View Poll Results: Which should be taught in school science classes?

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  • Evolution

    80 78.43%
  • Intelligent Design

    1 0.98%
  • Creationism

    0 0%
  • Every theory in this area

    11 10.78%
  • Only these 3 or 2 of these three

    3 2.94%
  • None of these

    4 3.92%
  • Other

    3 2.94%
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Thread: Which should be taught in school science classes?

  1. #271
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    Guy Incognito's Avatar
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    Re: Which should be taught in school science classes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    This is why liberals think Libertarians are so dense: they cannot explain what they are trying to say.
    I explained it already, you just didn't read it. Nice try.

  2. #272
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    Re: Which should be taught in school science classes?

    Quote Originally Posted by ricksfolly View Post
    OK, I'm willing to learn.. You tell me how science theory works, and how it applies to existing scientific claims.

    ricksfolly
    It's not that some famous scientist says something and the rest of us fall in line. Yes, we may pay more heed if it comes from say a Carl Wieman. But even he or Steven Chu, Claude Cohen-Tannoudji or William D. Phillips
    said something outrageous it is not going to be accepted by the scientific community as a whole. We review everything, we require measurements and proof. You were trying to state a reality which isn't real in order to advance some anti-science endeavor which is quiet frankly stupid. Science helps people every single day.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

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  3. #273
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    Re: Which should be taught in school science classes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Incognito View Post
    Seriously, I understand why conservatives think liberals are so dense. It's like you guys don't even read.

    I never said ID should be taught in schools, that is absurd.
    You just said: Just because I want to give ID proponents a fair chance to be heard?

    Well where do you think they want to be heard? It isn't in the scientific forum, they're not even trying to get into scientific peer-reviewed journals, they just want to brainwash impressionable students with their non-scientific nonsense.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

    Blog me! YouTube me! VidMe me!

  4. #274
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    Re: Which should be taught in school science classes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    You just said: Just because I want to give ID proponents a fair chance to be heard?

    Well where do you think they want to be heard? It isn't in the scientific forum, they're not even trying to get into scientific peer-reviewed journals, they just want to brainwash impressionable students with their non-scientific nonsense.
    You're wrong, there are some people who are trying to do real science with ID. Just read the Nagel paper I linked to, he mentions a number of such scientists.

    Does it belong in school? Of course not, no more than the steady state theory does. School is for established science, not fringe science. But fringe science should still be treated as science and given a fair look.

    Instead, all I see is closed mindedness towards ID coming from people who purport to represent the scientific method. If you genuinely support science you don't shoot down ideas before they've been tested.

  5. #275
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    Re: Which should be taught in school science classes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Incognito View Post

    Instead, all I see is closed mindedness towards ID coming from people who purport to represent the scientific method. If you genuinely support science you don't shoot down ideas before they've been tested.
    Who's testing them? And how are they being tested according to the scientific process?

  6. #276
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    Re: Which should be taught in school science classes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Incognito View Post
    You're wrong, there are some people who are trying to do real science with ID. Just read the Nagel paper I linked to, he mentions a number of such scientists.
    It mentioned Michael Behe, who is a complete joke in scientific circles. He's never published a single scientific paper on ID, mostly because there's no science involved. Even his son thinks he's a religious wingnut. Try again.

    Instead, all I see is closed mindedness towards ID coming from people who purport to represent the scientific method. If you genuinely support science you don't shoot down ideas before they've been tested.
    They've been tested, at least as far as they're capable of being tested. They failed. They were discarded. If anyone manages to actually describe ID in a manner which can be genuinely tested, let us know. We won't hold our breath.
    Last edited by Cephus; 10-29-10 at 02:33 AM.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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    Re: Which should be taught in school science classes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    It mentioned Michael Behe, who is a complete joke in scientific circles. He's never published a single scientific paper on ID, mostly because there's no science involved. Even his son thinks he's a religious wingnut. Try again.



    They've been tested, at least as far as they're capable of being tested. They failed. They were discarded. If anyone manages to actually describe ID in a manner which can be genuinely tested, let us know. We won't hold our breath.
    One of my favorite lines from The Social Network was Mark Zuckerberg angrily lashing out at the people suing him for supposedly stealing their idea for Facebook: "Look, if you were going to invent Facebook, you would have invented Facebook."

    Likewise, if proponents of Intelligent Design were going to support ID with science, they would have supported ID with science.

  8. #278
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    Re: Which should be taught in school science classes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Incognito View Post
    Here is a quick quote from Thomas Nagel that might be enlightening:
    Like I said, it's more philosophy at this point. When you try to build a theory of how the earth began and how we came to be, ID is to me a plausible explanation to what I see as gaping holes in the big bang theory. Namely, I do not see the world that we live in coming about by chance because it's not logical. If I told you that the beautiful Ferrari in my garage (since we're being theoretical... ), with paint on the body and a full tank of fuel, just randomly happened as a result of a hurricane that tore through Italy, none of you would believe me.

    The reason I say it philosophical is that there's not likely to be any way to prove or disprove it, ever. I would argue the same is true of the big bang, but I think both should be discussed and used as a way to teach critical thinking and logic. I don't think either of these topics is particularly useful in a grade school science class.

  9. #279
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    Re: Which should be taught in school science classes?

    Quote Originally Posted by marduc View Post
    for every transitional fossil found bridging a gap in the "chain" there are two new missing ones that suddenly appear
    Why is that a problem?
    A screaming comes across the sky.
    It has happened before, but there is nothing to compare it to now.
    Pynchon - Gravity's Rainbow

  10. #280
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    Re: Which should be taught in school science classes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aunt Spiker View Post
    Why is that a problem?
    It's not so much a problem as it is a comment about how those clamoring "where are the transitional fossils?" will never be satisfied. You show them one transitional fossil, and they will shrug it off and start pointing to the two new missing ones the find created and asking where they are.

    Just look at friday through this thread and his goalpost moving, and his insistence on using qualifying words such as "complete" chain as a prime example of what I was referring to with the comment.
    Last edited by marduc; 10-29-10 at 12:42 PM.
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