View Poll Results: Would you support a flat tax system instead of our current progressive one?

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  • Yes

    38 54.29%
  • No

    23 32.86%
  • Maybe

    9 12.86%
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Thread: Flat tax or progressive tax? Which do you prefer?

  1. #111
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    Re: Flat tax or progressive tax? Which do you prefer?

    If an income tax has to exist at all (it should be abolished) a progressive tax would be better than a flat poll tax. A poll tax just punishes the poor and middle class.

  2. #112
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    Re: Flat tax or progressive tax? Which do you prefer?

    Quote Originally Posted by snodog View Post
    I'm in favor of a more progressive tax than we currently have. No one is an island of productivity, totally unreliant on others. Have you made no use of public services such as roads and other infrastructure in making your money? Did you invent all the technology used to produce your product or service? Did you create the trade routes that make one location more productive than another? What gives you the right to keep all this wealth which is not a result of your own labor? If you think you earned it all on your own go to Afghanistan and work your magic.

    The reality is that a welfare state has to exist in order to keep a degree of social order in tact. Without throwing a minimal amount of money at those who are down on their luck, a door is left open for robberies, murder, assault and other personal crimes because of a exceeding amount of social strain in those populations.

    Also the percentage of total income total taxes paid (FICA, Fed. income, state income, property, capital gains, sales taxes, etc.) by the wealthy is less than total taxes paid, as a percentage of income, by the middle class.
    How much do you pay yearly in Federal Income Taxes? It normally is easy to support higher taxes if you are one of the 47% that don't pay any Federal Income taxes.

    Far too many really don't have a clue as to the present tax structure we have and where that money is supposed to go. Your argument is one that I hear a lot from people who really don't understand our taxes and the difference between Federal Income taxes and use taxes like FICA, Excise Taxes, and property taxes. To some it is all the same and that couldn't be further from the truth.

    Right now 47% of the American workers do not pay any Federal Income taxes. They do pay FICA taxes which is Social Security and Medicare. Are you proposing that we should eliminate those taxes as well? Property taxes are local taxes and not Federal going to the schools. Excise taxes are the taxes paid when you buy gasoline and go to the infrastructure such as roads and bridges. Those taxes shouldn't be going into the general fund but do thanks to the Democrats who put those funds on budget back in the late 60's.


    If you truly care about govt. revenue how much extra are you sending each year to the govt. as there is nothing preventing you from doing that?

  3. #113
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    Re: Flat tax or progressive tax? Which do you prefer?

    I don't support a completely flat tax, since it would really hurt people who are living near the poverty line.

    The best solution in my opinion is a flat tax on income above a certain amount.

    For example, if the the poverty level for a family of 4 is $30,000/year and the tax rate is 10%, then there would be a flat tax of 10% on any income a family of 4 made over about 35,000 per year. If you make 40 grand a year, you pay $500 in income tax. If you make 135 grand a year, you pay 10,000 in income tax.

    It's simple, it's fair, and it's just progressive enough that it doesn't hurt the people who are barely getting by as it is.
    If you build a man a fire, he'll be warm for a day.

    If you set a man on fire, he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

  4. #114
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    Re: Flat tax or progressive tax? Which do you prefer?

    Quote Originally Posted by molten_dragon View Post
    I don't support a completely flat tax, since it would really hurt people who are living near the poverty line.

    The best solution in my opinion is a flat tax on income above a certain amount.

    For example, if the the poverty level for a family of 4 is $30,000/year and the tax rate is 10%, then there would be a flat tax of 10% on any income a family of 4 made over about 35,000 per year. If you make 40 grand a year, you pay $500 in income tax. If you make 135 grand a year, you pay 10,000 in income tax.

    It's simple, it's fair, and it's just progressive enough that it doesn't hurt the people who are barely getting by as it is.
    thank you, you are the first person to actually provide a common sense answer to the questions raised. That makes sense to me.

