View Poll Results: Does Society Act?

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  • Yes

    6 37.50%
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    5 31.25%
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Thread: Does Society Act?

  1. #21
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    Re: Does Society Act?

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    When France invades Italy, is it the whole of France, or just the leaders of the country and the soldiers who were part of the invasion?
    Did the soldiers invade as individuals because they felt like it, or because the organization they are part of told them to?

    In general

    A person or group of persons make a decision for an organization. That decision requires individuals to perform actions either as individuals or as part of a group (some thing just cant be done on an individual basis). When you combine all the individual actions and group actions you have an overall organization that has acted.


    Individuals can act without society, society can not act without individuals
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  2. #22
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    Re: Does Society Act?

    Quote Originally Posted by SE102 View Post
    Society acts... popular uprisings and revolutions... voting, etc.
    I understand what you are saying, but it is individuals that act as a group that we call society...
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  3. #23
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    Re: Does Society Act?

    Why don't you just get down to the krux of the issue, phatty, and claim that society doesn't exist, quote Thatcher, and then proclaim victory?
    "I do not claim that every incident in the history of empire can be explained in directly economic terms. Economic interests are filtered through a political process, policies are implemented by a complex state apparatus, and the whole system generates its own momentum."

  4. #24
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    Re: Does Society Act?

    Quote Originally Posted by Khayembii Communique View Post
    Why don't you just get down to the krux of the issue, phatty, and claim that society doesn't exist, quote Thatcher, and then proclaim victory?
    I just want people to realize that society is just an intellectual construct and that it has no bearing in reality.

    Who shall ascend the hill of the Lord? And who shall stand in his holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart, who does not lift up his soul to what is false, and does not swear deceitfully. Psalm 24
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  5. #25
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    Re: Does Society Act?

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    I just want people to realize that society is just an intellectual construct and that it has no bearing in reality.
    All concepts and ideas are constructs. How much bearing they have in reality is determined by how functional they prove in describing an entity.

    There is a practical difference when one individual acts and when many individuals act. We invent the concept of society to describe the information processing and actions which occur when many individuals organize under common rules and procedures, because the process is different from how an individual acts.

    A single individual can't enforce the law, for example, but many individuals can. Even the possibility that a mass of individuals stand aginst wrongdoing discourages crime in a way the threat of single individual does not.

    There are some who would argue 'individual' itslf is an intellectual construct and has no bearing in reality.
    Last edited by Morality Games; 11-01-10 at 12:39 PM.
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  6. #26
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    Re: Does Society Act?

    Quote Originally Posted by Morality Games View Post
    All concepts and ideas are intellectual constructs. How much bearing they have in reality is determined by how functional they prove in describing an entity.
    The individual is not an intellectual construct. It has a basis in reality.

    Who shall ascend the hill of the Lord? And who shall stand in his holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart, who does not lift up his soul to what is false, and does not swear deceitfully. Psalm 24
    "True law is right reason in agreement with nature . . . Whoever is disobedient is fleeing from himself and denying his human nature [and] will suffer the worst penalties . . ." - Cicero

  7. #27
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    Re: Does Society Act?

    society, not being a unitary entity, is incapable of acting. society as we use it (as a reference to a majority of the individuals within it) is capable of acting via the aggregate actions of those individuals.

  8. #28
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    Re: Does Society Act?

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    The individual is not an intellectual construct. It has a basis in reality.
    Does it? There are many concepts of individuality and at least some of them have to be false constructs. More so than 'society' even. Given the psychological factors that motivate human beings, I find it easier to believe people will act in concert to enforce the law than a single person possesses metaphysical autonomy.

    Not that I don't believe metaphysical autonomy exists, but it is much more speculative than a scientific concept like 'society', which describes comparable patterns of behavior among groups.
    Last edited by Morality Games; 11-01-10 at 12:47 PM.
    If you notice something good in yourself, give credit to God, not to yourself, but be certain the evil you commit is always your own and yours to acknowledge.

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  9. #29
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    Re: Does Society Act?

    The idea of society acting is more believable than that of individuals acting?

    Who shall ascend the hill of the Lord? And who shall stand in his holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart, who does not lift up his soul to what is false, and does not swear deceitfully. Psalm 24
    "True law is right reason in agreement with nature . . . Whoever is disobedient is fleeing from himself and denying his human nature [and] will suffer the worst penalties . . ." - Cicero

  10. #30
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    Re: Does Society Act?

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    The idea of society acting is more believable than that of individuals acting?
    Many philosophers have believed that. Partially, because individuals only act with reference to society. "Peer pressure" on a massive scale. Even the criminal disguises his deeds.
    Last edited by Morality Games; 11-01-10 at 01:00 PM.
    If you notice something good in yourself, give credit to God, not to yourself, but be certain the evil you commit is always your own and yours to acknowledge.

    St. Benedict

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