View Poll Results: What should you be subjected to in order to fly on airplane?

Voters
113. You may not vote on this poll
  • invasive pat downs

    12 10.62%
  • Non invasive pat downs.

    31 27.43%
  • Subjected to radiation so you and or your children can be virtually stripped searched.

    17 15.04%
  • Real strip searches

    11 9.73%
  • Cavity search.

    53 46.90%
  • walking through a metal detector.

    52 46.02%
  • other

    29 25.66%
Multiple Choice Poll.
Page 25 of 50 FirstFirst ... 15232425262735 ... LastLast
Results 241 to 250 of 497

Thread: What should you be subjected to in order to fly on airplane?

  1. #241
    Global Moderator
    The Truth is out there.
    Kal'Stang's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Bonners Ferry ID USA
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    32,888
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: What should you be subjected to in order to fly on airplane?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Yeah, see, here's the thing. It's not the airlines that are doing this...it's the GOVERNMENT. A better analogy would be if the government mandated that McDonald's had to install metal detectors at all of their restaurants nationwide, and then you had the audacity to tell me that no one forces me to eat there, and made the dishonest claim that it was THEIR decision to require metal detectors rather than the government's.
    One of the governments responsibilites is to secure our borders. Those borders also include state borders. So any airport that has planes that fly outside of it's home states borders is subject to federal mandates. You can go to a small private airport that doesn't deal with mass transportation and doesn't fly outside the states borders and you will not be subjected to the same securities that the TSA requires at bigger airports that do go outside of its home states borders. That is why the government is allowed to, and is involved in airport security.

    So between the governments responsibilites to secure our borders and you giving your consent by trying to get past their security checkpoints, and flying not being a right you have no legal ground to stand on. Sorry.
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

    My mind and my heart are saying I'm in my twenties. My body is pointing at my mind and heart and laughing its ass off. ~ Kal'Stang

  2. #242
    Sage
    Guy Incognito's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Last Seen
    12-02-17 @ 07:43 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    11,216

    Re: What should you be subjected to in order to fly on airplane?

    Quote Originally Posted by topshelf View Post
    There are business travelers that travel every day that have no choice but to submit to this gross invasion of their privacy - simply because they can't afford to stop traveling. We don't have high speed rail so airtravel is really the only option.
    What's your point? They are still consenting.

  3. #243
    Sage
    Guy Incognito's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Last Seen
    12-02-17 @ 07:43 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    11,216

    Re: What should you be subjected to in order to fly on airplane?

    Look, apart from the abstract philosophical argument that we are all just playthings of fate and hence "consent" cannot be given because there is no free will (and I think that's giving a little too much credit to the other side's argument), there is really no reasonable way to say that passengers getting on an airplane aren't consenting to being searched for security purposes, if they know about that security in advance.

    You can't confuse necessity with coercion. Just because somebody's job depends on a flight doesn't mean they are being forced into flying. The government isn't making them fly, their circumstances based on their past and present choices are.
    Last edited by Guy Incognito; 11-20-10 at 09:22 PM.

  4. #244
    Enemy Combatant
    Kandahar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Washington, DC
    Last Seen
    10-15-13 @ 08:47 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    20,688

    Re: What should you be subjected to in order to fly on airplane?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catz Part Deux View Post
    Please feel free to prove that automobile accidents cause as much disruption to the U.S. economy as 9.11 did. Otherwise, your claim here is completely empty.
    In 2000, automobile accidents cost about $230 billion in the US, a year that was fairly normal.
    CDC - Motor Vehicle Safety

    The costs of 9/11 are a bit harder to calculate since it depends on what you include. A narrow reading of the costs (e.g. physical assets, people killed/injured, cleanup costs) would be about $40 billion. A more inclusive interpretation of economic costs (including lost business and reduced travel) would be about $234 billion.
    http://www.policyarchive.org/handle/...reams/3981.pdf

    In other words, even under the most favorable set of assumptions, the economic cost of 9/11 was about the same as the economic cost of A SINGLE YEAR of traffic accidents. And 9/11 was a rare event, whereas we have those traffic accidents every year.

    If we're also going to look at the body count: about 3,000 people died on 9/11. About 40,000 people die in traffic accidents in the United States EVERY YEAR.

    Quote Originally Posted by Catz Part Deux
    And, let me spell it out for you...if the U.S. government installed metal detectors in McDonald's nationwide, and you didn't want to go through those metal detectors, you could--just as I've suggested--make an alternate dining selection. YOu don't have a constitutionally guaranteed right to eat at McDonald's. Nor do you have a constitutionally guaranteed right to fly on airplanes. Thus, participating in either of those activities is 100% voluntary, which equals zero rights being violated.
    Virtually everything people do is 100% voluntary. Fail.
    Last edited by Kandahar; 11-20-10 at 09:25 PM.
    Are you coming to bed?
    I can't. This is important.
    What?
    Someone is WRONG on the internet! -XKCD

  5. #245
    Enemy Combatant
    Kandahar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Washington, DC
    Last Seen
    10-15-13 @ 08:47 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    20,688

