View Poll Results: Was CVS Pharmacy right or wrong?

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Thread: Was CVS Pharmacy right or wrong?

  1. #171
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    Re: Was CVS Pharmacy right or wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by Phoenix View Post
    It was wrong for her not to get the medicine over a dollar. I agree with the sentiment that it falls on the clerk at the time.
    Why does it fall on the clerk? He doesn't set prices at the store. He doesn't make policy there. And he probably doesn't make that much working there, but jobs are scarce right now. And if he sells a product for less than it's price, that's grounds to be fired. So why should he risk his own well-being when he has to make a living too? And what makes you think the clerk has any money? If all a girl who suffers asthma attacks AND her boyfriend have is a $20 bill, it's just as likely the clerk is broke himself.

  2. #172
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    Re: Was CVS Pharmacy right or wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by samsmart View Post
    Do you support the nationalization of health care to ensure that profits have nothing to do with medicine? YES So do you support the more unionization of labor in order to guarantee safe working conditions in all industries? YES Do you support the doling out of housing and shelter despite people's ability to pay? yes, with tight limitations How about instead of having supermarkets we have the government run them and everybody is given a food cardaka food stamps to ensure they have enough to eat. How much of that do you support, and how often do you vote that way? seldom if ever
    Obvious where you are going with this. We must acknowledge that man has failed in these areas.
    My voting yes or no on these matters means nothing. These programs(public housing, food stamps, free clinics, unions, government programs have been in plave for a very long time....But they do need improvements, reform, change, if we are ever going to have a better society.
    The reality is, we have socialism, and its a good thing.

  3. #173
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    Re: Was CVS Pharmacy right or wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by samsmart View Post
    Why does it fall on the clerk? He doesn't set prices at the store. He doesn't make policy there. but he should have a voice And he probably doesn't make that much working there, but jobs are scarce right now. And if he sells a product for less than it's price, that's grounds to be fired.What should he do, watch a human die or risk being fired? Does anyone see anything wrong here? So why should he risk his own well-being when he has to make a living too? And what makes you think the clerk has any money? If all a girl who suffers asthma attacks AND her boyfriend have is a $20 bill, it's just as likely the clerk is broke himself.
    Are managers mythical?
    Thanks to our sensationalist based media, is the truth so evasive?

  4. #174
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    Re: Was CVS Pharmacy right or wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by samsmart View Post
    Why does it fall on the clerk? He doesn't set prices at the store. He doesn't make policy there. And he probably doesn't make that much working there, but jobs are scarce right now. And if he sells a product for less than it's price, that's grounds to be fired. So why should he risk his own well-being when he has to make a living too? And what makes you think the clerk has any money?
    I have already addressed what if he didn't have any money. Cash drawers come up a buck short / buck over all the time. Just from general counting errors over the course of a day. His job is not worth her life. It's a moral call by an individual. You are right that he doesn't set store policy but he is in complete control of his own decisions. At the end of the day he can walk away and know he kept a woman from dying vs the possibility that she died over his paycheck.

    Quote Originally Posted by samsmart View Post
    If all a girl who suffers asthma attacks AND her boyfriend have is a $20 bill, it's just as likely the clerk is broke himself.
    This statement has NO basis at all.
    From the ashes.

  5. #175
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    Re: Was CVS Pharmacy right or wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by samsmart View Post
    Personally, you're allowed to do that. However, they aren't compelled to do that. So the clerks still did nothing wrong.
    Dumb move... I might have fired the clerk for lack of common sense and compassion.

    .
    The Clintons are what happens...
    when you have NO MORAL COMPASS.

  6. #176
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    Re: Was CVS Pharmacy right or wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by samsmart View Post
    So you want to punish the clerk even though she did nothing illegal and you admit that no legislation would cover the situation anyway and it is through such laws that we address such things?
    This is funny.. I don't really want to "punish" the clerk, and I didn't use that word. I think something should be done, and there should be consequences for her behaviour. It isn't my place though. It's CVS's place to create that consequence and I think they should for good business practices and for PR purposes.

    People "punish" there children all the time for things are not illegal.. and so do businesses. Being late to work isn't illegal and yet people lose their jobs for it.

