View Poll Results: How would you vote on the compromise as described in the OP?

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Thread: Would you vote for the compromise?

  1. #61
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    Re: Would you vote for the compromise?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    define it as you see fit and imagine someone who makes no positive contributions and compare them to those who (in your mind) do

    why should the former have the same say as the latter
    These are actually two questions. I would define someone as making no positive contributions to society as VERY limited.Maybe the homeless drug addict who has refused any and all assistance that has been offered from friends, family, charities, and the government. But I still wouldn't disenfranchise him, because he is still bound by the laws in this country and bound by societal standards. If you are a citizen of a country and have to abide by the rules of that country, to me, it is your right to have a say in those rules. Regardless of what you earn, own, or taxes you pay.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  2. #62
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    Re: Would you vote for the compromise?

    Quote Originally Posted by hallam View Post
    Taxation is a reasonable interpretation of functional support of government
    Nope. There are many other ways people contribute. If you are going to keep the scope limited, like this, your argument holds no water.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  3. #63
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    Re: Would you vote for the compromise?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    however i would note that a disabled combat veteran or fire fighter who may no longer be able to work has paid in full
    There are caveats to everything. And although I agree that veterans should get specialized status, that would be for the overall society to decide.

  4. #64
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    Re: Would you vote for the compromise?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    I guess you don't want to engage in a discussion based on the parameters I established
    No, what I'm saying is that I don't trust the government to accurately measure the worth of a person's contribution even based on a theoretically objective, fair standard.

    If you want me to assume that it could for the sake of argument, you're essentially asking me to assume a spherical cow of uniform density.

    Are you asking me to make that assumption? If you are, I will, but only on the premise that it's impossible in the real world.
    I'm already gearing up for Finger Vote 2014.

    Just for reference, means my post was a giant steaming pile of sarcasm.

  5. #65
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: Would you vote for the compromise?

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    These are actually two questions. I would define someone as making no positive contributions to society as VERY limited.Maybe the homeless drug addict who has refused any and all assistance that has been offered from friends, family, charities, and the government. But I still wouldn't disenfranchise him, because he is still bound by the laws in this country and bound by societal standards. If you are a citizen of a country and have to abide by the rules of that country, to me, it is your right to have a say in those rules. Regardless of what you earn, own, or taxes you pay.
    ah the statist argument

    since its the law it has to be right.

    ok I guess that ends the discussion



  6. #66
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    Re: Would you vote for the compromise?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    do you think everyone who currently exists in America actually supports the goverment or society in a net positive fashion?
    I would say that very few people do not. I also qualified my position in my previous post. This is more like the "stop beating your wife" argument. My position is that you do not have to contribute at all in order to vote, for the reasons I outlined.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  7. #67
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: Would you vote for the compromise?

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Nope. There are many other ways people contribute. If you are going to keep the scope limited, like this, your argument holds no water.
    if so many people contribute I wonder why we have such a large deficit

    I guess we should have made it net contributions. iF someone steals 100K from a bank and then buys something and pays 10 dollars in sales tax I guess you would claim that is a positive contribution



  8. #68
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    Re: Would you vote for the compromise?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    ah the statist argument

    since its the law it has to be right.

    ok I guess that ends the discussion
    That's a complete distortion of what I said. Try reading it again. And... just because you don't like my position, doesn't make it any less accurate. I am coming from a "rights" position. I thought you folks felt that people had inalienable rights. Guess not.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  9. #69
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: Would you vote for the compromise?

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    I would say that very few people do not. I also qualified my position in my previous post. This is more like the "stop beating your wife" argument. My position is that you do not have to contribute at all in order to vote, for the reasons I outlined.
    and why should they vote?



  10. #70
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    Re: Would you vote for the compromise?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    if so many people contribute I wonder why we have such a large deficit

    I guess we should have made it net contributions. iF someone steals 100K from a bank and then buys something and pays 10 dollars in sales tax I guess you would claim that is a positive contribution
    You seem to believe that the only way one contributes is through their wallet. A VERY narrow view, indeed.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

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