View Poll Results: Your Identity and For/Against this SS Reform model

Voters
91. You may not vote on this poll
  • Socialist and Against

    10 10.99%
  • Socialist and For

    1 1.10%
  • Democrat and Against

    21 23.08%
  • Democrat and For

    6 6.59%
  • Republican and Against

    2 2.20%
  • Republican and For

    22 24.18%
  • Libertarian and Against

    9 9.89%
  • Liberarian and For

    9 9.89%
  • I am for it, but with a particular modification (explain)

    11 12.09%
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Thread: Social Security Fix

  1. #151
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    Re: Social Security Fix

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    Take away their benefits and they'll have much more of an incentive to do just that. Of course, with inflation being the devil that it is, savings is penalized, and I see that as being the main obstacle to saving for a retirement.
    What you donít understand is that the activating motivation you are hoping will appear will not. For most people a future threat of not having any money is not nearly as motivating as the pleasure of spending now for most people. Since SS is not enough to retire on with any comfort everyone is still Ďmotivatedí to save for retirement.
    I see this all the time when we shop for homes to buy. I saw it in my coworkers. How do you save when you have $40k in credit card debt and you are older than 40, drive a car you canít afford and wear clothes that you canít afford? I greeted her today. I want her forced to Ďsaveí, otherwise Iíll be taking care of her ilk one way or another.

  2. #152
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    Re: Social Security Fix

    I like certain parts of it, but on the whole I'd say no.

  3. #153
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    Re: Social Security Fix

    Quote Originally Posted by SirPwn4lot View Post
    I like certain parts of it, but on the whole I'd say no.
    you'll notice that option has a "(explain)" requeset. what parts good what parts bad?

  4. #154
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    Re: Social Security Fix

    Quote Originally Posted by OhIsee.Then View Post
    What you don’t understand is that the activating motivation you are hoping will appear will not. For most people a future threat of not having any money is not nearly as motivating as the pleasure of spending now for most people. Since SS is not enough to retire on with any comfort everyone is still ‘motivated’ to save for retirement.
    I see this all the time when we shop for homes to buy. I saw it in my coworkers. How do you save when you have $40k in credit card debt and you are older than 40, drive a car you can’t afford and wear clothes that you can’t afford? I greeted her today. I want her forced to ‘save’, otherwise I’ll be taking care of her ilk one way or another.
    Nearly half of those nearing retirement lack adequate savings

    About 47 percent of early baby boomers are not expected to have enough money to cover basic living expenses

    ... a sobering study released Tuesday shows the fantasy isn't far off the mark. About 47 percent of early baby boomers, now 56 to 62 years old, are not expected to have enough money to cover basic living expenses like food, utilities and health care through retirement...

    Members of Generation X, ranging from 36 to 45 years old, should be in better shape because they have more time to prepare. Nevertheless, 44.5 percent of them also are expected to run out of money, the study said.

    Inadequate savings will be disastrous for individuals who want to live as comfortably in retirement as they lived their working years. Even those who have saved adequately could be affected: New taxes or limits on Social Security may be required to help an overburdened system cope with so many needy people.

    Although middle- and lower-income people are most at risk of running out of money in retirement, even the highest-income people, baby boomers now making over $72,500, could be at risk if they have a disease or accident that requires them to enter a nursing home early in their retirement years, said VanDerhei, who led the study. Nursing home costs average $200 a day. VanDerhei estimates about 13 percent of the high-income group would exhaust their savings prematurely.

    When Social Security was established in the 1930s, people lived on average to 61.7. Now, the U.S. Census estimates that a 65-year-old can expect to live to 78.3. About 40 percent of women live to 90.

    Because people are living longer and fewer will have the guaranteed pensions that the previous generation enjoyed, personal savings — either through 401(k) plans, IRAs or other accounts — are crucial...
    and see, that's the beauty of this fix. it basically turns Social Security into a ramped up IRA (because money going in and profit made are both untaxed) for anyone who wants it to.

  5. #155
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    Re: Social Security Fix

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    Take away their benefits and they'll have much more of an incentive to do just that. Of course, with inflation being the devil that it is, savings is penalized, and I see that as being the main obstacle to saving for a retirement.
    i sincerely doubt that if we took away social security and medicare (both of which are politically impossible; whereas this modification is a potential reality), that we would see a 10% savings rate.