  5. #115
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    Re: Flat tax or progressive tax? Which do you prefer?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    If an income tax has to exist at all (it should be abolished) a progressive tax would be better than a flat poll tax. A poll tax just punishes the poor and middle class.
    What really is punishing the poor and the middle class is the total irresponsibility shown by politicians in D.C. on both sides. Our Founders never envisioned a 3.8 trillion dollar bloated Federal govt. riddled with waste, fraud, and abuse. Our Founders understand that power corrupts and that is why they put the power with the people at the state level. They wanted a small central govt. and it is amazing to me that far too many Americans continue to buy the rhetoric and support all the spending that Congress generates not realizing that it is being done by a bureaucrat in D.C. yet designed to help people hundreds or thousands of miles away. Much of what Congress spends should be a state and local issue not a Federal Taxpayer issue. If taxpayers appropriated money for exactly what our Founders envisioned we would have a budget of less than 2 trillion instead of 3.8 trillion and growing.

  6. #116
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    Re: Flat tax or progressive tax? Which do you prefer?

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    What really is punishing the poor and the middle class is the total irresponsibility shown by politicians in D.C. on both sides. Our Founders never envisioned a 3.8 trillion dollar bloated Federal govt. riddled with waste, fraud, and abuse. Our Founders understand that power corrupts and that is why they put the power with the people at the state level. They wanted a small central govt. and it is amazing to me that far too many Americans continue to buy the rhetoric and support all the spending that Congress generates not realizing that it is being done by a bureaucrat in D.C. yet designed to help people hundreds or thousands of miles away. Much of what Congress spends should be a state and local issue not a Federal Taxpayer issue. If taxpayers appropriated money for exactly what our Founders envisioned we would have a budget of less than 2 trillion instead of 3.8 trillion and growing.
    Do you have any figures I can see to back that up? Don't really care, just wondering.

  7. #117
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    Re: Flat tax or progressive tax? Which do you prefer?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    Do you have any figures I can see to back that up? Don't really care, just wondering.
    You mean figures like the Budget of the United States?

    Current Report: Combined Statement of Receipts, Outlays, and Balances of the United States Government (Combined Statement): Publications & Guidance: Financial Management Service

  8. #118
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    Re: Flat tax or progressive tax? Which do you prefer?

    No...

    If taxpayers appropriated money for exactly what our Founders envisioned we would have a budget of less than 2 trillion instead of 3.8 trillion and growing.
    How do you get the 2 trillion figuring what the founders intended.

    Either it is a guess, or you based it on some kind of comparative statistic that can be verified. Before I comment on your response to me, I want to see if it is fact or fiction and reply accordingly.

  9. #119
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    Re: Flat tax or progressive tax? Which do you prefer?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    No...



    How do you get the 2 trillion figuring what the founders intended.

    Either it is a guess, or you based it on some kind of comparative statistic that can be verified. Before I comment on your response to me, I want to see if it is fact or fiction and reply accordingly.
    Take the Budget of the U.S. the link I gave you that shows line items and then plug in the items that our Constitution requires from our Govt, defense, small central govt. expense, debt service, V.A. affairs and see what you come up with?


    From the Budget, this is what I come up with as categories that should be funded by Federal Income Taxes

    Defense 662.8
    Gen. Science, Space 29.9
    Commerce 292.5
    Transportation 84.4
    Health 334.3
    Veterans Benefits 95.5
    Justice 53.4
    General Govt. 118
    Net Interest 190.9


    Total 1861.7
    Last edited by Conservative; 10-23-10 at 02:40 PM.

  10. #120
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    Re: Flat tax or progressive tax? Which do you prefer?

    Quote Originally Posted by snodog View Post
    I'm in favor of a more progressive tax than we currently have. No one is an island of productivity, totally unreliant on others. Have you made no use of public services such as roads and other infrastructure in making your money? Did you invent all the technology used to produce your product or service? Did you create the trade routes that make one location more productive than another? What gives you the right to keep all this wealth which is not a result of your own labor? If you think you earned it all on your own go to Afghanistan and work your magic.

    The reality is that a welfare state has to exist in order to keep a degree of social order in tact. Without throwing a minimal amount of money at those who are down on their luck, a door is left open for robberies, murder, assault and other personal crimes because of a exceeding amount of social strain in those populations.

    Also the percentage of total income total taxes paid (FICA, Fed. income, state income, property, capital gains, sales taxes, etc.) by the wealthy is less than total taxes paid, as a percentage of income, by the middle class.
    wrong-and the rich pay far more than they use. that is the main issue

    what skews the statistics is that the top 400 taxpayers, the billionaires, have most of their income in capital gains or dividends not salary. Most of the top 2% have substantial salary income which is taxed rather high



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