  7. #177
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    Re: Was CVS Pharmacy right or wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by samsmart View Post
    Why does it fall on the clerk? He doesn't set prices at the store. He doesn't make policy there. And he probably doesn't make that much working there, but jobs are scarce right now. And if he sells a product for less than it's price, that's grounds to be fired. So why should he risk his own well-being when he has to make a living too? And what makes you think the clerk has any money? If all a girl who suffers asthma attacks AND her boyfriend have is a $20 bill, it's just as likely the clerk is broke himself.
    It falls on the clerk because it's a question of individual choice, not economic structure. You can't morally justify these actions to me. If as a society we start morally justifying this behaviour and people start dying in pharmacies then the government would get involved with regulations.

    If people act responsibly and are responsible for themselves then government wouldn't get involved. The minute somebody's child or family member dies because of this, their attitude would shift. A capitalistic structure doesn't even justify this individual behavior. If I were this girl and this was happening to me.. and say, I died... my boyfriend would have jerked that clerk over the count and there would have blood on the floor.

    There doesn't have to legal consequences.... there are natural consequences, and those natural consequences could be anything from violent confrontation to consumer backlash. And IF I did die in this manner, I know my family would be taking somebody to court.

    And if he sells a product for less than it's price, that's grounds to be fired.


    That can't be proven. I have sold service products for less where I work and I don't get in trouble. My boss is fine if I lower prices to get more clients and not lose potentials, because she doesn't want to lose them to competition. It's a competitive practice and my boss is a franchisee. And if I ever lowered cost too much, she would take it out of my pay check... but that has never happened.

    And if this clerk was fired for selling them an inhaler for a dollar less... I guarantee he would get his job back due to a public backlash. I have heard stories like this many times. Once a man charged couples 1,000 up front for wedding services, but in one case the bride died.. ironically of an asthma attack. When he refused to repay the groom their 1,000 and the story hit the press, he was eventually pressured into doing otherwise because of consumer and public backlash.

    The private market isn't all about profit margins and trying to get the largest possible.. It also involves PR, successful competition, and retaining talented employees. Just look at commercials done for the big oil companies.. it's all PR, not much price competition in the commercials.

    If this clerk was valuable to CVS because of work productivity, CVS wouldn't easily get rid of him. If the clerk was lazy and unproductive, then he is more likely to be fired at the drop of a hat.
    Last edited by SheWolf; 10-17-10 at 02:03 PM.

  8. #178
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    Re: Was CVS Pharmacy right or wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by zimmer View Post
    Dumb move... I might have fired the clerk for lack of common sense and compassion.

    .
    Exactly, it could go either way. It depends on management. If it were me, I go off on this employee and I would create an ethics code for future reference. I would also want crisis training for my clerks.

    One problem I have that isn't being discussed is that instead of immediately calling the paramedics, the clerk seems to have argued with the couple.

    I might even go as far to fire this employee if they argued with me... (I didn't do anything wrong!!).. and I thought it was going to always be a problem.

  9. #179
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    Re: Was CVS Pharmacy right or wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by Phoenix View Post
    I have already addressed what if he didn't have any money. Cash drawers come up a buck short / buck over all the time. Just from general counting errors over the course of a day.
    Yeah, and if it happens too much, it's grounds for them to get fired. We don't know how often that clerk has gotten shortchanged, and every cent short is a cent that doesn't go to the store owner, which means it's grounds for getting fired since the store isn't making as much of a profit that's expected of it.

    Cash drawers come up a buck short all the time, you're right. But employees get fired for minor reasons just as often.

    Quote Originally Posted by Phoenix View Post
    His job is not worth her life. It's a moral call by an individual. You are right that he doesn't set store policy but he is in complete control of his own decisions. At the end of the day he can walk away and know he kept a woman from dying vs the possibility that she died over his paycheck.
    If it's a moral call by an individual then why are you coming down on the call he made? He is in complete control of his own decisions, but he's not in complete control of the decisions of others such as 1) will he get fired for selling a product at a loss 2) the fact that a girl with asthma didn't have enough foresight to carry enough money to purchase medication. You want to blame the clerk for his decision but put no responsibility on the asthma sufferer for her decision, nor any responsibility on American society as a whole for being capitalistic.


    Quote Originally Posted by Phoenix View Post
    This statement has NO basis at all.
    Well everybody is saying how the clerk should have paid in that dollar. How do you know how much money he had in his wallet at that time? Maybe he didn't have any money.

  10. #180
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    Re: Was CVS Pharmacy right or wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by SheWolf View Post
    It falls on the clerk because it's a question of individual choice, not economic structure.
    You say that it's a question of individual choice. And yet when he makes a choice, you want to punish him for it.

    So it's not really a matter of individual choice for you, but rather a matter of punishing someone who wasn't compelled to make the choice you wanted him to make.