    Re: What should you be subjected to in order to fly on airplane?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    One of the governments responsibilites is to secure our borders. Those borders also include state borders. So any airport that has planes that fly outside of it's home states borders is subject to federal mandates. You can go to a small private airport that doesn't deal with mass transportation and doesn't fly outside the states borders and you will not be subjected to the same securities that the TSA requires at bigger airports that do go outside of its home states borders. That is why the government is allowed to, and is involved in airport security.
    The government does not have the right to perform unreasonable searches and seizures just because something crosses state lines. Just like they have no right to ban certain churches that happened to be engaged in interstate commerce. The interstate commerce clause does not invalidate the Bill of Rights.
    Are you coming to bed?
    I can't. This is important.
    What?
    Someone is WRONG on the internet! -XKCD

  6. #246
    Enemy Combatant
    Kandahar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Washington, DC
    Last Seen
    10-15-13 @ 08:47 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    20,688

    Re: What should you be subjected to in order to fly on airplane?

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Incognito View Post
    You can't confuse necessity with coercion. Just because somebody's job depends on a flight doesn't mean they are being forced into flying. The government isn't making them fly, their circumstances based on their past and present choices are.
    Does the government have the right to read your email, if they're providing the power that keeps the lights on at your internet service provider? No one is forcing you to use the internet or to have electricity, therefore your consent to this invasion of privacy is presumed. Right?
    Are you coming to bed?
    I can't. This is important.
    What?
    Someone is WRONG on the internet! -XKCD

  7. #247
    White trash on dope.
    d0gbreath's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Denton, TX
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    8,878

    Re: What should you be subjected to in order to fly on airplane?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catz Part Deux View Post
    I flew 61 segments this year, and I'm content with our current level of security. I tend to believe that the biggest whiners are the people who don't fly that often and have difficulties mastering the rituals of passing through security (shoe removal, bottling liquids and gels, etc.).
    I haven't been flying at all lately (which I consider to be a blessing), yet I believe my boss has plans to send me to Spain pretty soon. A Spanish Army contract has come our way for night vision mods on a fleet of Bell AB-212 aircraft.

    I'll take your word for it about the security not being too invasive. I'll just roll with the flow. No radiation for me though. I'd prefer to be felt up.

  8. #248
    Banned
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Redneck Riviera
    Last Seen
    07-09-11 @ 06:11 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    28,728

    Re: What should you be subjected to in order to fly on airplane?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    In 2000, automobile accidents cost about $230 billion in the US, a year that was fairly normal.
    CDC - Motor Vehicle Safety

    The costs of 9/11 are a bit harder to calculate since it depends on what you include. A narrow reading of the costs (e.g. physical assets, people killed/injured, cleanup costs) would be about $40 billion. A more inclusive interpretation of economic costs (including lost business and reduced travel) would be about $234 billion.
    http://www.policyarchive.org/handle/...reams/3981.pdf

    In other words, even under the most favorable set of assumptions, the economic cost of 9/11 was about the same as the economic cost of A SINGLE YEAR of traffic accidents. And 9/11 was a rare event, whereas we have those traffic accidents every year.

    If we're also going to look at the body count: about 3,000 people died on 9/11. About 40,000 people die in traffic accidents in the United States EVERY YEAR.
    Good points. I guess this is why there are federal and state requirements that regulate who can drive, how they can drive, and whether they are required to use safety measures like seat belts. Do you consider those requirements to be an infringement on your constitutional rights?

    Virtually everything people do is 100% voluntary. Fail.
    It's not a fail. This is only a violation of your rights if the government is forcing you to submit to these searches. You aren't being forced, because taking an air flight is a purely voluntary act. /thread.

  9. #249
    Banned
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Redneck Riviera
    Last Seen
    07-09-11 @ 06:11 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    28,728

    Re: What should you be subjected to in order to fly on airplane?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mickey Shane View Post
    I haven't been flying at all lately (which I consider to be a blessing), yet I believe my boss has plans to send me to Spain pretty soon. A Spanish Army contract has come our way for night vision mods on a fleet of Bell AB-212 aircraft.

    I'll take your word for it about the security not being too invasive. I'll just roll with the flow. No radiation for me though. I'd prefer to be felt up.
    I've been patted down several times (I tend to wear underwire bras, and that seems to trigger some metal detectors). Both the screening machine and the pat downs are so non-eventful. But, you let me know your experiences.

  10. #250
    Global Moderator
    The Truth is out there.
    Kal'Stang's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Bonners Ferry ID USA
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    32,888
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: What should you be subjected to in order to fly on airplane?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    The government does not have the right to perform unreasonable searches and seizures just because something crosses state lines. Just like they have no right to ban certain churches that happened to be engaged in interstate commerce. The interstate commerce clause does not invalidate the Bill of Rights.
    It does have the right if you give your consent. Just like a private buisness has a right to do the same if you give your consent. You can be subjected to pretty much anything under the sun if you give your consent.

    And while they certainly cannot ban churches they CAN ban certain commerce from crossing state lines, weather a church does the selling or not. For example: It is illegal to sell tobacco across state lines unless you have a license to do so. It is also illegal to sell liquor across state lines unless you have a license to do so. The list could go on and on.
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

    My mind and my heart are saying I'm in my twenties. My body is pointing at my mind and heart and laughing its ass off. ~ Kal'Stang

Page 25 of 50 FirstFirst ... 15232425262735 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •