View Poll Results: In a war between the Federation and the Empire, who wins?

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  • Empire

    22 46.81%
  • Federation

    25 53.19%
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Thread: Federation v Empire

  1. #331
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    Re: Federation v Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by theangryamerican View Post
    I understand that they can make "minor variations" but I'm referring to the logistics of coordinating simultaneous warp jumps with hundreds of Federation starships (I assume they have that many at least) moving on multiple attack vectors, executing hard turns through thousands of tightly grouped Imperial battle formations without dropping to sub-light at all and thereby exposing themselves to return fire. Could they do it it? Possibly. My argument was that since they have never demonstrated that tactic on a large scale under those circumstances before, they'd be unlikely to suddenly change their standard tactics of engagement in favor of something so risky without knowing a lot more about their opponents.

    ...and your source is from TNG, which Goobie has rejected as canon.
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  2. #332
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    Re: Federation v Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by OscarB63 View Post
    nothing shown on screen indicates that the deathstar had or would have independent shield capability without the generator on the planet.
    technically incorrect. Remember in ANH, when the fighters first approached the Death Star... all the vibrations and shaking? Remember the line 'A small one-man fighter should be able to penetrate the outer defense.'

  3. #333
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    Re: Federation v Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by theangryamerican View Post
    I understand that they can make "minor variations" but I'm referring to the logistics of coordinating simultaneous warp jumps with hundreds of Federation starships (I assume they have that many at least) moving on multiple attack vectors, executing hard turns through thousands of tightly grouped Imperial battle formations without dropping to sub-light at all and thereby exposing themselves to return fire. Could they do it it? Possibly. My argument was that since they have never demonstrated that tactic on a large scale under those circumstances before, they'd be unlikely to suddenly change their standard tactics of engagement in favor of something so risky without knowing a lot more about their opponents.

    ...and your source is from TNG, which Goobie has rejected as canon.
    I do not disagree with anything you just said... and canon shmanon.

  4. #334
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    Re: Federation v Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by OscarB63 View Post
    the same magnetic field that the fighters in EP4 penetrated so very easily
    Right. As previously stated, the shield of the first DS was vulnerable to small fighters. No one is disputing this.

    Quote Originally Posted by OscarB63 View Post
    big ships can't fly through the shields of the DS to hit the ridiculously unstable reactor, the fighters can
    Fixed. Thank you. However, this was only on the first Death Star, it was supposedly corrected on the second Death Star, requiring a different tactic to defeat that time.
    Last edited by theangryamerican; 11-03-10 at 09:32 PM.
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  5. #335
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    Re: Federation v Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by theangryamerican View Post
    I understand that they can make "minor variations" but I'm referring to the logistics of coordinating simultaneous warp jumps with hundreds of Federation starships (I assume they have that many at least) moving on multiple attack vectors, executing hard turns through thousands of tightly grouped Imperial battle formations without dropping to sub-light at all and thereby exposing themselves to return fire. Could they do it it? Possibly. My argument was that since they have never demonstrated that tactic on a large scale under those circumstances before, they'd be unlikely to suddenly change their standard tactics of engagement in favor of something so risky without knowing a lot more about their opponents.

    ...and your source is from TNG, which Goobie has rejected as canon.

    and by the same logic..the empire has never demonstrated the tactic of gathering thousands of Imperial ships into tightly grouped battle formations either.

    as I have said over and over...you can't exclude an action/ability of the Federation on the grounds that it hasn't been demonstrated and then grant the Empire a tactic or ability that hasn't been demonstrated.
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  6. #336
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    Re: Federation v Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by theangryamerican View Post
    Star Destroyers don't require a quirky Scottish mechanic to devise unconventional and effective last-minute solutions to dire problems and tweak their reactor output every few parsecs.
    Nope, and that's one of their problems. It's why 1 A-wing can destroy an entire Star Destroyer. The problem with the SW technology is that there is no redundancy. Hit the critical spot and down it goes. Even the Enterprise could separate out and if you destroyed the bridge, the ship didn't A) Blow up B) Could still be controlled.
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  7. #337
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    Re: Federation v Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by OscarB63 View Post
    and by the same logic..the empire has never demonstrated the tactic of gathering thousands of Imperial ships into tightly grouped battle formations either.
    as I have said over and over...you can't exclude an action/ability of the Federation on the grounds that it hasn't been demonstrated and then grant the Empire a tactic or ability that hasn't been demonstrated.
    Except at the Battle of Hoth and the Battle of Endor... Remember those?

    Tightly formed battle groups. The reason I said thousands was simply on the scale of the entire Imperial fleet against the entire Federation fleet. Let's not make this overtly complicated, eh?
    Last edited by theangryamerican; 11-03-10 at 09:37 PM.
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  8. #338
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    Re: Federation v Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by theangryamerican View Post
    Fixed. Thank you. However, this was only on the first Death Star, it was supposedly corrected on the second Death Star, requiring a different tactic to defeat that time.
    some different tactic.

    DS1 shoot a torpedo down a tunnel and blow the reactor
    DS2 fly a fighter or small ship down a tunnel and blow the reactor

    all the Empire did was make the damn thing bigger so that the rebels could fly a ship into it instead of having to shoota torpedo into it.
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  9. #339
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    Re: Federation v Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by Whovian View Post
    While I fully understand sarcasm, the part I bolded is, in point of fact, exactly what Federation starships do on a continual basis.



    Such minor variations could be planets, stars, ships, etc.
    I wouldn't exactly call a planet a 'minor variation in the density of the interstellar medium.
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  10. #340
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    Re: Federation v Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by theangryamerican View Post
    Prove it, or your argument, at all levels, is laughable.
    I've already given examples of canon showing the ability of Fed ships to fight at FTL against bith FTL and sub-light targets, individually and in groups.
    That's all the proof necessary, sparky.

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