View Poll Results: Do libertarians inadvertently enable fascism?

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    8 15.09%
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Thread: Do libertarians inadvertently enable fascism?

  1. #91
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    Re: Do libertarians inadvertently enable fascism?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    The Keith Olbermann thread offers ample evidence that when libertarians have the choice, they will weaken government even at the expense of strengthening the power of the corporation. Their predisposed mindset to loathe government is strong and nearly instinctual. Its like a knee jerk response with some of them. The greatest threat to our freedom is NOT the US Government. It is international corporations. The fight for our freedoms and way of life between average folks and corporate interests will be the major struggle of the next few decades until it is decided one way or the other.
    Despite being a relatively conservative person who leans a bit Libertarian except on Tuesdays, I agree that large corporations can be a threat to individual liberty in some ways. Anyone who has ever worked for one can testify that they can be incredibly pushy, intrusive, demanding, prying, and have control over your income. Some people say "don't like it? find another employer!" which is easier said than done, when MOST of those 'other employers' are just as bad.

    Where I part company with you, is that I see asking Government to protect us from Big Corp as the same as asking the weasel to guard the henhouse.

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    Re: Do libertarians inadvertently enable fascism?

    To all kneejerk Libertarian bashers:

    Libertarianism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Minarchism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Read the freaking articles. Many of you have been around here or other debate sites for a long time. You should have a grasp on basic political terms. Your kneejerk equating American-style Libertarianism with Anarchism, Corpratism, or other things that don't involve keeping a small, but still functional government shows nothing but ignorance on your part, willful or otherwise. I'm sick of responding to these kinds of things.
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  3. #93
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    Re: Do libertarians inadvertently enable fascism?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    The Keith Olbermann thread offers ample evidence that when libertarians have the choice, they will weaken government even at the expense of strengthening the power of the corporation. Their predisposed mindset to loathe government is strong and nearly instinctual. Its like a knee jerk response with some of them. The greatest threat to our freedom is NOT the US Government. It is international corporations. The fight for our freedoms and way of life between average folks and corporate interests will be the major struggle of the next few decades until it is decided one way or the other.
    The greatest threat to freedom has ALWAYS been the tyranny of government. Corporations do not impose limits to freedom. If they do, they will be punished by even a libertarian government. What you really mean to say is that the freedom of speech should be limited to only certain groups, and the government should impose speech restrictions on other groups. Let's discuss Citizens United, shall we? Even the Deputy Solicitor General, Malcolm Steward, admitted that such restrictions, before the overturn made by the Supreme Court in the above case, included pamphlet and book material. BOOKS! People who opposed the court case decision claim that even books and pamphlets, published by corporations (which most of them are already), that include some "magical" phrases, should be banned during primary and election seasons. And these jokers don't even realize that the vast majority of those who are incorporated are non-profit groups and small businesses!

  4. #94
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    Re: Do libertarians inadvertently enable fascism?

    Quote Originally Posted by ElijahGalt View Post
    The greatest threat to freedom has ALWAYS been the tyranny of government. Corporations do not impose limits to freedom. If they do, they will be punished by even a libertarian government. What you really mean to say is that the freedom of speech should be limited to only certain groups, and the government should impose speech restrictions on other groups. Let's discuss Citizens United, shall we? Even the Deputy Solicitor General, Malcolm Steward, admitted that such restrictions, before the overturn made by the Supreme Court in the above case, included pamphlet and book material. BOOKS! People who opposed the court case decision claim that even books and pamphlets, published by corporations (which most of them are already), that include some "magical" phrases, should be banned during primary and election seasons. And these jokers don't even realize that the vast majority of those who are incorporated are non-profit groups and small businesses!
    In the world of the 21st century, corporations are amassing wealth and the power that it can purchase at an alarming rate. The idea that a corporation can tell an employee that a condition of employment is a surrender of their political rights or they risk termination is a reality. That is the world we live in and the Citizens United decision is not going to help change that. Many progressives like myself have a very strong conviction that it will only be the government representing the will of the majority of the people that can counter balance corporate power. I see no other force with enough resources to do it.

    Asparagus - perhaps the problem is that there are many people calling themselves LIBERTARIANS who also preface it with some modifier that makes them a bit different from others who do the same? They are a difficult breed to classify and pin down. And that is something of an understatement. Put five libertarians in a room and you will get six different opinions on the same subject. At least until the next Lew Rockwell column comes out about the topic.

  5. #95
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    Re: Do libertarians inadvertently enable fascism?

    here is an article that identifies a least ten different types of libertarians

    What Kind of Libertarian Are You? - 10 Different Types of Libertarianism

    maybe people are confused because libertarians themselves can be very confusing.

    and of course the famous cartoon giving us a full two dozen libertarian types -- humorously of course

    http://www.leftycartoons.com/the-24-...f-libertarian/
    Last edited by haymarket; 11-08-10 at 11:23 AM.

  6. #96
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    Re: Do libertarians inadvertently enable fascism?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    here is an article that identifies a least ten different types of libertarians

    What Kind of Libertarian Are You? - 10 Different Types of Libertarianism

    maybe people are confused because libertarians themselves can be very confusing.

    and of course the famous cartoon giving us a full two dozen libertarian types -- humorously of course

    The 24 Types of Libertarian | Progressive Political Cartoon by Barry Deutsch




    This is such an asinine position in barely deserves a response. Are there only one type of republican? Democrat? Are you all the borg for your respective parties?

    Please, this post of yours fails the intellectual moxy test.
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  7. #97
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    Re: Do libertarians inadvertently enable fascism?

    You seem to miss the point ... again ... as nearly always. Some here have complained that non-libertarians do not really know what libertarians stand for, what they believe, what the support or do not support. This seems to be a continual and nearly constant complaint from libertarians going back years.

    So why does this exist? One reason is that there are so many varied types of libertarians that you need a scorecard and guide book to keep them apart. This is not the fault of non-libertarians.

    Does using words like asinine make you feel better about yourself rev? Do you think you raise the intellectual level of the debate by resorting to continually having to judge the worth of those who disagree with your ideology?
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  8. #98
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    Re: Do libertarians inadvertently enable fascism?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    You seem to miss the point ... again ... as nearly always. Some here have complained that non-libertarians do not really know what libertarians stand for, what they believe, what the support or do not support. This seems to be a continual and nearly constant complaint from libertarians going back years.
    Strawman


    So why does this exist? One reason is that there are so many varied types of libertarians that you need a scorecard and guide book to keep them apart. This is not the fault of non-libertarians.
    Strawman


    Does using words like asinine make you feel better about yourself rev? Do you think you raise the intellectual level of the debate by resorting to continually having to judge the worth of those who disagree with your ideology?

    The Good Reverend can not possibly feel any better about himself, his awesomeness is absolute. It is your asinine posting of strawmen, nonsense, and hap hazard theories that need work.
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

  9. #99
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    Re: Do libertarians inadvertently enable fascism?

    Do laissez faire policies translate to political stability?
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

  10. #100
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    Re: Do libertarians inadvertently enable fascism?

    So rev... you know how to type a word. Now back it up with explanation and analysis to show the world why my arguments are just strawmen.

    if you are able that is. But I bet you cannot. (just for you since you seem addicted to these smilie faces)

    Let me assist you:

    The argument put forward by Harmarket regarding ________________________ is actually just use of the strawman because ____________________________ and ______________________________________.

    No thanks are necessary.
    Last edited by haymarket; 11-08-10 at 12:57 PM.
    __________________________________________________ _
    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

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