View Poll Results: Would you support a flat tax system instead of our current progressive one?

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  • Yes

    38 54.29%
  • No

    23 32.86%
  • Maybe

    9 12.86%
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Thread: Flat tax or progressive tax? Which do you prefer?

  1. #91
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    Re: Flat tax or progressive tax? Which do you prefer?

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    I think the Taliban has taught us that.
    I particularly love the way the Taliban treats women, don't you?

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    Re: Flat tax or progressive tax? Which do you prefer?

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    I particularly love the way the Taliban treats women, don't you?


    No..........

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    Re: Flat tax or progressive tax? Which do you prefer?

    Quote Originally Posted by samsmart View Post
    I'm against a flat tax. A national sales tax simply won't raise enough tax revenue needed to pay for all the government expenditures required of the United States as a world superpower.
    two different things.

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    Re: Flat tax or progressive tax? Which do you prefer?

    Quote Originally Posted by samsmart View Post
    I didn't mean just defense spending. I also meant health care spending, infrastructure spending, spending on education at the elementary, high school, and collegel and university levels, spending for business inititatives, spending for scientific research, spending on farm subsidies, and that doesn't include law enforcement on the federal level either.

    There's more to being a superpower than just having a strong military.
    actually the FairTax people have done some pretty good work demonstrating that their tax proposal would be revenue neutral. i have seen 'debunking' attempts done, and several studies are usually cited which measure a sales tax on only certain goods, as opposed to all goods at the retail level.

    if i may suggest a study of the matter

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    Re: Flat tax or progressive tax? Which do you prefer?

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    I disagree. If they weren't there, someone else would take their place
    no, they would not. as much as we have of it, wealth is finite. if they removed their wealth (money) from investments, then investments in our economy would go down by a corresponding amount, and productivity would decrease accordingly.

    the only entity about which this argument can be made is government, because government (rightly speaking), does not have it's own wealth; it simply has others' wealth which it appropriates through taxation; and had it not taxed or borrowed those funds they would still be in the economy.

    There is nothing special about them. Its the resource they control that's important.
    there's nothing special about workers; it's the labour and their thought processes which are important.

    but there is, in fact, something special about the rich.

    namely, they are mostly small-business owners; which provide most of the new jobs in this economy, and much of the innovation as well. the rich are generally superior in their benefits to the rest of us (whom they employ) in society.

    Multiple ways. One can become wealthy by being born with advantages, winning the lottery, winning a lawsuit, being successful in a business, etc
    okay, you're going far too broad there.

    specifically, one makes profit by generating a better profit at more convenience for lower prices than the competition; in other words; one makes profit by helping people. Wal-Mart, for example, saves the average poor family thousands of dollars a year; which is why they are so very successful. it is nearly impossible to make money (outside of outright theft) in today's economy without benefiting others.

    However, you are ignoring a very important point. Society is far more than economics.
    yes, but economics are what we are currently discussing; specifically, taxation, and what taxation funds.

    There are cultural, socialist, artistic, familial, leadership, political, moral, and probably other influences that build our society as well.
    not sure how "socialist" influences are supposed to be benificial. however, when you get into non-economic societal influences, that is where you typically find the rich overrepresented as well.

    By only talking about wealth, you are not giving the full picture of what I am talking about. So, you can argue economics all you want, but it really doesn't mean much as everything works to set the stage where people can prosper in this society.
    appealing to subjective standards in order to win an objective argument isn't much of a stance.

  6. #96
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    Re: Flat tax or progressive tax? Which do you prefer?

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    How much of what you listed here is state, local, or private business responsibility? you think funding healthcare is a Federal taxpayer responsibility or a local and state responsibility? How about education, aren't schools funded by local property taxes and not federal income taxes? Much of what you have listed really has nothing to do with being a world super power as we have been a world super power for decades now without most of what you have listed.
    These past decades we haven't had any federal dollars pay for Medicare or Medicaid? These past decades we haven't had any federal dollars pay to build, maintain, and expand the Interstate Highway System? These past decades we haven't had federal dollars invested in the public education system? Or in the public college system? Or in universities? Research into the internet hasn't led to a more educated population, which we use in various ways to maintain our position as a power on the world stage? Hasn't the infrastructure for high-speed internet been paid for by the federal government?

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    Re: Flat tax or progressive tax? Which do you prefer?

    Quote Originally Posted by samsmart View Post
    These past decades we haven't had any federal dollars pay for Medicare or Medicaid? These past decades we haven't had any federal dollars pay to build, maintain, and expand the Interstate Highway System? These past decades we haven't had federal dollars invested in the public education system? Or in the public college system? Or in universities? Research into the internet hasn't led to a more educated population, which we use in various ways to maintain our position as a power on the world stage? Hasn't the infrastructure for high-speed internet been paid for by the federal government?
    Where are you getting your information? Medicare is paid for on every paycheck, Medicaid is a state program!

    Every time you buy a gallon of gasoline you pay federal and state excise taxes of around 70 cents a gallon that is supposed to go for highways and bridges.

    Federal Dollars were never supposed to go to the state school systems so where did you believe that education was a Federal issue?

    Sounds to me like you buy a lot of rhetoric and don't do a lot of research. Where are you getting this information?

    The United States has been a world power for decades without the kind of federal spending we have today so why now, why do you want to federalize state and local issues?

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    Re: Flat tax or progressive tax? Which do you prefer?

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Again, you are hanging your entire argument on tax rates and not dollars collected. Fact is the Rich are paying a lower rate but higher dollars today under the Bush tax cuts and that is reality.
    no, I'm not. You just have that fixated in your head and are not following what is being placed before you.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Flat tax or progressive tax? Which do you prefer?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    no, I'm not. You just have that fixated in your head and are not following what is being placed before you.
    I have a very good idea what is being placed before me especially by you. The fact remains that it is the taxpayer's money before it goes to the govt. and tax cuts are not an expense to the govt.

    Further the fact remains that according to the IRS the rich are paying more in actual dollars now in taxes with the Bush tax cuts therefore destroying the liberal argument that the rich benefited from the lower rates. Also the number of lower income individuals not paying taxes has increased AFTER the Bush tax cuts.

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    Re: Flat tax or progressive tax? Which do you prefer?

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    I have a very good idea what is being placed before me especially by you. The fact remains that it is the taxpayer's money before it goes to the govt. and tax cuts are not an expense to the govt.

    Further the fact remains that according to the IRS the rich are paying more in actual dollars now in taxes with the Bush tax cuts therefore destroying the liberal argument that the rich benefited from the lower rates. Also the number of lower income individuals not paying taxes has increased AFTER the Bush tax cuts.
    I actually wish you did. I really do. But you have completely skipped the point of what was posted.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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