View Poll Results: Do libertarians inadvertently enable fascism?

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Thread: Do libertarians inadvertently enable fascism?

  1. #31
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    Re: Do libertarians inadvertently enable fascism?

    Quote Originally Posted by Troubadour View Post
    I have to strongly disagree on that, given the levels at which they've supported Republican politics. While there was some principled (and largely perfunctory) opposition to George W. Bush's policies among libertarians, it seemed they considered low taxation a higher priority than protecting basic constitutional liberties. A man who literally defended his policies by citing the medieval Divine Right of Kings doctrine had very strong support among Small Government advocates.
    You can strongly disagree all you want. Doesn't mean **** less you can back it up with something other than supposition and conjecture. Fact of the matter is that very few (if any, certainly none I've met) libertarians supported Bush. But don't let that stop you from making absurd claims and asinine statements.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  2. #32
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    Re: Do libertarians inadvertently enable fascism?

    Libertarians favor a small, contained state, not a weak one. I don't see how things like owning vast swaths of the economy, providing a huge dole, or giving out social freedom helps censorship makes a stable state
    "Doubleplusungood"

    George Orwell

  3. #33
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    Re: Do libertarians inadvertently enable fascism?

    the power needed to implement socialism is the power needed to establish a fascist state. Both are pernicious forms of collectivism fueled by the same diseased mindset

    so the real answer is that socialist dreams created fascist depradations



  4. #34
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    Re: Do libertarians inadvertently enable fascism?

    Quote Originally Posted by DrunkenAsparagus View Post
    When were Mexico and Italy libertarian?
    They have decentralized governments. When the government isn't casting a shadow over everything, other forces will impose ordering principles.

    Libertarians favor a small, contained state, not a weak one. I don't see how things like owning vast swaths of the economy, providing a huge dole, or giving out social freedom helps censorship makes a stable state
    Small and contained states are weak.
    Last edited by Morality Games; 11-04-10 at 12:23 AM.
    If you notice something good in yourself, give credit to God, not to yourself, but be certain the evil you commit is always your own and yours to acknowledge.

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  5. #35
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    Re: Do libertarians inadvertently enable fascism?

    A government being "decentralized" doesn't necessarily make it libertarian.
    “Offing those rich pigs with their own forks and knives, and then eating a meal in the same room, far out! The Weathermen dig Charles Manson.”-- Bernadine Dohrn

  6. #36
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    Re: Do libertarians inadvertently enable fascism?

    I figured this was werethe op was going.


    The answet is "no" libertarians have big guns To prevent tyranny.
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

  7. #37
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    Re: Do libertarians inadvertently enable fascism?

    Quote Originally Posted by Morality Games View Post
    They have decentralized governments. When the government isn't casting a shadow over everything, other forces will impose ordering principles.
    Decentralized doesn't mean libertarian. The states were the epitome of state corporatism, giving special favors to a few small groups.

    Quote Originally Posted by Morality Games View Post
    Small and contained states are weak.
    No, in Libertarianism, the line is much farther away from where it is now, but it is just as, if not more distinct than now. The state would still have all of the necessary parts to function.
    "Doubleplusungood"

    George Orwell

  8. #38
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    Re: Do libertarians inadvertently enable fascism?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    A government being "decentralized" doesn't necessarily make it libertarian.
    It does when you're trying to make absurd claims and blame things on libertarian philosophy which aren't actually caused by applied libertarian policy.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  9. #39
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    Re: Do libertarians inadvertently enable fascism?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    the power needed to implement socialism is the power needed to establish a fascist state. Both are pernicious forms of collectivism fueled by the same diseased mindset
    Democracy?

    so the real answer is that socialist dreams created fascist depradations
    I know your busy barking and frothing at the mouth, but were actually talking about libertarianism atm. Kthx.

  10. #40
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    Re: Do libertarians inadvertently enable fascism?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Fact of the matter is that very few (if any, certainly none I've met) libertarians supported Bush. But don't let that stop you from making absurd claims and asinine statements.
    Then allow me to rephrase: People who claim to support "small government," advocate lower taxes, and oppose public spending on infrastructure and social programs overwhelmingly supported George W. Bush.

    Quote Originally Posted by DrunkenAsparagus View Post
    Libertarians favor a small, contained state, not a weak one.
    Can you explain the distinction?

    Quote Originally Posted by DrunkenAsparagus View Post
    I don't see how things like owning vast swaths of the economy, providing a huge dole, or giving out social freedom helps censorship makes a stable state
    This is written unclearly, so I'm not sure what you're saying.

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    the power needed to implement socialism is the power needed to establish a fascist state.
    Not so. "Socialism," insofar as it exists, is an economic policy involving state ownership of part or all of the factors of production. It is politically neutral insofar as the distinction between democracy, fascism, and other forms of government (e.g., China is an oligarchy).

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    Both are pernicious forms of collectivism fueled by the same diseased mindset
    "Collectivism" is a null-word devoid of meaning. To be human is to be both individual and part of larger things. Denying one or the other in one's self is "diseased," and denying one or the other in politics yields crippled, dysfunctional societies. Fascism is bad because it distracts society from its problems by blaming scapegoats, removes the error-correction feedbacks of free expression and democracy, and its intolerance of weakness destroys much of the real strength in its society.

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    so the real answer is that socialist dreams created fascist depradations
    Actually, fascism is often an elite reaction against left-wing socialism, which is itself a reaction against growing wealth inequality. Not only in Europe in the early 20th century, but also in Latin America in the 1970s and 1980s, the growing popularity of socialist political parties led threatened elites to support fascist coups. It was mainly the threat of Soviet Communism that convinced many otherwise moderate Germans to go along with the Nazi Party, because it wrapped itself in German traditions and had the support of wealthy businessmen - the "socialism" in National Socialism was just a ruse to win working-class support in Weimar Republic elections.

    Quote Originally Posted by ReverendHellh0und View Post
    I figured this was werethe op was going. The answer is "no" libertarians have big guns To prevent tyranny.
    And how many of those guns would side with tyranny if it promised them tax cuts and the eradication of social programs? If it called itself a "small government" committed to "free enterprise" and insisted that its atrocities were merely "defending America against Socialists"? Given what I saw during the Bush years, something tells me it's more likely those guns would remain in their cabinets, if not be volunteered in service to "eradicate the plague of Socialism."
    Last edited by Troubadour; 11-04-10 at 11:57 PM.

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