    It is too a matter of economic structure. In our capitalistic society, if you are able to pay for a good or service you are able to acquire it. If you are not able to pay for a good or service you are not allowed to acquire it. It's as simple as that. It is also not my fault that our society is that way.

    Quote Originally Posted by SheWolf View Post
    You can't morally justify these actions to me. If as a society we start morally justifying this behaviour and people start dying in pharmacies then the government would get involved with regulations.
    So, again, you are against people behaving in a certain way but you don't want to use laws to regulate that behavior. If it's not worth making a law about then it's not worth punishing the people who pursue that behavior.

    So either you don't want to enact a law, which means this clerk was in the right, or you do want to enact a law in order to prohibit his behavior. Which is it?

    Quote Originally Posted by SheWolf View Post
    If people act responsibly and are responsible for themselves then government wouldn't get involved.
    You're right. If the girl and her boyfriend acted responsibly for themselves and carried enough money to deal with emergencies for their own medical conditions, they wouldn't be trying to put the blame on a clerk or a store for their lack of responsibility.

    Quote Originally Posted by SheWolf View Post
    The minute somebody's child or family member dies because of this, their attitude would shift. A capitalistic structure doesn't even justify this individual behavior. If I were this girl and this was happening to me.. and say, I died... my boyfriend would have jerked that clerk over the count and there would have blood on the floor.
    Yeah, and then that clerk would be able to file assault charges on the boyfriend. It's not the clerk's fault the store fixes the price of the inhaler. It's not the clerk's fault we live in a capitalistic society. To punish him for it would be totally unfair.

    Quote Originally Posted by SheWolf View Post
    There doesn't have to legal consequences.... there are natural consequences, and those natural consequences could be anything from violent confrontation to consumer backlash. And IF I did die in this manner, I know my family would be taking somebody to court.
    So at first you say how the clerk is in the moral wrong for not being charitable, but then you say violent backlash is justified when someone doesn't act charitable. So then you go from the moral right of charity to moral-induced extortion. "Be nice, or I'll punch your face in." How is that morally justified?

    There may be consumer backlash, yes. But that is not the job for the clerk to deal with - that is the job for the manager. And that depends on what kind of manager he is. I've worked with great bosses and I've worked with asshole bosses. Some asshole bosses don't care about consumer backlash. But that is not the clerk's fault, as his job is to do what the boss tells him or risk getting fired.

    You say that there doesn't have to be legal consequences, but then you mentioned that if this happened to you and you died your family would take someone to court. So you've just contradicted yourself. So which is it? Should their be legal consequences regarding these things or shouldn't there? What should be the guidelines for those legalities?

    Quote Originally Posted by SheWolf View Post
    And if he sells a product for less than it's price, that's grounds to be fired.


    That can't be proven. I have sold service products for less where I work and I don't get in trouble. My boss is fine if I lower prices to get more clients and not lose potentials, because she doesn't want to lose them to competition. It's a competitive practice and my boss is a franchisee. And if I ever lowered cost too much, she would take it out of my pay check... but that has never happened.
    And I've worked for bosses who haven't given me the authority to change prices on the products sold. If I tried that, I would get a dressing down and have one more mark made against me to get fired. Considering the bills I have to pay, I wouldn't risk it after that.

    Quote Originally Posted by SheWolf View Post
    And if this clerk was fired for selling them an inhaler for a dollar less... I guarantee he would get his job back due to a public backlash. I have heard stories like this many times. Once a man charged couples 1,000 up front for wedding services, but in one case the bride died.. ironically of an asthma attack. When he refused to repay the groom their 1,000 and the story hit the press, he was eventually pressured into doing otherwise because of consumer and public backlash.
    Until the public forgets about the whole incident, in which he can be fired nice and quietly, without the public backlash.

    Quote Originally Posted by SheWolf View Post
    The private market isn't all about profit margins and trying to get the largest possible.. It also involves PR, successful competition, and retaining talented employees. Just look at commercials done for the big oil companies.. it's all PR, not much price competition in the commercials.
    Look at the commercials for BP, and then do in-depth research about what they're really to address oil spill victims. It's not pretty.

    Quote Originally Posted by SheWolf View Post
    If this clerk was valuable to CVS because of work productivity, CVS wouldn't easily get rid of him. If the clerk was lazy and unproductive, then he is more likely to be fired at the drop of a hat.
    But you didn't say that he should stay hired or be fired because of productivity. You said he should be fired because of this one incident. So according to you, and many others, it doesn't matter what his employee history is - is you want him punished for this one event.

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