... if you can't see beyond this, we have little to discuss. No frame of reference.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  8. #78
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    Re: Would you vote for the compromise?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    ah the statist argument

    since its the law it has to be right.

    ok I guess that ends the discussion

    Actually, Turtle, its more than just the law, its the Constitution.

    We'd have to amend the Constitution to implement any such thing, and it would be a major departure from current Constitutional law, where all you have to be is 18+ to vote.

    Now I have in the past, suggested that maybe universal franchise wasn't the best idea in the world. I still wonder about that sometimes. Sometimes I indulge in speculation about other methods, where everyone could EARN the right to vote, but it wasn't automatic.

    This method however, is simply no good. There are people who work their butts off, and contribute to society through their hard work, who pay no income tax. This would include a good many of our young soldiers, btw.

    Even if you acknowlege that it isn't just income tax, that we'd have to look at what someone paid in SS/Medicare/FICA, property tax, sales tax, and so on, (and then we'd probably just be looking at the bottom 10% of the economic scale, for net tax nonpayers), I'm still not convinced this is a good idea.

    There are other, better ways to go about doing this. I agree that the majority should not be able to raise taxes on the minority, while keeping their own negligible. There are other venues through which to pursue this aim.

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  9. #79
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: Would you vote for the compromise?

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Because as a citizen, they have to abide by the laws and rules of this society and country. I would be fine with them not voting if they did not have to do this or if there were no consequences for NOT doing it. Are you saying that you believe that if someone lives somewhere, it is reasonable for the government to take away their ability to have a say in how they are governed? You are sounding like a fascist.


    fascism is hardly the correct term

    is it fascist for a private club to prevent non members who pay no dues from having a say in how the club is run

    how about corporations preventing non stock holders from voting on executive compensation or dividend rates

    if you don't pay taxes and have no risk in paying higher taxes why should you have equal say in tax rates with those who do pay taxes.

    lets leave it at that level in terms of contributions since you seem loathe to want to engage in the intellectual exercise of dealing with "contributions"



  10. #80
    Educator hallam's Avatar
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    Re: Would you vote for the compromise?

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Nope. There are many other ways people contribute. If you are going to keep the scope limited, like this, your argument holds no water.
    I don't have to compromise on this. Taxation is a reasonable interpretation here. You may believe there are other ways for people to contribute and those can and should be for the society to decide. However, taxation is a reasonable interpretation and I don't have to clarify each and every fucntion support of the government. The argument holds water until you come up with a reasonable counter argument againsts. Just saying I don't have enough ways to contribute is not a counter agrument. Address taxation as a support and why that isn't a reasonable qualification for voting. We can take these one supports one at a time.

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