  6. #156
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    Re: Social Security Fix

    Quote Originally Posted by OhIsee.Then View Post
    What you don’t understand is that the activating motivation you are hoping will appear will not. For most people a future threat of not having any money is not nearly as motivating as the pleasure of spending now for most people. Since SS is not enough to retire on with any comfort everyone is still ‘motivated’ to save for retirement.
    I see this all the time when we shop for homes to buy. I saw it in my coworkers. How do you save when you have $40k in credit card debt and you are older than 40, drive a car you can’t afford and wear clothes that you can’t afford? I greeted her today. I want her forced to ‘save’, otherwise I’ll be taking care of her ilk one way or another.
    And I should be forced to provide for them when they make these stupid decisions in life? Talk about a moral hazard.

    Who shall ascend the hill of the Lord? And who shall stand in his holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart, who does not lift up his soul to what is false, and does not swear deceitfully. Psalm 24
    "True law is right reason in agreement with nature . . . Whoever is disobedient is fleeing from himself and denying his human nature [and] will suffer the worst penalties . . ." - Cicero

  7. #157
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    Re: Social Security Fix

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    i sincerely doubt that if we took away social security and medicare (both of which are politically impossible; whereas this modification is a potential reality), that we would see a 10% savings rate.
    You think people don't care about their futures and that people don't act the way they do because of the moral hazard of social safety net programs?

    Who shall ascend the hill of the Lord? And who shall stand in his holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart, who does not lift up his soul to what is false, and does not swear deceitfully. Psalm 24
    "True law is right reason in agreement with nature . . . Whoever is disobedient is fleeing from himself and denying his human nature [and] will suffer the worst penalties . . ." - Cicero

  8. #158
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    Re: Social Security Fix

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Nearly half of those nearing retirement lack adequate savings



    and see, that's the beauty of this fix. it basically turns Social Security into a ramped up IRA (because money going in and profit made are both untaxed) for anyone who wants it to.
    People thought that they had their wealth in their homes. That's why we saw an up-tick in savings when home values came crashing down. Of course, that increase was nipped in the bud by QE1.

    Who shall ascend the hill of the Lord? And who shall stand in his holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart, who does not lift up his soul to what is false, and does not swear deceitfully. Psalm 24
    "True law is right reason in agreement with nature . . . Whoever is disobedient is fleeing from himself and denying his human nature [and] will suffer the worst penalties . . ." - Cicero

  9. #159
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    Re: Social Security Fix

    How many times do I have to post this link?

    http://www.debatepolitics.com/econom...-problems.html

    Who shall ascend the hill of the Lord? And who shall stand in his holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart, who does not lift up his soul to what is false, and does not swear deceitfully. Psalm 24
    "True law is right reason in agreement with nature . . . Whoever is disobedient is fleeing from himself and denying his human nature [and] will suffer the worst penalties . . ." - Cicero

  10. #160
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    Re: Social Security Fix

    How many times do I have to post this link?

    http://www.debatepolitics.com/econom...llowing+income

    Furthermore, a study with good methodology:

    America's No. 1 Endangered Species - Reason Magazine

    But everyone is getting richer. In real dollars, every quintile has posted significant annual increases over the past 35 years, ranging from $3,000 for the lowest quintile to $13,000 for the middle quintile to over $25,000 for next-to-highest one. And the individuals in those quintiles change all the time, something even The New York Times, which wrings its hands on class matters like an obsessive-compulsive, admits. Urban Institute economists Daniel P. McMurrer and Isabel V. Sawhill estimate that between 25 percent to 40 percent of individuals switch quintiles in a given year and that "rates of mobility have not changed over time." Research tracking individuals in the lowest income quintile in 1968 found that 23 years later, 53 percent were in a higher quintile and that half had spent at least a year in the top income quintile.

    Who shall ascend the hill of the Lord? And who shall stand in his holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart, who does not lift up his soul to what is false, and does not swear deceitfully. Psalm 24
    "True law is right reason in agreement with nature . . . Whoever is disobedient is fleeing from himself and denying his human nature [and] will suffer the worst penalties . . ." - Cicero

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