View Poll Results: Your Identity and For/Against this SS Reform model

Voters
91. You may not vote on this poll
  • Socialist and Against

    10 10.99%
  • Socialist and For

    1 1.10%
  • Democrat and Against

    21 23.08%
  • Democrat and For

    6 6.59%
  • Republican and Against

    2 2.20%
  • Republican and For

    22 24.18%
  • Libertarian and Against

    9 9.89%
  • Liberarian and For

    9 9.89%
  • I am for it, but with a particular modification (explain)

    11 12.09%
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Thread: Social Security Fix

  1. #21
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    Re: Social Security Fix

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    too late; SS is already running in the red. you should have sold this decades ago.
    The problem is that actions are always supported to be take *after things fall apart* - never pre-emptive in a *before* mode.

    Tragically - *before* mode is the only way in which to actually avoid problems.
    A screaming comes across the sky.
    It has happened before, but there is nothing to compare it to now.
    Pynchon - Gravity's Rainbow

  2. #22
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    Re: Social Security Fix

    I'm essentially for the reform described in the OP (my caveat being that small technical functional adjustments or disagreements should be possible without hashing them out, for the purpose of this poll).

    My modification is just that I don't fit any of the political labels.

    My thinking is that just about anything is better than the legalized theft that SS currently is.
    I'm already gearing up for Finger Vote 2014.

    Just for reference, means my post was a giant steaming pile of sarcasm.

  3. #23
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    Re: Social Security Fix

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    1. it's 7.65% and
    2. it's a marginal decision. so no, everyone making (say) $110,000 won't get fired. their employers will just see the costs of creating such positions go up, and will thus make fewer of them.

    what is it about the supply/demand curve that liberals Just Don't Get?
    In asking your question you make a gross error. I get your point. I simply and utterly reject it as not being valid.

    6%...7% ...whatever it may be ... the employer will just figure that in as a cost of employee compensation and adjust accordingly. What do you think that they already do and have been doing for seventy years with everyone else?
    __________________________________________________ _
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  4. #24
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    Re: Social Security Fix

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    too late; SS is already running in the red. you should have sold this decades ago.

    You did get the Al Gore ref right.

  5. #25
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    Re: Social Security Fix

    I believe this would be more expensive than meets the eye since it would require SS be a fully funded system to begin with.

    edit: Let me expand.

    I believe if you want to encourage personal savings for retirement a better proposal would be to increase tax credits going towards 401k type plans and to make employee participation in 401k type plans more automatic (ie. opt out instead of opt in).

    So instead I would propose a combination of increasing SS payroll tax as it is now the required 1.84% (done gradually overtime), and increasing the retirement age, and increasing tax credits/tax breaks for things like 401k's. This would require more funding for the retirement credits as well, which should come from somewhere in the general fund. I will propose we get this money by eliminating farm subsidies.
    Last edited by drz-400; 11-15-10 at 12:18 AM.

  6. #26
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    Re: Social Security Fix

    Quote Originally Posted by drz-400 View Post
    I believe this would be more expensive than meets the eye since it would require SS be a fully funded system to begin with.

    edit: Let me expand.

    I believe if you want to encourage personal savings for retirement a better proposal would be to increase tax credits going towards 401k type plans and to make employee participation in 401k type plans more automatic (ie. opt out instead of opt in).

    So instead I would propose a combination of increasing SS payroll tax as it is now the required 1.84% (done gradually overtime), and increasing the retirement age, and increasing tax credits/tax breaks for things like 401k's. This would require more funding for the retirement credits as well, which should come from somewhere in the general fund. I will propose we get this money by eliminating farm subsidies.
    Since congress is involved and their will be earmarks I would also include removing ethanol subsidies and ethanol tariffs.

  7. #27
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    Re: Social Security Fix

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    In asking your question you make a gross error. I get your point. I simply and utterly reject it as not being valid.
    you don't believe in the economic impacts of supply and demand?

    6%...7% ...whatever it may be ... the employer will just figure that in as a cost of employee compensation and adjust accordingly
    yes, and part of that adjustment will be hiring fewer workers.

    Quote Originally Posted by ender1 View Post
    You did get the Al Gore ref right.
    i did. but even Gore was 20-ish years too late.

  8. #28
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    Re: Social Security Fix

    from cpwill

    yes, and part of that adjustment will be hiring fewer workers.
    And how do you come to this conclusion? We are only talking about an increase for the employer for employees who make over $106K per year. That is only six to seven percent of people in America. It is just as reasonable to assume that if an employer has $250K to spend on a valuable employee, that the employer will budget the 7% of that for FICA and the other 93% for salary. That is exactly what employers do for workers under $106K.

    I am sorry but I do not know what your point is about supply and demand.
    __________________________________________________ _
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  9. #29
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    Re: Social Security Fix

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    And how do you come to this conclusion?
    when you increase the cost of something, you reduce the demand for it. including workers.

  10. #30
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    Re: Social Security Fix

    anyway, so so far 100% of democrats who have voted are against allowing the poor financial independence from the government.

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