View Poll Results: Does defense justify torture?

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  • Yes

    37 48.68%
  • No

    25 32.89%
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    6 7.89%
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Thread: Does defense justify torture?

  1. #221
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    Re: Does defense justify torture?

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    When you adopt the tactics of your enemies to beat your enemies....yes, you might win the battle, but at what cost? I, for one, am not willing to sacrifice our values and integrity to win a war.
    Well, since I'm going to loose my values and integrity when I loose my life, at least I'll have my life if I choose to adopt my enemey's tactics, and so that's the way I'll go.

  2. #222
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    Re: Does defense justify torture?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Nor should we. If we abandon our principles to uphold the rights and liberties of the individual, we become no better than any other despot in history.
    I'm willing to become that despot if it means protecting my children. I'll make that sacrifice, no problem.

  3. #223
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    Re: Does defense justify torture?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    Absolutely.
    While torture may be wrong, so is not doing everything you can do to, say, stop a nuke from going of in NYC. Tortuing one or two or twenty to save millions is a trade every Presdient better be willing to make - else he isn't fit for office.
    I can't see myself looking on a nuk'd city thinking "well at least I still have my integrity".

    I'd rather have the city.

  4. #224
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    Re: Does defense justify torture?

    The Jack Bauer interrogation scenario makes for good fiction, but it never occurs in real life. If terrorists had a nuclear weapon in New York City, we wouldn't find out about it or capture the conspirators until after it had been detonated.

  5. #225
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    Re: Does defense justify torture?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    I can't see myself looking on a nuk'd city thinking "well at least I still have my integrity".
    Safe to say that if, as President, you came on TV and said "I could have saved NY, but decided letting the city go was better than torturing someone to save it", those here supporting a plenary against torture would be the first to scream for your head.
    Unless you were a Democrat, of course.

    I'd rather have the city.
    Its the only rational choice.

  6. #226
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    Re: Does defense justify torture?

    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Korimir View Post
    The Jack Bauer interrogation scenario makes for good fiction, but it never occurs in real life. If terrorists had a nuclear weapon in New York City, we wouldn't find out about it or capture the conspirators until after it had been detonated.
    it doesn't need to be a nuke. just planes about to fly into Heathrow.

  7. #227
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    Re: Does defense justify torture?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    I'm willing to become that despot if it means protecting my children. I'll make that sacrifice, no problem.
    exactly. if you are a threat to my kids... stand by. I have a very good imagination.

  8. #228
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    Re: Does defense justify torture?

    Quote Originally Posted by Orion View Post
    This basically sums up my belief.

    The ends justifies the means if you're a country like China, or the former USSR, but the U.S. is supposed to stand for more. The issue of whether or not something like waterboarding is "torture" is not as important as the U.S. betraying its own supposed values.
    In WWII, US soldiers generally didn't take Japanese prisoners because they learned that many time the Japanese soldier would blow himself up along with the Marine taking him prisoner. Eventually, the Marines would just shoot prisoners, and they certainly shot any Japanese soldier that looked dead in the head just to make sure. That is reality. Those were US soldiers doing that because they had to. They did not fall victim to some idea that we are Americans and that stands for something. Nope, they just shot the enemy dead. I am glad they did that took, probably saved my grandfathers life a time and time again.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    I have pooped in public, even in public neighborhoods.
    Quote Originally Posted by OldFatGuy View Post
    Usually a gag for wise mouthed insulting little girls. Then some good nylon rope so I can tie them up, toss them in the trunk of my car and forget about them.

  9. #229
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    Re: Does defense justify torture?

    Quote Originally Posted by SE102 View Post
    Why do you engage in wordly allegiances?
    You called me a Kiwi... just clarifying.

    States do it as well.
    Yep...

    I don't mean to insult you, I was being condescending. :wave:
    Being condescending is being insultive...

    People have been pardoned from murder in courts over cultural considerations. Does it justify it? No. To a Muslim who believes and has for thousands of years that the book emits the spirit of god and is an extension and manifestation of him in the physical universe. Well. Id expect you to get killed and sort-of stand by and say "Wasn't me dood"
    Burning a book, any book, does not justify murder or killing to sane people. I assert that terrorists and such are not sane though...

    Never said terrorists were particularly reasonable.
    Or sane...

    You don't
    Whew!

    Hmm... so what are we doing with that big ol military?
    Using it where we think that it is needed...

    Me too -_- how to escape this...
    It seems as if you faded from your original assertions...
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    I have pooped in public, even in public neighborhoods.
    Quote Originally Posted by OldFatGuy View Post
    Usually a gag for wise mouthed insulting little girls. Then some good nylon rope so I can tie them up, toss them in the trunk of my car and forget about them.

  10. #230
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    Re: Does defense justify torture?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    maggie is right; that you would say that indcates you have precisely zero idea what you are talking about.
    Not at all. Some of us have values that remain steadfast. When your values and ethics fluctuate with the wind, then your values, ethics and integrity are not very strong.
    We are either a country that has values or we aren't.
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

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